PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #7

[J. J. in Phila]

Yeah, I know what's up...been there to see it myself. It's a bit of fun to go 'There' and do the Lookie See. I may be a Newbie here, but I know my way around, and have picked up on lots. Do the Blonde Blog...good to see you laugh here, too !!! :crazy:

The blog won't be a joke. It could be an accurate sighting. If it is, suicide drops. The other two go up.

 

[AllisonS]

Playing Dev's Adv. for a moment. Do you think a responsible person like Ray would throw electronic equipment into a river?
He's just polluted a river, he's probably just thrown a battery into the water which can't be great for the fish around the thing..Isn't that negligent behavior if it was not done on his way out of town?

And isn't littering in general one of those things you get fined for in PA? It is in TX. (Of course, Lady Bird Johnson had a lot of weird laws about littering and weeds passed in TX in the years before I was born. Might be different up North. )

I'd think that throwing something in the water just for convenience sake would fall into the littering X2 category. HD, then computer body. I don't think RG is a negligent person. Not even in the PSU case,now.

I've lived in several US states and two foreign countries, and I think everywhere has littering laws these days. That being said, even if you are a conscientious sort, some situations are grave enough that they would overshadow laws such as litter laws. The gravity of the situation might even just be a personal motivation, but I think most people can rationalize it out that something like disobeying litter laws is ok 'just this once, in this rare situation'.

 

[SeekingJana]

I'm really not sure if BB has it right. We only had one reported witness who saw RFG with the LMW, and she had dark hair.

Since it appears that RG and ____ a woman with whatever hair color were apparently not captured on film, don't we have to suspend disbelief at some point and say " BB is credible and MAYBE he let some info slip that we weren't told officially"?

I can't disbelieve every friend of his.. I can't discount what seems to be likely.. I don't think that Mr. B and Mrs. B both have it wrong. I think that 2 reports of a blond are pretty credible.
Faith and hope are empowering. Doesn't mean you drank the purple kool-aid, just means you find some points to accept and build upon.

Nothng can be built upon a groundwork of shifting sands. One has to formulate a theory based upon best evidence and build upon it as " things" come in.. Then it's easier to either accept or reject the new info but build a solid belief system as the foundation.

This is your pep talk. Your anti-pessimism challenge. :yourock:

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Playing Dev's Adv. for a moment. Do you think a responsible person like Ray would throw electronic equipment into a river?
He's just polluted a river, he's probably just thrown a battery into the water which can't be great for the fish around the thing..Isn't that negligent behavior if it was not done on his way out of town?

The drive has no battery. The laptop is different.

And isn't littering in general one of those things you get fined for in PA? It is in TX. (Of course, Lady Bird Johnson had a lot of weird laws about littering and weeds passed in TX in the years before I was born. Might be different up North. )

So is speeding, but RFG was clocked at 80 on a back road outside of Bellefonte. He was celebrating winning a case.

I'd think that throwing something in the water just for convenience sake would fall into the littering X2 category. HD, then computer body. I don't think RG is a negligent person. Not even in the PSU case,now.

The drive is different that the laptop. I think it is likely that RFG tossed the drive. I'm not so sure about the laptop. The drive was obviously tossed by someone on foot. The laptop probably was not.

 

[SeekingJana]

Same article:

Buehner, who was also interviewed this month about Gricar’s disappearance by Lester Holt of Dateline NBC, said he did not know who the blonde might be.

RFG, if it was him, probably did know her, since he was sitting in a car with her. BB didn't.

Does it matter that Buehner doesn't know this woman but he says Ray does? Doesn't that speak more to a " personal friendship" or relationship between RG and YBW than anything else? My friends are my friends... My personal relationships ( when I used to have 'em) were totally separate from my established friendships.. Eepecially with other females.

 

[Lord_Chatterly]

Playing Dev's Adv. for a moment. Do you think a responsible person like Ray would throw electronic equipment into a river?
He's just polluted a river, he's probably just thrown a battery into the water which can't be great for the fish around the thing..Isn't that negligent behavior if it was not done on his way out of town?

And isn't littering in general one of those things you get fined for in PA? It is in TX. (Of course, Lady Bird Johnson had a lot of weird laws about littering and weeds passed in TX in the years before I was born. Might be different up North. )

I'd think that throwing something in the water just for convenience sake would fall into the littering X2 category. HD, then computer body. I don't think RG is a negligent person. Not even in the PSU case,now.

'Up Here' in Pa. there is a $300.00 fine for littering...I know, because I had to pay one of those fines for tossing a cig butt out my window (which so happened to hit the windshield of a cop who was about to pass me...sparks everywhere...lol ). Anywayyyyy...put yourself in Ray Gricar's place for a second: Would you give a fiddle faddle over a fine for something that may well NOT be witnessed, and...who and where would they send the summons to, if you are now 'disappeared' ???

