State v Bradley Cooper 4-13-11

[momof7]

My opinion of defense attorneys and prosecutors changed drastically with the Duke Lacrosse case. That case is not an anomaly. Just look at the number of prisoner's freed based on DNA to KNOW that prosecutors & PD lie and railroad. I would much rather a hundred guilty go free than an innocent be imprisoned for something they didn't do.

Don't get me wrong -- I want the guilty held accountable but I no longer trust prosecutors as I once (naively) did.

I agree. This is the reason I was so on the fence. The Duke Case and the SBI/PD issues re: DNA and blood evidence I was hesitant to believe automatic guilt without proof. 10 years ago..even 5 years ago..I wouldn't have been so quick to be on the fence. I would have believed the rumors as facts to convict. Those incidents have changed my mindset a lot and I am not as niave to things as well.

Kelly

 

[ncsu95]

Thanks for answering my question. I have one other question: Were the google maps in 2008 for that area different than today's google map. In today's google maps, fielding is not in the center of that area code search. As for Kurtz, I see it that he is just doing his job of defending BC.

I think Kurtz has been incredibly effective in this case. He has quickly neutralized the testimony of just about every witness. We'll see if he has anything for this evidence.

 

[SleuthSayer]

Well, SleuthSayer, Zell may have done a good job muddying waters - but you did a terrific, if not an excellent job at translating geek-speak into layman's lingo for me! I'm impressed, I actually learned a little about what was all going on there! Thank you so much for the simplicity.

I spend way more time than any human should have to breaking technical issues down into crude pictures on whiteboards for executives. :boohoo: Any time you want a translation, page me and I'll take a shot at it. :wink:

 

[Just the Fax]

My opinion of defense attorneys and prosecutors changed drastically with the Duke Lacrosse case. That case is not an anomaly. Just look at the number of prisoner's freed based on DNA to KNOW that prosecutors & PD lie and railroad. I would much rather a hundred guilty go free than an innocent be imprisoned for something they didn't do.

Don't get me wrong -- I want the guilty held accountable but I no longer trust prosecutors as I once (naively) did.

If Kurtz wasn't using 'tactics' an appeal might be granted on the basis of ineffective counsel.

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

 

[momof7]

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

I think early on I was wondering if it was possible that CPD was looking too closely at one angle and not others. NC was found in an area with a lot of construction, really off the beaten path unless you had been there before. I was a little concerned that not all possibilities were looked into. I understood that the spouse/closest people were the ones looked at first but I was having a hard time initially.

I was waiting for the trail so that I could see the evidence and know for sure that they had it together. I wasn't so sure up until yesterday when the computer evidence was brought forth. It WILL be interesting to me to see the Defense side of this case. Do/will they be able to give enough reasonable doubt that someone else/all these coincidences = not guilty. I really don't think so.

Kelly

 

[Cheyenne130]

I think early on I was wondering if it was possible that CPD was looking too closely at one angle and not others. NC was found in an area with a lot of construction, really off the beaten path unless you had been there before. I was a little concerned that not all possibilities were looked into. I understood that the spouse/closest people were the ones looked at first but I was having a hard time initially.

I was waiting for the trail so that I could see the evidence and know for sure that they had it together. I wasn't so sure up until yesterday when the computer evidence was brought forth. It WILL be interesting to me to see the Defense side of this case. Do/will they be able to give enough reasonable doubt that someone else/all these coincidences = not guilty. I really don't think so.

Kelly

My prediction (and what generally happens in other cases) is that the prosecution will neutralize the defense witnesses and the defense case will actually end up strengthening the prosecution case.

 

[Maja]

@JTF

Thanks for posting the photo! I have been following this case pretty closely since 2008, and I have seen this before, but looking at your picture really brings how close, yet secluded that place is... IMO he did not think she would be found for MONTHS there. Just wow!

Explains BCs moaning when NCs body was found. He was mortified his spot was found, IMO. Human skin blends really well in that place. I'm so thankful for the man walking his dog and I have (sadly) new respect for turkey vultures.

 

[johnfear]

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

The discovery of the railroad a la Nifong and the influence of the university of that particular case allowed it far more exposure. That was an anomaly.

This area is riddled with police corruption. Kurtz is capitalizing on CPB in Cary PD just having stepped into the job six months earlier amid rumors she ran the former chief out.

If you'd like me to detail the riddling, I will on a separate thread. Because, if you guys are suggesting that North Carolina, VA and SC having corrupt cops is anomalous, you'd be wrong.

 

[cody100]

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

Yes, I will agree that most prosecutors are not corrupt as in the above mentioned case. I don't think it is bad to have checks and balances either.
CPD imo were not corrupt, just inept and maybe inexperienced. Errors were made, but I don't think for one moment that they planted any inormation on his computer. I am guessing Kurtz is going to say the time stamp is off. Who knows. We shall see.

