OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #73

[Puzzles8]

I am curious about the size of the other two pair of boots in Discovery.

When one was described as a 9" zip women' swat boot, I just assumed it was a size 9 boot. Not so.

JMO

 

[Betty P]

I am curious about the size of the other two pair of boots in Discovery.

When one was described as a 9" zip women' swat boot, I just assumed it was a size 9 boot. Not so.

JMO

Interesting, I remember that. Was Billy wearing women’s boots?

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Someone had asked about GR autopsy report a few pages back, let me know if you still need it and I can post it. Back to trying to get caught up on the thread.

 

[Puzzles8]

Someone had asked about GR autopsy report a few pages back, let me know if you still need it and I can post it. Back to trying to get caught up on the thread.

It wold be great if anyone could post all of the unredacted autopy's to the TIMELINE MEDIA thread for reference. The Timeline Media thread is a historical reference library of articles and timelines from this case. There are valuable timelines as well as old and recent articles chronicled there.

TIA

LINK to TIMELINE MEDIA thread from the Rhoden/Gilley murder trials.

OH - 8 Family Members Murdered, Pike Co., Media, Maps & Timeline *NO DISCUSSION*

https://local12.com/news/local/george-wagner-returns-to-court-for-motions-head-of-jury-selection-in-pike-county-angela-jake-billy-rhoden-gilley-massacre-custody-battle-conspiracy-kill- Video of hearing at link “Friday, Pike County Common Pleas Judge Randy Deering also overruled several defense...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Venom]

It wold be great if anyone could post all of the unredacted autopy's to the TIMELINE MEDIA thread for reference. The Timeline Media thread is a historical reference library of articles and timelines from this case. There are valuable timelines as well as old and recent articles chronicled there.

TIA

LINK to TIMELINE MEDIA thread from the Rhoden/Gilley murder trials.

OH - 8 Family Members Murdered, Pike Co., Media, Maps & Timeline *NO DISCUSSION*

https://local12.com/news/local/george-wagner-returns-to-court-for-motions-head-of-jury-selection-in-pike-county-angela-jake-billy-rhoden-gilley-massacre-custody-battle-conspiracy-kill- Video of hearing at link “Friday, Pike County Common Pleas Judge Randy Deering also overruled several defense...

www.websleuths.com

I just did. For some reason I can't find GR's. I'm going to keep looking. I will add if I find it.

 

[Recidivist]

d. He isn't some random person or distant relative. Intent is a huge part of thi



If you were on that jury you can bet you are listening only for evidence that pertains to George. I know we have lumped all of them in as the W4 for so long some of us are having a hard time separating George out from the other three. I am just keeping in mind the old saying "you are not your brothers keeper" or your fathers or mothers. So far I have seen them build a very solid case against Jake and Billy. I don't see Billy getting off.

But as for evidence on George, nothing.

i have considered the shoeprint evidence. Prosecution has to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt. Circumstantial evidence alone won't do it. They have to conclusively put those shoes on George's feet that night at those scenes. At least one of them anyway. I don't see that happening. Too many variables in there.
1. George threw the shoes in the trash.
2. Billy wore one pair, jake wore the other.
3. Too many other people in the area bought that cheap brand of shoes at Walmart.

Keep in mind these are not a pair of custom made 2000.00 alligator loafers. They are not even a high end brand or a popular brand like NIKE.

I think they only way they will get a is if they have George in the vehicle with Billy and Jake that night on surveillance cameras. I am placing all my hope in that random house they took jurors to or the church they took them to as having cameras.

O/T I have some friends down in Florida in Ft Myers and Orlando who are getting hammered by hurricane Ian right now. Your thoughts for them are appreciated by me.

JMO

This is what today's shoe expert said:

On redirect, the state asked, “Can you testify that George Wagner was wearing the shoes?” and the woman said “no.” In the end, the expert was unable to testify if any of the Wagners wore the shoes.

