Rebecca Zahau Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion #3

[stmarysmead]

Farther up on this thread is the link that Gore said the *advertiser censored* Asian *advertiser censored* on the computer was viewed the morning of the incident while AS was indeed there. The confusion was about cookies on the computer and something to do w updates.[/QUOTEI

You will need to give me the post number or a link. Adam didn’t arrive until the next day. Do you mean JS?

If this were the case, Mr Greer is too fine a litagator not to have brought this up in the trial. I have seen no mention that Adam was in the house, had access to RZ computer and watched Asian *advertiser censored*.

 

[coastal]

But, in fairness, if he’s a liar, he could have done much more than that for his brother. I honestly don’t think he helped much at all.

Well, IMO, he managed to convey the idea that yes, he did leave a message so terrible that his girlfriend would want to kill herself immediately because of it, while also denying he did any such thing. It remains to be seen which truth the jury will believe.

 

[Lolliknows]

Dina has been apologized to by Greer and cleared. She is not a suspect, a murderer, or a mastermind.

You misunderstood my post, or rather I wasn’t clear! Of course Dina is not a suspect, murderer, or mastermind!! My point was in response to the post that said the Zahau family was the only side that found the SDSO investigation of Rebecca’s death botched.

 

[MyBelle]

You misunderstood my post, or rather I wasn’t clear! Of course Dina is not a suspect, murderer, or mastermind!! My point was in response to the post that said the Zahau family was the only side that found the SDSO investigation of Rebecca’s death botched.

Did Dina express a public opinion about the investigation of RZ's death? I missed that. I thought her sole objection was on her son's death investigation.

 

[stmarysmead]

You misunderstood my post, or rather I wasn’t clear! Of course Dina is not a suspect, murderer, or mastermind!! My point was in response to the post that said the Zahau family was the only side that found the SDSO investigation of Rebecca’s death botched.

Thanks for the clarification. Still confused. Then who was giving JS the “earful” and establishing the motive to punish RZ?

 

[Lolliknows]

Farther up on this thread is the link that Gore said the *advertiser censored* Asian *advertiser censored* on the computer was viewed the morning of the incident while AS was indeed there. The confusion was about cookies on the computer and something to do w updates.[/QUOTEI

You will need to give me the post number or a link. Adam didn’t arrive until the next day. Do you mean JS?

If this were the case, Mr Greer is too fine a litagator not to have brought this up in the trial. I have seen no mention that Adam was in the house, had access to RZ computer and watched Asian *advertiser censored*.

Gore:
Who logged onto her computer in the middle of the night?
There was activity on Rebecca’s computer the day before the incident. The forensic examination of the hard drive showed the file access at about 3:00 am the morning of the event was likely a “cookie” left behind by an automated update for a tool bar.

ETA: A forensic exam would show was logged in when the cookie was left on the computer.
Sorry when I said Adam was there I meant he had arrived in SD not that it was proof he was viewing the *advertiser censored*, although not impossible.

 

[stmarysmead]

A

Gore:
Who logged onto her computer in the middle of the night?
There was activity on Rebecca’s computer the day before the incident. The forensic examination of the hard drive showed the file access at about 3:00 am the morning of the event was likely a “cookie” left behind by an automated update for a tool bar.

ETA: A forensic exam would show was logged in when the cookie was left on the computer.
Sorry when I said Adam was there I meant he had arrived in SD not that it was proof he was viewing the *advertiser censored*, although not impossible.

The sentence is confusing. Did the activity take place in the early morning when the crime was alleged to be taking place...or the night before? It really is not too clear.

But thanks for finding the quote.

 

[BBL]

Who else was in the house using her computer? JS was at a motel. Her sister had left. AS had t arrived. She was having trouble sleeping.

I just don’t think we should shame AS if at any point in time, RZ also watched *advertiser censored* on her computer. Matter of fairness.

Actually, didn't JS come home to change clothes and shower???

 

[stmarysmead]

Actually, didn't JS come home to change clothes and shower???

I think that’s correct. But did he come home in the middle of the night? I guess it’s possible he got on RZ computer and watched bondage *advertiser censored*. Anything is possible in this case. They may have watched it together.

But I’m still confused if “the night before the incident”...means the night of the previous day before Adam arrived.

Or during the alleged crime.

 

[BBL]

Traffic makes that trip a lot longer. Especially during the summer, and on top of that there is bridge traffic.

