Madeleine McCann 3 year old missing in Portugal - Part 11

[englishleigh]

Maybe I missed this but where does it state that the friends of the Mccanns had a "Pack of Silence". My understanding the pack of silence is because the police don't want them to talk and keep things quiet. Also the one friend I think it was Matt said everything should go through Gerry we made that promise.

I'm just not sure where the "Pack of Silence" came from.

Actually, it is "PACT of silence"...not "pack"....and I think the very fact that they agreed everything would go through Gerry could be considered a "pact"... A "pact" is a promise or agreement, so it implies much more than the word "pack", which just sounds like they were huddling in a pack together being quiet...which they have been, I suppose, but a pact implies an agreed-upon promise they would be silent about ratting each other out or saying anything that could be considered incriminating.

I don't remember where it was said they had agreed to a pact of silence but I believe they did. Colomom and CaliKid will know where it was said/reported first.

 

[Brefie]

wtsn5 - 'Pact of Silence' is a term I may have picked up from here or from news reports, but my understanding is the same as yours - they are not allowed to discuss the case, so I don't understand why some people think it's a conspiracy among the tapas 9 and that they have something sinister to hide.

Additionally, if this had happened to one of my friends, you can bet your bottom dollar that I would NOT be talking to reporters unless they SPECIFICALLY asked me to. I mean, look at the tabloids. See how they SPIN everything?? These people are saying nothing and they are STILL getting crucified.

I see this as damned if you, damned if you don't.

 

[colomom]

Maybe I missed this but where does it state that the friends of the Mccanns had a "Pack of Silence". My understanding the pack of silence is because the police don't want them to talk and keep things quiet. Also the one friend I think it was Matt said everything should go through Gerry we made that promise.

I'm just not sure where the "Pack of Silence" came from.

You can read the article here:

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1903

It was originally published:

Sol, on June 30, 2007
an article by Felicia Cabrita and Margarida Davim

Madeleine Case
Pact of Silence

 

[colomom]

wtsn5 - 'Pact of Silence' is a term I may have picked up from here or from news reports, but my understanding is the same as yours - they are not allowed to discuss the case, so I don't understand why some people think it's a conspiracy among the tapas 9 and that they have something sinister to hide.

Additionally, if this had happened to one of my friends, you can bet your bottom dollar that I would NOT be talking to reporters unless they SPECIFICALLY asked me to. I mean, look at the tabloids. See how they SPIN everything?? These people are saying nothing and they are STILL getting crucified.

I see this as damned if you, damned if you don't.

In the report I mentioned above (see: http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1903) the Sol reported:

Gerry and Kate’s friends, who are interrogated tightly by the PJ over almost a month, refuse to clarify this contradiction, when asked by Sol. “We have a pact. This is our matter only. It is nobody else’s business”, says David Payne, another element with the group. Minutes after we tried to contact Kate, Gerry, in a fury, calls the Sol journalist: “What do you think you are doing? Do you think you’re better than the portuguese police? I’m going to forward your contact to PJ and you will have to explain yourselves”.

It might have been better for them to respond "no comment".

 

[Brefie]

In the report I mentioned above the Sol reported:

Gerry and Kate’s friends, who are interrogated tightly by the PJ over almost a month, refuse to clarify this contradiction, when asked by Sol. “We have a pact. This is our matter only. It is nobody else’s business”, says David Payne, another element with the group. Minutes after we tried to contact Kate, Gerry, in a fury, calls the Sol journalist: “What do you think you are doing? Do you think you’re better than the portuguese police? I’m going to forward your contact to PJ and you will have to explain yourselves”.

It might have ben better for them to respond "no comment".

Why? It just seems to me that he was protecting the investigation. The Portuguese police say they should not not discuss the case and Gerry is passionately trying to not have the investigation compromised. He states immediately that he is going to the police because a reporter is trying to get people to talk when they shouldn't.

I would find it very hard to simply say 'no comment' if a reporter tried to undermine the investigation of my missing daughter.

 

[colomom]

this morning in Correio da Manha:

http://www.correiomanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=254898&idselect=181&idCanal=181&p=0

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=19 post #270)

Deposition: Child cried for her father
Maddie yelled for her father

The McCanns’ neighbour in the Ocean Club apartment was heard on Monday by Policia Judiciaria and confirmed she heard Maddie crying for her father the day before she disappeared. Pamela Fenn, 70, had been inquired at the beginning of the investigation, but the day before yesterday she made a more precise deposition about the details of what she heard and the conversation she held with the girl’s mother on the night that she vanished.