DAY 13: Defense introduces reasonable doubt with shoes, while state goes over phone records in Wagner trial

Scioto Valley Guardian

sciotovalleyguardian.com

 

[Niner]

for Wed. 9/28:

Evan Millward
@EvanMillward
·
6m
PIKE COUNTY TRIAL: Now on the stand - BCI special agent Ryan Scheiderer - he led this investigation for the agency. Started at BCI in March 2012.



Scheiderer was working in his yard the morning of 4/22/2016 - left his house at 9:30a and got to Piketon PD briefing area around 11:30a
"This was a very chaotic day, this was a big incident ... it's a lot even for BCI."

Scheiderer was told to respond to 4077 Union Hill Road- crime scene 1 - this was Chris Rhoden Sr's property - the first one discovered.
He remembers it taking a while to get there - and then having to wait in the road outside until warrant came back.

Scheiderer then left scene to go to Sheriff's Office to interview family members - James and Bobby Jo Manley, Billy Morgan, Luke Rhoden.

Scheiderer says the Pike Co. Sheriff's Office asked for BCI to handle the case.
It assigned two majors to BCI's investigative team - to help get uniformed deputies if needed etc.

Scheiderer says eventually they had to regroup together back at Piketon PD. Tips and info is coming in "so fast, it overwhelms you."
He says "We knew we were gonna be in for the long haul on this."

Scheiderer says he immediately went to track down a Jones family, which people had told them had a fight with Chris Jr. about 10 days before murders. Isaiah and Larry Jones claimed to take credit for murders.
BCI ultimately cleared them.

BCI set up a tip system to track and monitor volume of tips. They would get tip, assign to agent, agent would go track it down and report back.

Scheiderer became lead agent on this case in March or April 2017.
He has authored 165-167 reports out of about 835 for this case. That excludes lab reports.

Scheiderer describes doing "victimology" first - trying to get a sense of who these 8 people were. Also had to go to companies like Facebook to preserve records.
Cell tower data dumps challenging because everyone out there is on the same towers.

Scheiderer notes that Facebook messenger was often used in the area instead of texts because of spotty service.
We know one Hanna May Rhoden FB message will play big later.

Scheiderer calls this a "whodunnit murder."

Scheiderer says BCI rushed DNA results, but none of that was useful. Most was DNA of victims - or saturated, which means there's too much to get a match.

Scheiderer says they also did "old school police work" of door knocking and asking for security video.
Problems because Union Hill Rd was closed and people left - because of fear and for convenience since they couldn't get in or out.

Scheiderer says they looked into all tips - including from psychics, inmates, out-of-state, even had something connected to the death of Prince

Scheiderer says Facebook doesn't make it easy to go through its data, "in fact, they're not very cooperative."

A few things about the scenes jumped out to him: the roads were secluded, no sign of forced entry, missing cameras/DVR.
At Chris Sr's, the victims were drug, but not at others.
At Dana's, no one got out of bed.
Seemed like people who did this knew them

Scheiderer notes the marijuana grow ops - says they quickly ruled this out as motive because the plants would have been stolen.
Said they kept it in mind though - explore all options.

Scheiderer now says Dana's home (Scene 3) is in fact in Scioto County. At the time, all belief was that it was in Pike Co. In fact, a sign nearby says "Welcome to Pike Co."
Also says BCI got list of people who knew they had just moved in there.

Scheiderer says BCI also got video that shows Dana stopping at a mart on her way home from her double shift late that night.
Also has security footage of Frankie going to a store for milk that night.

Scheiderer showing a map now - the red locations are crime scenes, the purple locations are where they got video (residences). The jury visited these locations - at the time, we in media pool were unclear why we stopped there.



The yellow location is where a homeowner said they had a camera up. he was out of town - got back one week after murders and discovered the camera was missing.