Respectfully, not really. Living here, I feel I can comment on that. Heavy rush our traffic might add 10 minutes. What bridge traffic do you speak of? When I know about bridge traffic, it is usually when someone has jumped. Quite common, unfortunately. Common enough that I believe if Rebecca wanted to commit suicide, that would be the way should would do it.

 

[elfie]

Originally Posted by Lezah

The message on the door...Something for consideration...

I have been pondering the message of the door for some time, and how the message was painted. Something wasn’t quite right about it...

I had made an assumption that the two paint brushes found in the room were used to paint the message, the small one initially, for the thinner, first ‘S’ - the other for the thicker stroke lettering. It was the deposit of the paint in that first letter S that stuck in my mind, something about it.

So, a few days ago I saw in evidence that only ONE brush was actually used, the thick one. The smaller one was unused.

This dawned on me this morning...

We know RZ painted regularly, and had done for some time - and we can therefore confidently assume she was relatively familiar with her artists tools and their basic uses, and limitations. She had several tubes of acrylic paint on her ‘painting room’ shelf ( third floor, upstairs from the ‘hanging’ room)

When looking at the door message again, rather than the smaller brush being used for the beginning of the message as I had first thought, this could not be the case. So what was used?

It now appears to me that it was very likely that it was the PAINT TUBE that was used to paint the first letter - ‘S’

The stroke markings, and the ‘gapping’ in the paint is highly consistent with the tube being used. Imagine trying to use it like a pen. As you squeeze the tube a bit of paint comes out, it ‘blobs’ initially, then ‘thins’ through the stroke of application, the surface eventually becoming empty, here is the blank section...then you squeeze it again...and you go through the same process as you apply more paint ...and so on and so forth.

Basically, it’s difficult, and it doesn’t work. ...and I discovered this very, very early on, when first using acrylic in tube form. You use a vessel or a palette to dispense the paint and take it from there.

IMO only someone very unfamiliar with dispensing paint would assume you could use the tube to paint the message.

The layering of the paint in the remainder of the message also indicates to me that the tube was likely used to apply the paint directly to the brush. The texturing and transition / thickness of the paint would be consistent with this as opposed to the use of a palette.

I would hypothesize that whoever painted the message retrieved a tube of paint from upstairs, ( familiar with the house, knowing where to go to get the paint) they grabbed the tube and commenced trying to write the message on the door. Unfamiliar with handling the paint and unaware of the paints viscosity, it was only after painting the first letter they realized it wasn’t going to work, so the went back to the room upstairs and got a brush, in fact they got two, incase one of them did it work, they didnt want to have to go back again...

IMO I think this is key, it goes to RZ knowledge and familiarity of the paint.

She knew more about acrylic than she did about knots....

Still great points! Only someone not terribly familiar with acrylic paints would try to paint directly from the tube, and after the attempt on the first "S", that approach was abandoned. That, and the "A's" are very similar to AS' handwriting per expert witness.

 

[BBL]

When asked if he said anything on the voicemail that would make Rebecca suicidal, Jonah's testimony on the stand was that the message he left her was "pretty rough". He said this with a shake of his head and a small, sad smile.

In other words, his denial was denied by his body language.

And let's not forget that Dr. Peterson completely contradicted that he gave dire news that night. He testified that he did not deliver news. IMO, the defense learned from this and that is part of the reason why they chose not to have Gore, ME, etc.. take the stand. They couldn't afford any more contradictions.

 

[M. Kay]

Once again, it’s all down to whom we choose to believe. Her sister says she was fine. Her sister has an emotional and financial interest in this being declared a murder.

You know, RZ was not as pure as the driven snow. No one disputes that she had numerous sexual affairs and was an adulterer. That does not mean she wasn’t a loving daughter and sister. She certainly was. Humans are not caricatures of perfection or evil.

I’m guessing once again this goes back to the ancient history of this case discussion wherein insults and hurtful comments hardened the “teams” here. That’s a shame because it does impede discussion.

I believe there was also a book in RZ study on bondage. Her computer had Asian *advertiser censored* on it. Adam masturbated to *advertiser censored*.

Immediately, anything about RZ has to be explained away to maintain this image of earthly perfection. She did not steal...she...forgot. if she had affairs, it was her husband’s fault. If she could not get along with the daughter, it was the daughters fault. All information flowing from the Z family or Greer is absolute TRUTH. Anything coming from the other side is incompetence, evil, the result of being “bought off”....there’s no balance in the flow of discussion at all.

Treat RZ like the real woman she was...and your positions become more believable. Elevate her to goddess level...with all evil all the time on the other side...and even your best points become undermined by the lack of objectivity.

