Sleuthing Cindy's Depo & Baez Objections to Sealed Items

[MissJames]

Why would someone have a folding toothbrush in their cooler (pg 3738 of property form-items seized)?

Cindy did say she was in the habit of brushing after each meal but...come on - leaving one in the cooler for that?

TG LE searched every nook and cranny.I bet it has Caylee's dna on the bristles and an adult Anthony's fingerprints in the handle portion.They were too organized for it to be randomly tossed in there.JMO

 

[3doglady]

No worries. Followed Jolynna's advice and got them. :up:

Same for me. Thanks MM!

 

[mountaintime]

These documents say"
"vial"s??
As in little glass containers of something?
Or are the items contained in these..?

May be a dumb question....

 

[Jolynna]

Exhibit #22 is Casey's handwritten list of the evidence Baez had right?? The LE list of evidence obtained from Baez looks like the same items that are on Casey's handwritten list on exhibit #22. Page 3 of http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0730/20223432.pdf.

Could Baez have been trying to stop Cindy from talking because exhibits 22 & 23 are KC's notes from a meeting with him and covered under attorney client privilege?

 

[RubyB]

Didn't one of the lists of items retrieved pursuant to the search warrants (maybe the Dec. 11 one?) say "two handwritten notes" from Casey's dresser or something similar?

ETA: Sorry, the two notes were apparently taken from a chest in Caylee's room. I have no link...just googled and got lists put up by bloggers.

3D, you rock! So it doesn't seem like there should be anything privileged about these, or sealed, if they were obtained under a search warrant. Why is Baez making a big deal out of them?

Having seen them better now, all I can think is that JB thinks that they should be covered under attorney client privilege. I guess if CA acknowledged having seen them that would negate the privilege?

Why he would want Caylee's DNA back in early Sept is certainly open to speculation, but this is the proof that he did request these type of items from KC. Is there any indication that he didn't volunteer to give the items from this list to LE, but was forced to after the list was found? I can see this being an issue at trial and JB might be planning to skirt the issue by claiming privilege.

 

[Muzikman]

Having seen them better now, all I can think is that JB thinks that they should be covered under attorney client privilege. I guess if CA acknowledged having seen them that would negate the privilege?

Why he would want Caylee's DNA back in early Sept is certainly open to speculation, but this is the proof that he did request these type of items from KC. Is there any indication that he didn't volunteer to give the items from this list to LE, but was forced to after the list was found? I can see this being an issue at trial and JB might be planning to skirt the issue by claiming privilege.

Thank you RubyB, that kind of makes sense...

 

[3doglady]

Having seen them better now, all I can think is that JB thinks that they should be covered under attorney client privilege. I guess if CA acknowledged having seen them that would negate the privilege?

Why he would want Caylee's DNA back in early Sept is certainly open to speculation, but this is the proof that he did request these type of items from KC. Is there any indication that he didn't volunteer to give the items from this list to LE, but was forced to after the list was found? I can see this being an issue at trial and JB might be planning to skirt the issue by claiming privilege.

I'm not sure JB even realized the SA had his list until CA's depo. LDB gave CA the exhibit photo and then asked a few questions before JB realized what she was talking about and started objecting. There were media stories at the time stating how unethical it was for JB to withhold these items. I was wondering also if this could be brought up at trial. The only two people who could say that JB wrote the list are KC and JB and they will not testify.

 

[Valhall]

Okay, I really couldn't do much to make the pic of 22 more legible, but one thing I did do was mess with the exposure and contrast to show you something. There is a check mark next to straw, comb and bib, and then the - M next to mom. I thought I could see the M on the black and white, but now it's confirmed. Not sure what to make of that one.

P.S. What I thought read "register envelope" actually reads "regular envelope".

 

[steelergirl]

On the letter above posted by Valhall, why in the world does it say at the very end (at least what looks like) scotch tape then room temperature on the last line? What in the world would that mean????

BTW....awesome sleuthing on this thread...I agree with whomever said if I ever get in trouble I would want you guys on my side!!

 

[LeLe1953]

Me, too.

me too & this program has always worked in the past.

 

[Valhall]

To review...this page reads as follows:

Top right corner:
Pillow saliva
chewing gum

From top left:

Mom & Baby
Pacifier (spelled wrong - pacify)
straw
comb
bib
tooth
saliva (wash cloth band aid)

Mom - M
sterile swab
(regular envelope)
scotch tape
room temperature (spelled wrong - tempture)

 

[LeLe1953]

Just going on the logic that these folks tend to lie about just about anything and everything, I am going to believe the meeting took place and they received their messages from Casey...and I am going to go one step further than that and also believe that this was NOT the last time that this happened. Perhaps Jose typed KC's messages into his laptop and then just opened them up and let them read. It is difficult to imagine that they all went over a year with NO communication from KC...if she received letters AT the jail, would that info go on the record? I know George says he had written to her...if no letters were received, well...

ITA & the SA did keep asking if they ever saw anything ( letters) from KC that they were not allowed to take with them. This would be such a situation.

 

[salvarenga]

To review...this page reads as follows:

Top right corner:
Pillow saliva
chewing gum

From top left:

Mom & Baby
Pacifier (spelled wrong - pacify)
straw
comb
bib
tooth
saliva (wash cloth band aid)

Mom - M
sterile swab
(regular envelope)
scotch tape
room temperature (spelled wrong - tempture)

All of this has to do with gathering DNA. The objects are places one could expect to find DNA. The sterile swab would be needed to gather the DNA from let's say the mother or any person that was willing providing their DNA. You swab the inside of the cheek. It's called a buccal swab. You could then store the swab in a regular envelope and seal it with scotch tape. Then you would store it at room temperature until you could send it off to be analyzed.