In the deposition that was made at PJ in Portimao, which has been functioning as the headquarters of the investigation, Pamela Fenn confirmed she had made herself available to contact police authorities, although Kate McCann dismissed that offer saying the alert had been made. The crossing of the time at which this conversation took place with the record of the alert to GNR is one of the important elements for the reconstitution of what happened during those moments.

The date for the deposition was scheduled with the witness in order to avoid pressure from the media. The interrogation was scheduled for yesterday, but was then anticipated on the last few days and kept secret. Even yesterday, Olegario Sousa, the PJ’s spokesman, assured he could not confirm the diligence, while a few days earlier he had denied it completely.

PJ now continues to work on the collection of all the information that will allow them to reconstruct the facts and to validate them with the versions that were given by the McCann couple and their entire group of friends.

The reconstitution of what happened on the day of May 3 in the Ocean Club, within that group of English citizens, is the most important line, but PJ is also investigating the past of all of them, with the objective of tracing their profiles, and to manage to get closer to the crime’s motive.

For that, they have been counting on collaboration from the English police, but there are still details that the PJ would rather investigate on their own means. The professional and personal past of all of them is still being crossed intensely, but has failed to produce significant results until now, even more because distance and language differences don’t help the complete collection of information.

At this stage, the investigation continues to be centered on the results from biological samples that were collected in the apartment and in the cars that were used by the English family’s friends.

The deadline that was given by forensic specialists in Birmingham to Policia Judiciaria, to conclude the tests, was of 6 to 14 days, but yesterday the fifteenth day passed and no communication was made from London to Lisbon. These results are decisive to determine the course of an investigation in which all scenarios are still open, but the line that is being followed more intensely is the possibility that the girl was killed on the evening of May 3, inside the apartment that she shared with her parents and her two-year-old twin siblings, as the English dogs have indicated.

(the rest of the article is about PJ denying there is a British suspect, about Russell O’Brien defending his reputation, that the results from Birmingham are late, and that the McCanns were visited by the brother of Ken Bigley)

 

[colomom]

this morning in Correio da Manha:

http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=254899&idselect=93&idCanal=93&p=200

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=18 post #269

OPINION

Tension

The police’s silence is becoming deafening. The media have made such an amount of noise around the Madeleine case that, even admitting that half of the news is false or puffed up, there are no huge doubts left that something with a big impact is about to happen.

Even because, as I said, the police’s silence is a kind of speech. What does PJ tell us with this silence? I admit I may be evaluating this in the wrong way, but my experience tells me that, when a big case is nearing its conclusion, or at least a clarification, nobody speaks, or feels like speaking. Tension and concentration increase as the path of clues is drawn out, pointing solidly into a direction, and the ones who are investigating want nothing apart from following it definitely until the end. Talking is the least they want to do.

On the other hand, it must be said that this case has been exemplary in terms of respect for judicial secrecy. We’ve heard of no abuses that might compromise the investigation. After all, it is not that easy to preserve that procedural instrument. The tension rises, that is certain. Even more the speculation. But it’s worthwhile if, at the end of the path, the mystery is solved.

Moita Flores, Criminologist

 

[colomom]

this morning in 24Horas:

http://www.24horasnewspaper.com/mostranews.php?id=7131

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=18 post # 267

PJ wants McCanns in Portugal

PJ doesn’t want Madeleine’s parents to return to England. And they’ve told them so. A source from the Judiciaria who was contacted by 24Horas explained that “at a time when the investigation has changed its course, pointing at the possible death of the child, it’s strange that they decide to abandon Portugal”.

According to the same source, PJ contacted the McCanns and even told them that “public opinion itself would see their return as a hardly understandable attitude”.

Two weeks ago, for the first time, Judiciaria admitted that Madeleine’s death was probable, assuming that this hypothesis was being “investigated more intensely”.

This source, who is connected to the investigation, referred that “when there is news about the alleged suspicions on the couple, that attitude would not be understood”.

Yet, it guarantees that “at this moment those news are baseless and there are no suspicions” on Kate and Gerry McCann. “They can go to England if they want”.

Justine McGuinness, Madeleine’s parents’ public relations, didn’t want to confirm that the couple was pressured by Judiciaria. But she admitted “there are direct communication lines between the McCanns and the authorities”.

McGuinnes also stated that “Kate and Gerry have made no decision to abandon Portugal and news that say otherwise are only speculation”.

Last week, in an interview to a regional English newspaper, Kate McCann revealed that the couple “was considering the possibility to abandon Portugal”.

PJ continues to center the investigation on apartment 5-A of the Ocean Club, where Madeleine disappeared. There lies the key to the case, investigators believe.