LE better get on the ball, and send the summons ... :wink:

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Since it appears that RG and ____ a woman with whatever hair color were apparently not captured on film, don't we have to suspend disbelief at some point and say " BB is credible and MAYBE he let some info slip that we weren't told officially"?

Maybe, but sometimes he makes mistakes; he's no less perfect that the rest of us (and notice, I'm in "us").

Now granted, if it were confirmed that there were two witnesses to RFG with a blond, in two locations, that would be big. Let's not get too excited yet.

I know who everyone thought the LMW was, and she is not a blond.

This is your pep talk. Your anti-pessimism challenge. :yourock:

I need evidence. I'd love for SW, or MR, confirm it.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Does it matter that Buehner doesn't know this woman but he says Ray does? Doesn't that speak more to a " personal friendship" or relationship between RG and YBW than anything else? My friends are my friends... My personal relationships ( when I used to have 'em) were totally separate from my established friendships.. Eepecially with other females.

It is possible that BB wouldn't know; I was clarifying that BB didn't know who it was.

 

[SeekingJana]

The drive has no battery. The laptop is different.



So is speeding, but RFG was clocked at 80 on a back road outside of Bellefonte. He was celebrating winning a case.



The drive is different that the laptop. I think it is likely that RFG tossed the drive. I'm not so sure about the laptop. The drive was obviously tossed by someone on foot. The laptop probably was not.

LOL, have owned laptops since 1995. Have removed both the system battery and the hard drive.. Once threw an iBook across a room and watched it shatter on a marble floor. Learned a lot about the innards that night.
Know that it is considered extremely polluting to throw any type of computer into the garbage, much less a river. In fact, if you go to the resale stores or even eBay, you will find a ton of shelves and pages of old laptops that aren't worth a dime. People don't know what to do with them in many areas of the country.

FWIW, I think Ray threw both parts in the Susquehanna at the same time because the laptop was the last part of his life he needed to leave behind. The two parts ended up where they did due to the river's currents, floods, etc. Same reason for the delay in finding both parts. Currents, seasonal river depth, water clarity, etc.
JMO, so be kind, OK?

 

[SeekingJana]

Maybe, but sometimes he makes mistakes; he's no less perfect that the rest of us (and notice, I'm in "us").

Now granted, if it were confirmed that there were two witnesses to RFG with a blond, in two locations, that would be big. Let's not get too excited yet.

I know who everyone thought the LMW was, and she is not a blond.




I need evidence. I'd love for SW, or MR, confirm it.

I don't have a clue as to who was ever in RG's love life except 2 wives and PF. I WISH I did because if I knew what you know about his romantic history, then I could form a more informed opinion about the validity of BB and Mrs. B's statements..

OK, having a blond moment myself here. Who is MW and MR? Rickard is the police chief, right? You want to find out info from LE, then make friends with their friends. Someone will talk after a few brewskis.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

FWIW, I think Ray threw both parts in the Susquehanna at the same time because the laptop was the last part of his life he needed to leave behind. The two parts ended up where they did due to the river's currents, floods, etc. Same reason for the delay in finding both parts. Currents, seasonal river depth, water clarity, etc.
JMO, so be kind, OK?

Okay, you knew it was coming.

Or, he could tossed both just before he killed himself. Or he wanted to make sure the data on the drive couldn't be read and he tossed the drive a few hours before he was murdered [/da]

I think that if it could be shown RFG tossed the laptop, the odds on foul play would drop a bit.

The blond. Potentially big, but possibly wrong.

 

[Lord_Chatterly]

The blog won't be a joke. It could be an accurate sighting. If it is, suicide drops. The other two go up.

How do you see the proportion of the 'other two', if an accurate sighting ? Equal...more of Walk Away...more of murder ?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I don't have a clue as to who was ever in RG's love life except 2 wives and PF. I WISH I did because if I knew what you know about his romantic history, then I could form a more informed opinion about the validity of BB and Mrs. B's statements..

OK, having a blond moment myself here. Who is MW and MR? Rickard is the police chief, right? You want to find out info from LE, then make friends with their friends. Someone will talk after a few brewskis.

MR = Det. Matt Rickard, the lead investigator.

SW = Chief Shawn Weaver.

One person did make friends with someone a few years ago. That person posted that there was a witness to RFG "fiddling" with the laptop in Lewisburg. I'm not confirming or denying.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

How do you see the proportion of the 'other two', if an accurate sighting ? Equal...more of Walk Away...more of murder ?

Equally, but maybe with murder up a bit. Why would a "helper" be in the Mini, possibly smoking?