This could have been a list from Baez or with that crazy family who knows. It could have even been a list that Cindy wrote up as pointers to Casey so that she could inconspicously gather DNA from any possible baby daddy. So they could send it off for testing. As a matter of fact she wouldn't even need the daddy, she could gather something from one of the daddy's parents to compare against or if the possible dad had other kids she could get one of the above listed objects from the other kid to compare against as well.

I still think there is something else sealed that had to do with conversation around these lists that we have yet to see.

 

[3doglady]

For Mom was he telling KC to take a sterile swab of CA's mouth, put it in a regular envelope, keep it at room temperature and bring it to him? Maybe the M stands for KC's Mom. He could get KC's DNA while she was in his office. He didn't want to write anything that would identify anyone. Hence the stooth for spiderman toothbrush.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Having seen them better now, all I can think is that JB thinks that they should be covered under attorney client privilege. I guess if CA acknowledged having seen them that would negate the privilege?

Why he would want Caylee's DNA back in early Sept is certainly open to speculation, but this is the proof that he did request these type of items from KC. Is there any indication that he didn't volunteer to give the items from this list to LE, but was forced to after the list was found? I can see this being an issue at trial and JB might be planning to skirt the issue by claiming privilege.

The results of the dna testing JB had done were also included in that Fedex box weren't they? And we haven't seen them!! Is this what it's about? Were these results sealed? If not, why haven't we see them? The questioning of gathering the items to be tested might have made JB fear that the results would be the next question ~ or was that "top picture" a copy of the results? I dunno but it sure has to be somehow connected to the two lists!

 

[Valhall]

On the letter above posted by Valhall, why in the world does it say at the very end (at least what looks like) scotch tape then room temperature on the last line? What in the world would that mean????

BTW....awesome sleuthing on this thread...I agree with whomever said if I ever get in trouble I would want you guys on my side!!

This could have something to do with it.

http://www.bioforensics.com/conference04/Evidence_Collection/HAT_Collection.pdf

It talks about using hydrophilic adhesive tape (and names scotch as a brand) for taking DNA samples versus taking buccal swabs.

 

[3doglady]

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/13357630/Baez_OCSOpackage Baez did get DNA for Cindy, KC, and Caylee. So I'm assuming the M stands for KC's Mom.

 

[TakeNote]

To review...this page reads as follows:

Top right corner:
Pillow saliva
chewing gum

From top left:

Mom & Baby
Pacifier (spelled wrong - pacify)
straw
comb
bib
tooth
saliva (wash cloth band aid)

Mom - M
sterile swab
(regular envelope)
scotch tape
room temperature (spelled wrong - tempture)

the first above things looks like DNA seeking things for caylee

the second list ....i think is for KC

mom-m ....from moms mouth
sterile swab....for DNA from her mouth
regular envelope.....to send the things in
scotch tape.....i think for hair samples
room tempture.....keep swab with mouth sample room temp?

sorry....this was all posted already

 

[LeLe1953]

For Mom was he telling KC to take a sterile swab of CA's mouth, put it in a regular envelope, keep it at room temperature and bring it to him? Maybe the M stands for KC's Mom. He could get KC's DNA while she was in his office. He didn't want to write anything that would identify anyone. Hence the stooth for spiderman toothbrush.

For what it's worth, here is my take on the DNA & the "missing" tooth. What if, like some said yesterday, Cindy did find one of Caylee's teeth in that trunk when she cleaned it after the tow yard. I don't think any of us believe for a second Cindy bought into KC's stories about why KC wasn't coming home or why she couldn't talk to Caylee. I also don't think CIndy would have thrown that tooth away. I think she would have used it to confront KC, perhaps thinking Caylee had been hurt & KC didnt want her to know since Cindy was always telling her she was a crappy mom. Following me? I hope so. OR maybe she found it when she kept pacing in between the house & garage as Lee was talking to KC...the sudden "what have you done comment," perhaps shoving it her face & then KC comes up with Nanny story.
Cindy, wanting, needing to always be in control, would not have given KC or LE that tooth ( just as she didnt LE zanny's phone number, ya really believe she didnt remember she had it) Remember Cindy said KC's lanyard was in HER dresser drawer & she didnt know how it got there. Maybe she actually had put the tooth in her drawer & KC found it. KC is ***** enough to put her own lanyard in its place as her own way to control her mother. SO, in the end KC has the tooth & that is what she took to JB & that is why they needed all this other stuff to compare DNA. Make sense? At the time, Cindy was insistent LE took that lanyard, she kept saying it was a bag by the washer, washer is in the garage, we now know KC did in fact go in the garage that first night. It would make sense if Cindy confronted KC with the tooth before the cops got there, KC knew mom had the tooth but of course Cindy did not know KC had taken the lanyard. I think it was probably much later, after her release that the tooth went missing. I think KC got it, she was after all sleeping her moms room.

 

[countzero]

The results of the dna testing JB had done were also included in that Fedex box weren't they? And we haven't seen them!! Is this what it's about? Were these results sealed? If not, why haven't we see them? The questioning of gathering the items to be tested might have made JB fear that the results would be the next question ~ or was that "top picture" a copy of the results? I dunno but it sure has to be somehow connected to the two lists!

Brain cells just fired on reading your post.

Remember for months the rumor who Caylee's father was ..... LE specifically had the FBI rule out any family members. But suppose KC was telling JB another nefarious story about Caylee's parentage.

Who do the pillow saliva and chewing gum belong to? GA and/or LA.
Why would articles apparently for DNA testing be needed in Aug 08. And if KC did tell JB where Caylee was, why would he need articles for DNA confirmation? Unless KC told JB CA murdered Caylee.

And are these the only pages or are there more with reference to this specific page?

Color me confused on this one.