 

[Brefie]

Wow, Colomom...thanks for the info

 

[colomom]

TELEPHONE INTERVIEW WITH EL MUNDO

“Kate and Gerry McCann: 'The possibility that Maddie is alive and in Spain is real"

Updated on Wednesday 22/08/2007 11:09
EL MUNDO

MADRID.- 111 days ago small Maddie disappeared from the room where she was sleeping in the Portuguese Algarve.
In order to find her, her parents have travelled around half the world. They are now centring on Spain because they believe their daughter could be in our country. This is part of the interview with Silvia Taulés.

Question. What is your motive for now requesting an interview in Spain?
Gerry McCann. For us nothing has changed during the last 2 weeks. There is a very real possibility that Madeleine is alive and we want the police to search for her.

Question. Are you thinking of returning to Spain?
G. We have always been interested in Spain because of its proximity to Portugal. We have always received much support from the Spanish. They have treated Madeleine’s disappearance as if she were a Spanish girl. We will not give big conferences because we have already done this, but we will keep on putting pressure on Spain to find our daughter. All that we do is to mark out an objective for ourselves and to know how we can be helped in finding Madeleine. They talk of the proximity of Spain and Portugal and of the possibility that Madeleine is alive. “If someone had a car, it is obvious that they could have crossed to Spain. There is no border control”.
G. The possibility that M is alive and in Spain is real. It is something that we considered at the beginning but know we are seriously thinking about it. The border between the two countries is very long. There is no border control and nobody closed the border on the night M disappeared.

Question. The Portuguese and British police forces are working together. You say that the Spanish police are also helping in the search. Have you been given any correct information to suggest that M may be in Spain?
Kate McCann. Certainly the Spanish police are working on the investigation and when we went to Madrid we were given strength to go on. They can explain what they are doing.
G. You would have to obtain an official response from the Spanish police. They are involved in the investigation, but I cannot tell you what they are working on, they would have to say officially. You would have to obtain an official comment from the Spanish police.

Question. Some information indicate that a robbery may have been attempted, that someone might have entered the apartment to steal. This includes the witness statement from your neighbour who claimed to have seen someone hanging around the Ocean Club. What do you think?
G. Again. These are wild speculations . The police have always told us that they are considering all possible scenarios. And the craziest thing in all that has happened during the last 2 or 3 weeks is that nothing in the investigation has changed. Therefore we keep believing that there is a real opportunity to find Madeleine alive. And we will keep on looking for our daughter because we need to find her.

Question . Mention has been made of your closest circle, the friends who dined with you. After what happened, can you trust anyone?
G. We know the police have to investigate all possibilities. But we would like to make it very clear: we do not have the slightest doubt, we totally trust in our friends..

Question. This is hard, but can you imagine never finding her?
G. We have learned much about missing children and the percentage that has never re-appeared is very small. It is obvious that a very long time has passed, but we will make sure that Madeleine is not converted into a statistic.

(from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.co...eral&action=display&thread=1187388920&page=25 post #356)

 

[colomom]

Wow, Colomom...thanks for the info

You are very welcome....

 

[Brefie]

I have always had a feeling that she will be found alive and well....have NOTHING to base that on, but I hope to God I am right.

 

[colomom]

Why? It just seems to me that he was protecting the investigation. The Portuguese police say they should not not discuss the case and Gerry is passionately trying to not have the investigation compromised. He states immediately that he is going to the police because a reporter is trying to get people to talk when they shouldn't.

I would find it very hard to simply say 'no comment' if a reporter tried to undermine the investigation of my missing daughter.

With all due respect Brefie...

The comment about the "pact" was made by David Payne.

Gerry threatened the reporter.

IMHO, telling a reporter to "mind your own business" or "I am going to report you to the police" is akin to running from a pit bull!!

While I might call the police after telling the reporter "no comment" or saying nothing at all, I would be more concerned that the reporter might use my words against me, thereby possibly undermining the investigation, so I would not engage the press. We all know how they love to embellish

In this case it would be even more important not to speak to the press considering the request by the PJ that they not discuss the case.

 

[Jdee]

Actually, it is "PACT of silence"...not "pack"....and I think the very fact that they agreed everything would go through Gerry could be considered a "pact"... A "pact" is a promise or agreement, so it implies much more than the word "pack", which just sounds like they were huddling in a pack together being quiet...which they have been, I suppose, but a pact implies an agreed-upon promise they would be silent about ratting each other out or saying anything that could be considered incriminating.

I don't remember where it was said they had agreed to a pact of silence but I believe they did. Colomom and CaliKid will know where it was said/reported first.

It was in a Sky News article. It was posted here in one of our many threads. Colomom or Cali could probably unearth it though!