 

[SeekingJana]

'Up Here' in Pa. there is a $300.00 fine for littering...I know, because I had to pay one of those fines for tossing a cig butt out my window (which so happened to hit the windshield of a cop who was about to pass me...sparks everywhere...lol ). Anywayyyyy...put yourself in Ray Gricar's place for a second: Would you give a fiddle faddle over a fine for something that may well NOT be witnessed, and...who and where would they send the summons to, if you are now 'disappeared' ???

LE better get on the ball, and send the summons ... :wink:

Wish I could have seen that cig land on the cop car. LOLOL. Oh wow, they are PICKY about their squad cars.. I dated a police officer for several years off and on who once had a hissy fit right in front of me because this BIG unwashed woman spit all over the trunk of his B & W while he was handcuffing her. LOLOL. He's dead now.. bad heart at a very young age...that's one of my favorite memories of him.

ROFLOL about the summons. I'd say this is right up there with the body on the extremely high and sheer walled cliff- instead of a phoenix, though, send a carrier pigeon.
I'll keep it real, but I still don't think RG would dump a piece of electronics unless he needed to.
That's the gist of my objections. I don't think he would do it because it was there, but out of necessity.

You know they are going to be making fun of US over at the Macadamia Ranch forum if we don't straighten up, right? :floorlaugh:

 

[SeekingJana]

Equally, but maybe with murder up a bit. Why would a "helper" be in the Mini, possibly smoking?

To cover up the general scent of her massive hair products and female- specific fragrances like perfume, etc. We've covered this.

And she didn't have to SMOKE, just let the cig, burn-- like incense in reverse.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

To cover up the general scent of her massive hair products and female- specific fragrances like perfume, etc. We've covered this.

And she didn't have to SMOKE, just let the cig, burn-- like incense in reverse.

That was basically what I meant. But if she was a helper, why get in the car?

 

[Lord_Chatterly]

Wish I could have seen that cig land on the cop car. LOLOL. Oh wow, they are PICKY about their squad cars.. I dated a police officer for several years off and on who once had a hissy fit right in front of me because this BIG unwashed woman spit all over the trunk of his B & W while he was handcuffing her. LOLOL. He's dead now.. bad hear at a very young aget...that's one of my favorite memories of him.

ROFLOL about the summons. I'd say this is right up there with the body on the extremely high and sheer walled cliff- instead of a phoenix, though, send a carrier pigeon.
I'll keep it real, but I still don't think RG would dump a piece of electronics unless he needed to.
That's the gist of my objections. I don't think he would do it because it was there, but out of necessity.

You know they are going to be making fun of US over at the Macadamia Ranch forum if we don't straighten up, right? :floorlaugh:

Glad you enjoyed the ROFL...had tears in my eyes when I hit the 'Submit' gooey button...lol. Let the Macadamia Ranch crew munch out on this. I've read their stuff, and leaves Lots to be desired.

The cig butt on the cop's windshield is a true story...you should have seen the look on that cop's face...of course, as he handed me the 'ticky' !!! Glad you enjoyed ... lol.

 

[SeekingJana]

Okay, you knew it was coming.

Or, he could tossed both just before he killed himself. Or he wanted to make sure the data on the drive couldn't be read and he tossed the drive a few hours before he was murdered [/da]

I think that if it could be shown RFG tossed the laptop, the odds on foul play would drop a bit.

The blond. Potentially big, but possibly wrong.

My rebuttal:
The brilliant but techno- savant RG was SO skeeved out about that HD that he asked for close to a YEAR how to erase the thing.
Then bought a proggie to do so and used it, most likely.

What's the odds that he KNEW how to 1) Purchase the right replacement HD and 2) Install it covertly by himself?
I'd put the odds at less than 5%.
So why would he need the plastic case and remaining cheap parts?

Just throw two things in the river.. one which needed to go, and the other to make anyone possibly watching from up on PA's version of Choctaw Ridge not wonder what Billy Joe MacAllister threw off the Tallahatchie Bridge.

Did you know there are websites devoted to the meaning of Bobbie Gentry's lyrics about the girl and Billy Joe? Amazing what a cult following the song has, I don't know why I know that, but I do LOL. Anyway...
Just think what some people would do if they saw a person throw a smallish shiny metallic item off the bridge in Lewisburg..
Toss the laptop case and they would know a laptop just bit the dust, er, hit the water.
Kind of the KIS theory again.

 

[Lord_Chatterly]

That was basically what I meant. But if she was a helper, why get in the car?

I had thought of that too. Perhaps she was sitting side-ways in the car, with the passenger door open, so not to totally pollute the inside of the Mini. Just enough to cover up some smell. 'She' could have done this while waiting for RFG, lets say if he was off dumping the HD or the laptop. Could explain the wee bit of ash found on floor on passenger side. If she was sitting facing FORWARD, the likelyhood of ash on passenger floor would be nill.