There's one perspective which everyone on this blog may agree on, and that's the Wiki definition of why Lady Justice 'often' wears a blindfold: Since the 16th century, Lady Justice has often been depicted wearing a blindfold. The blindfold represents impartiality, the ideal that justice should be applied without regard to wealth, power, or other status. ​May I presume?

 

[Lolliknows]

Thanks for the clarification. Still confused. Then who was giving JS the “earful” and establishing the motive to punish RZ?

DS never wanted Max to be left alone with Rebecca and had told that to JS. It’s a mother’s perogative to request who is in custodial care of their child when the ex spouse is not there. To this point DS formed Maxie’s House, which it’s mission is to pass a bill that allows both parents to do background checks on ex spouses new partners if there are shared custody agreements. My point about “getting an earful” was that during the time JS and DS were together watching their son fight for his life, I can’t imagine DS not saying acccusatory things to JS, not necessarily that she thought it was Rebecca that caused his accident, more like “I told you not to leave her alone with him!!! Why didn’t you listen to me!” JS, already knew D disapproved of Rebecca. Now he’s facing the mother of his child hysterical upon hearing the news that if Max lives he won’t be able to walk or talk again?? I can’t imagining her grief when it came time to consider donating his organs. I do personally know that Max was DS’s love of her life, her reason to live, her biggest joy.
Now think about it, a man as powerful and well off as JS wouldn’t like it one bit if his ex wife sued him for negligence would he? I’m just thinking out loud as if I was in his position. That kind of scandal wouldn’t be good for the stock price of Medicis one bit. But if somehow R mysteriously committed suicide, some if those concerns might be averted and maybe his ex wife might be less likely to sue him perhaps? That scenario right there is huge motive IMO. No CEO likes tumbling stock prices. In closing on this post I have another question for anyone reading this:
How would JS would have reacted to R‘s death if his brother Adam was not in SD or a person of interest? Would JS have pressed for a thorough investigation as to cause of death or just accepted that his GF committed suicide. Would he have been appalled at the time she lay naked on the lawn uncovered? Would he have wanted to know if his GF was attacked and murdered in his own home by someone that could gain entry to his private life?? Would he have searched for every clue or dismissed all evidence as unnecessary? I think all JS moves have been extremely strategic from the very beginning all the way up through his testimony and he gave a great performance till he blurted “Well she didn’t save him! She only gave him a few breaths” (when questioned by Greer about him purportedly telling DS that she should be thanking Rebecca for saving Max.) BTW IMO his testimony explained the message once and for all. “She Saved Him, (nope) Can you save her? (nope) and both Max and R died of asphyxiation falling over a balcony. Eye for an eye if you ask me.

 

[stmarysmead]

There's one perspective which everyone on this blog may agree on, and that's the Wiki definition of why Lady Justice 'often' wears a blindfold: Since the 16th century, Lady Justice has often been depicted wearing a blindfold. The blindfold represents impartiality, the ideal that justice should be applied without regard to wealth, power, or other status. ​May I presume?

Beautifully said. And yes, impartiality is key. JS wealth should not be an advantage...or a disadvantage.

I gave up watching Law and Order years ago...the evil one always attended a posh private school, was a CEO, or lived in a luxurious penthouse. There has been a purposeful cultural animus cultivated against “wealth and privilege.”

Justice really needs to be blind...in every respect.

 

[stmarysmead]