 

[colomom]

TELEPHONE INTERVIEW WITH EL MUNDO

“Kate and Gerry McCann: 'The possibility that Maddie is alive and in Spain is real"

Updated on Wednesday 22/08/2007 11:09
EL MUNDO

There is some discussion on the Proboards79 regarding this telephone interview. Some are expressing real concerns at how this appears to be a "desperate attempt to divert attention".

Also this comment by Gerry:

Question. What is your motive for now requesting an interview in Spain?
Gerry McCann. For us nothing has changed during the last 2 weeks. There is a very real possibility that Madeleine is alive and we want the police to search for her.

...and again:

G. Again. These are wild speculations . The police have always told us that they are considering all possible scenarios. And the craziest thing in all that has happened during the last 2 or 3 weeks is that nothing in the investigation has changed. Therefore we keep believing that there is a real opportunity to find Madeleine alive. And we will keep on looking for our daughter because we need to find her.

Copied from the forum (http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.co...eral&action=display&thread=1187388920&page=25 post # 371): The police force has stated publicly that they believe M probably died that night, IN THEIR APARTMENT. How can that not have changed anything for G & K - unless they knew that fact all along?!

Excuse me but...nothing has changed? Gerry, what planet are you living on?

 

[Brefie]

With all due respect Brefie...

The comment about the "pact" was made by David Payne.

Gerry threatened the reporter.

IMHO, telling a reporter to "mind your own business" or "I am going to report you to the police" is akin to running from a pit bull!!

While I might call the police after telling the reporter "no comment" or saying nothing at all, I would be more concerned that the reporter might use my words against me, thereby possibly undermining the investigation, so I would not engage the press. We all know how they love to embellish

In this case it would be even more important not to speak to the press considering the request by the PJ that they not discuss the case.

I see where you are coming from, but I must respectfully disagree. The press seemed to have engaged themselves even with a widely reported pact of silence.

 

[Rino]

Remember the link I provided on the apartment? It stated there that sheets were not provided (but extras were provided for an emergency) and you should bring your own....

Thank you, oops.



http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52377&page=11
Post 255 mentioned the calling of the priest and I don't recall much discussion her. ( I am probabley wrong ) I for one find it extrememly interesting he was more interested in a Priest than the police at this point.

Minutes after this phonecall, Gerry asked for a priest from the Luz parish (the church they frequently attend now) to be called for him, but the Ocean Club staff members refused, given the time it was (after 1 am). At 4:00 am, Jane Tanner asked a member of GNR: “Have you cut off all the roads already?” Minutes later, Gerry, realizing a priest hadn't arrived, asked another member of GNR to show him the way to the church.

 

[colomom]

I see where you are coming from, but I must respectfully disagree. The press seemed to have engaged themselves even with a widely reported pact of silence.

I agree with this, my perceptions of the press have changed dramatically since this case. I will always question what I read from now on.

 

[AfterMidnight]

Of course I did not expect a reply!!! But, I did hope they would read it!

In the early weeks of this case I was very emotionally upset by it. I cried for Madeleine every day. I was desperate for her to be found. I was convinced from day 1 that the McCanns were hiding something and I know how damaging that can be for LE to conduct a proper investigation. While I still feel these things it is less intense (thank God).

The word ludicrous means:

1 : amusing or laughable through obvious absurdity, incongruity, exaggeration, or eccentricity
2 : meriting derisive laughter or scorn as absurdly inept, false, or foolish

therefore your comment is very insulting. If you can't comment without being insulting I would appreciate it if you would keep your comments to yourself!

Thank you very much! :slap:

I believe when one gets too emotionally involved in someone else's tragedy, without knowing them, it's a bad thing. I further believe emailing parents who have a missing child, asking them "tell the truth" oversteps the bounds of common sense and decency.

 

[colomom]

Thank you, oops.

No oops necessary, it is exceedingly difficult to keep up with all the little details.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52377&page=11
Post 255 mentioned the calling of the priest and I don't recall much discussion her. ( I am probabley wrong ) I for one find it extrememly interesting he was more interested in a Priest than the police at this point.

Minutes after this phonecall, Gerry asked for a priest from the Luz parish (the church they frequently attend now) to be called for him, but the Ocean Club staff members refused, given the time it was (after 1 am). At 4:00 am, Jane Tanner asked a member of GNR: “Have you cut off all the roads already?” Minutes later, Gerry, realizing a priest hadn't arrived, asked another member of GNR to show him the way to the church.

Your are correct, we did not discuss this "strange" series of events. It has been discussed on other forums with people saying that asking for a priest was "weird". However, I think that asking for a priest so that I could pray for my daughter, for her safe return, for her safety, not so weird.

Asking for GNR to show him the way to the church, that's a bit weird. I would have thought they would have been there at some point in the prior days of their vacation, but maybe not.