Back from break - Scheiderer shows some rough video taken from a home at Union Hill Road and SR 772 - timestamp is delayed - actually around 1:36 a.m.
Vehicle away from 772 (toward crime scenes).
Other photo is this property from jury view



Another clip - from around 241AM (again, timestamp is off) - two vehicles traveling simultaneously away from crime scenes and toward Union Hill Rd intersection with SR 772

[The screen is blank - so no picture]

Another angle - same time (2:41AM) - shows the two vehicles turn left on SR-772



Then at 319AM (corrected time) you see two vehicles come back from that direction and turn right from 772 onto Union Hill Rd



New location now - camera picks up a single vehicle driving toward Kenneth's property - and driving away again at 310AM (that's the screenshot below)



Jake Wagner was interviewed at the Sheriff's Office on May 13, 2016 - he did not provide his phone.
Scheiderer says he learned this is not Jake's natural hair color.



Leonard Manley (Dana's dad) had same Walmart shoes in size 10. Scheiderer says he had thrown them away, they pulled them, and tested to clear him.
Leonard definitely told reporters about this back then - he felt like he was being considered a suspect.

On cross-examination with John Parker, Scheiderer says Leonard Manley bought the Walmart shoes in February 2016.
Suzanne Elliott previously testified they got them out of the trash 27 days after the murders (in May).

Scheiderer says BCI has collected/generated 4 terabytes of evidence in this case.

Parker focuses in on the Scioto County issue with Scene 3 - Dana's house.

Scheiderer says he learned it was in Scioto Co. after the indictments & arrests - but doesn't know how long after. He did not document it.

Things get chippy asking Scheiderer about venue.

Parker asks him if he's aware the Ohio Constitution requires a trial take place in county where crime was committed.

Canepa comes back saying this has been argued already.

Adjourn for the day.

Evan Millward
@EvanMillward
·
5h
PIKE COUNTY TRIAL - #BREAKING: Court will not be in session tomorrow (Thursday 9/29) because of an illness. @WCPO

link: https://twitter.com/evanmillward

 

[ColMustard]

Hypothetical dialog, moo, imo...

"Your honor, we're advising our client to keep his mouth shut."

 

[molly1255]

A cartel would not have gone to all 4 places IMO; in fact when the custody problems came out it was almost directly pointing at the Wagners and nobody else.

For me early... I felt I knew when I found out about JW picking up his child before it happened. Just knew he was involved and knew he would not have done it alone.

When did y'all start to home in on the Wagners?

Agree. It was fairly early on for me and it was cinched by the interview JW did when he promoted his online fundraiser and said he picked up his daughter that day and reckoned he had missed it by hours. Angela later corrected his statement and said that he had picked up his daughter the day before.

 

[Ann99]

I have to admit, for a long time I did not think it could be another “ family “ that did this horrible massacre for the reason of child custody. It made no sense.
That motive was way beyond my imagination.
Eventually I did see it as a possibility. And then finally a reality.

 

[Tiff23fr]

A cartel would not have gone to all 4 places IMO; in fact when the custody problems came out it was almost directly pointing at the Wagners and nobody else.

For me early... I felt I knew when I found out about JW picking up his child before it happened. Just knew he was involved and knew he would not have done it alone.

When did y'all start to home in on the Wagners?

Some of the items that gave me an initial pause regarding the Wagners (Jake)
-confusing and correcting reports on when he picked up the daughter
-Observations early on that his hair had been colored

I haven’t followed all the testimony closely due to other commitments, but I noted the following yesterday:
“The first line is an outgoing voice call with a duration of 27 seconds to Billy Wagner’s phone. It was at 8:51 pm,” said Eveslage.
The last phone activity on Chris Sr.’s phone the night he died was five minutes before 11 p.m. and it was to Billy Wagner. “Less than a minute later, another outgoing call to Billy Wagner’s phone and that’s the last activity,” the BCI agent said on the stand.

BCI agents testify about shoeprints, phone records in Pike County massacre trial

George Wagner IV has pleaded not guilty to eight counts of aggravated murder in the Rhoden family killings

www.fox19.com

It seems this alone would have placed Billy being in a grouping of possible suspects early on. Billy was the last noted communications according to phone records. CRSR’s home was the most violent scene.