DS never wanted Max to be left alone with Rebecca and had told that to JS. It’s a mother’s perogative to request who is in custodial care of their child when the ex spouse is not there. To this point DS formed Maxie’s House, which it’s mission is to pass a bill that allows both parents to do background checks on ex spouses new partners if there are shared custody agreements. My point about “getting an earful” was that during the time JS and DS were together watching their son fight for his life, I can’t imagine DS not saying acccusatory things to JS, not necessarily that she thought it was Rebecca that caused his accident, more like “I told you not to leave her alone with him!!! Why didn’t you listen to me!” JS, already knew D disapproved of Rebecca. Now he’s facing the mother of his child hysterical upon hearing the news that if Max lives he won’t be able to walk or talk again?? I can’t imagining her grief when it came time to consider donating his organs. I do personally know that Max was DS’s love of her life, her reason to live, her biggest joy.
Now think about it, a man as powerful and well off as JS wouldn’t like it one bit if his ex wife sued him for negligence would he? I’m just thinking out loud as if I was in his position. That kind of scandal wouldn’t be good for the stock price of Medicis one bit. But if somehow R mysteriously committed suicide, some if those concerns might be averted and maybe his ex wife might be less likely to sue him perhaps? That scenario right there is huge motive IMO. No CEO likes tumbling stock prices. In closing on this post I have another question for anyone reading this:
How would JS would have reacted to R‘s death if his brother Adam was not in SD or a person of interest? Would JS have pressed for a thorough investigation as to cause of death or just accepted that his GF committed suicide. Would he have been appalled at the time she lay naked on the lawn uncovered? Would he have wanted to know if his GF was attacked and murdered in his own home by someone that could gain entry to his private life?? Would he have searched for every clue or dismissed all evidence as unnecessary? I think all JS moves have been extremely strategic from the very beginning all the way up through his testimony and he gave a great performance till he blurted “Well she didn’t save him! She only gave him a few breaths” (when questioned by Greer about him purportedly telling DS that she should be thanking Rebecca for saving Max.) BTW IMO his testimony explained the message once and for all. “She Saved Him, (nope) Can you save her? (nope) and both Max and R died of asphyxiation falling over a balcony. Eye for an eye if you ask me.

You make some very thoughtful points.

But if there was any evidence of this, the Shacknai billions would be on the line in this trial....Jonah would be named in the suit. But in all these years, no one has been able to tie him in or find any evidence of anything that implicates him.

I don’t know that JS would have done anything different after RZ’s death. My opinion only is that he moves on from women easily.

 

[Lilibet]

Did Dina express a public opinion about the investigation of RZ's death? I missed that. I thought her sole objection was on her son's death investigation.

In this video Dina says that she does not believe RZ committed suicide and that the family should get answers (words to that effect, implying an opinion about the investigation.)

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/DINAClip2_San-Diego-419993313.html

 

[Imp]

<snipped to address>

It's VERY weird to me that Jonah would leave a message with bad news about Max (and saying they were over?) on a VOICEMAIL at midnight-- in fact I don't believe that's what happened...... but even if he did leave a "bad" message, why wouldn't Rebecca call back? Get some clarification? Tell Jonah she was sorry about Max? Anything!!

But instead we are to believe she INSTANTLY got bizarrely suicidal and wanted to hurt the family even more?

This is so ludicrous it shocks me anyone buys the suicide story.

^^^This. According to the SDSO and defense theory, not only did RZ become suddenly suicidal in the middle of the night due to an alleged VM from JS, but she got bizarrely suicidal. Honestly, if she became suddenly suicidal over Max's condition and quietly overdosed, I wouldn't be here, because the probability of that scenario is exponentially higher than what SDSO/defense claims happened.

RZ's murderer overplayed his hand staging her "suicide." In the end, he made the murder he committed look exactly like one.

 

[stmarysmead]

^^^This. According to the SDSO and defense theory, not only did RZ become suddenly suicidal in the middle of the night due to an alleged VM from JS, but she got bizarrely suicidal. Honestly, if she became suddenly suicidal over Max's condition and quietly overdosed, I wouldn't be here, because the probability of that scenario is exponentially higher than what SDSO/defense claims happened.

RZ's murderer overplayed his hand staging her "suicide." In the end, he made the murder he committed look exactly like one.

But she had already written...


&#8220;I find myself not being able to sleep for the first time in my entire life&#8230; now when I close my eyes my mind begins to race&#8230; thinking and brewing over many situations and trying to come up with a solution of some sort,&#8221; one of the messages read. &#8220;&#8230; if I am not thinking, I am crying.&#8221;


So she couldn&#8217;t sleep and was constantly crying before this...before she got any call. Who knows what the atmosphere was at dinner? Then she&#8217;s there, crying, all torn up, and he doesn&#8217;t answer any calls.

When he finally calls, it&#8217;s all bad news.

That&#8217;s the break point in my opinion.

 

[Brit]

Though Dina once suspected that Rebecca had been involved in Max’s death, she doesn’t believe that now. “I don’t have reason to believe that Rebecca killed Max,” Dina said in June. “Who would assault a six-year-old boy?” Dina thinks that there may have been someone else in the house whom the police never investigated Nor does she believe that Rebecca killed herself or that Adam was responsible. Rebecca’s death, she says, was the result of what attorney Anne Bremner called “rage and planning,” and there is no evidence that Adam knew her well enough to hate her. For her part, Nina wonders, “Does Adam know more than he’s saying? I just don’t know.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.to...6/shaknai-deaths-mystery-coronado-california/