And of course here is HR communicating with Jake that night:

Agent Eveslage said Hanna was in contact with Jake the night she was murdered.

Here’s the timeline Eveslage laid out in court:

”At 9:02 p.m., an outgoing text message to Jake Wagner.”

“At 9:03 p.m., and incoming text from Jake Wagner.”

“9:07 p.m., an incoming text from Jake Wagner.”

“At 9:35 p.m., there’s an outgoing voice call attempt to Jake Wagner’s phone,” Agent Eveslage testified. “It has a zero-second duration. Without having the other end of the records in front of me, I can’t exactly determine what happened with that call, but it did have a duration of zero seconds on her side.”

So it would seem he would have been a top suspect as they looked at her victimology.
——
Maybe the Wagners were on the short of suspects for quite some time. It will be interesting to hear more as it unfolds.

I hope it’s coming, or maybe I have missed it, but as a juror I would be anxiously waiting to hear Georges name. George did this or George did that. I feel the state could benefit by using his name more often in an effort to grab the jury’s attention. Even if they could use a phrase during the trial such as “George Wagner and his family did XYZ” rather than “The Wagners”.
JMO

 

[Tiff23fr]

Pike County massacre trial canceled Thursday due to illness

It's not clear when testimony will resume

www.fox19.com

WAVERLY, Ohio (WXIX) - George Wagner IV’s murder trial in the 2016 Pike County massacre case is canceled Thursday due to an illness, court officials announced overnight.

It is not clear if court proceedings will resume on Friday.

 

[24Roses]

Agree. It was fairly early on for me and it was cinched by the interview JW did when he promoted his online fundraiser and said he picked up his daughter that day and reckoned he had missed it by hours. Angela later corrected his statement and said that he had picked up his daughter the day before.

I have to admit, for a long time I did not think it could be another “ family “ that did this horrible massacre for the reason of child custody. It made no sense.
That motive was way beyond my imagination.
Eventually I did see it as a possibility. And then finally a reality.

DBM-replying to wrong post.

 

[dgfred]

What is the purpose of the different hair color... avoid media?

That was about a month after the murders I think... what color was it during the murders?

 

[dgfred]

I can tell 1 of the vehicles in the pics is a truck... what about the others? Do we know?

 

[24Roses]

Agree. It was fairly early on for me and it was cinched by the interview JW did when he promoted his online fundraiser and said he picked up his daughter that day and reckoned he had missed it by hours. Angela later corrected his statement and said that he had picked up his daughter the day before.

I remember that interview. But, I didn't know that AW corrected his statement. What did was she picked up; who was telling the truth about it?

 

[24Roses]

What is the purpose of the different hair color... avoid media?

That was about a month after the murders I think... what color was it during the murders?

What is the purpose of the different hair color... avoid media?

That was about a month after the murders I think... what color was it during the murders?

IMO-it was his natural hair color during the murders and he colored it after the murder becauses if LE found camera evidence and could tell hair color of the suspect(s), LE wouldn't think of him right away because his hair color would be different. They would have to dig deep (and very likely would), to figure out when he colored it. IMO-that was his way of thinking anyway.

 

[24Roses]

I can tell 1 of the vehicles in the pics is a truck... what about the others? Do we know?

IMO-they both look like pickup trucks to me. In the videos with the 2 vehicles close together anyway. I'm pretty sure the murder vehicle and CRSR's vehicle are both trucks.

 

[Chingaling]

I am curious about the size of the other two pair of boots in Discovery.

When one was described as a 9" zip women' swat boot, I just assumed it was a size 9 boot. Not so.

JMO

I asked the same and was told it isn't evidence. IDK

 

[TheRevWells]

I am trying to get caught up via the trial videos, on day 7, and man.....the damage that was done to the arm of Chris Sr and even the internal decapitation that had occurred - absolutely horrific. Glad they are not showing these pictures on the stream. When all of this is done, the remaining trials, etc, I bet people will be rushing to do FOIA requests to get everything that was shown during the trial