 

[less0305]

Thanks for the lecture jf, but I know what the role of a defense attorney is in our system of justice. Doesn't mean I have to like their tactics when I feel they are using the 'system' to free a cold blooded killer. Again, JMO.

Take the Westerfield (is that right?) case where the attorney knew 100% his client was guilty and tried to pass the "child" *advertiser censored* on the computer off on his client's own son - and his *advertiser censored**hole client sat there and let him do it. Despicable.

 

[cityslick]

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

I chalk up a lot of what CPD did in this case as 'inexperience' to this type of investigation. I'm sure if they had it to do over again they would do some things differently.

1. IMO it was a mistake for the police chief to go in front of cameras 2 days after NC was found and proclaim it wasn't random when the investigation had barely started. All this did was kickstart the idea that they were only focusing on BC (which even if true, you don't announce that to the media).

2. Det. Young should of never handled her cell phone. I'll never understand why he thought he should be the one to do that when he had no experience in cell phone forensics/passwords/etc.

3. The officer who saw the straw should of at least mentioned it to Daniels to bring it to his attention. The error would of been even more magnified if they didn't have the Fielding google searches.

Those are just off the top of my head, I'm sure there are some other things that were probably not done the way it should of been.

 

[Lori59]

Take the Westerfield (is that right?) case where the attorney knew 100% his client was guilty and tried to pass the "child" *advertiser censored* on the computer off on his client's own son - and his *advertiser censored**hole client sat there and let him do it. Despicable.

AND, Westerfield had try to make a plea deal, if he showed them where the body of that little girl was, so the defense KNEW he was guilty and yet destroyed the parents in that trial.

 

[momof7]

My prediction (and what generally happens in other cases) is that the prosecution will neutralize the defense witnesses and the defense case will actually end up strengthening the prosecution case.

I agree. There is no doubt that the defense will bring on the reasonable doubt, I am hoping the Pros can neutralize them with facts and not innuendo and rumor. Up until yesterday that seemed to be the entire Prosecution case. No real evidence that BC did it. Did he have opportunity and motive and ability...sure. There was no real tangible moment until yesterday that they had more and concrete evidence.

Kelly

 

[less0305]

Explains BCs moaning when NCs body was found. He was mortified his spot was found, IMO. Human skin blends really well in that place. I'm so thankful for the man walking his dog and I have (sadly) new respect for turkey vultures.

Which is the precipice (did I get that world right?) for his googling attorneys the very next day!! He knew his goose was cooked as soon as her body was found as quickly as it was.

 

[momof7]

I chalk up a lot of what CPD did in this case as 'inexperience' to this type of investigation. I'm sure if they had it to do over again they would do some things differently.

1. IMO it was a mistake for the police chief to go in front of cameras 2 days after NC was found and proclaim it wasn't random when the investigation had barely started. All this did was kickstart the idea that they were only focusing on BC (which even if true, you don't announce that to the media).

2. Det. Young should of never handled her cell phone. I'll never understand why he thought he should be the one to do that when he had no experience in cell phone forensics/passwords/etc.

3. The officer who saw the straw should of at least mentioned it to Daniels to bring it to his attention. The error would of been even more magnified if they didn't have the Fielding google searches.

Those are just off the top of my head, I'm sure there are some other things that were probably not done the way it should of been.

Yes, it should be interesting..the appeals portion of this case.

 

[bloghooligan]

I respectfully disagree.
The Duke Lacrosse case was indeed a huge anomaly.
The entire saga centered around a greedy and criminally corrupt prosecutor. Yes, the defense attorneys got to ride in wearing their white hats for a change to see that justice was served. In this case, Kurtz is trying to say CPD was corrupt as well. To me, based on the evidence I have seen, that was a totally inappropriate, groundless accusation.

I respectfully disagree -- read some of the cases of the >200 people freed based on DNA evidence. While witness testimony is highest on the list of the reasons for the false convictions, MANY of the cases involve misconduct on the part of PD, prosecutors and/or their witnesses.

Whether we like him or not (or think he's evil slime) BC deserves the best defense available. Perhaps CPD is not corrupt, inept tho?? Prosecutors in the Duke case argued against allowing the information from CM's phone into evidence (and it DID provide exculpatory evidence) .... CPD just erased NC's.

 

[Just the Fax]

I respectfully disagree -- read some of the cases of the >200 people freed based on DNA evidence. While witness testimony is highest on the list of the reasons for the false convictions, MANY of the cases involve misconduct on the part of PD, prosecutors and/or their witnesses.

Whether we like him or not (or think he's evil slime) BC deserves the best defense available. Perhaps CPD is not corrupt, inept tho?? Prosecutors in the Duke case argued against allowing the information from CM's phone into evidence (and it DID provide exculpatory evidence) .... CPD just erased NC's.

Unless you think CPD was criminally corrupt by tampering with and adding incriminating evidence to frame BC, your argument doesn't hold water. Yes, some of their investigation included errors...some things that would further incriminate BC (no photo of his neck and finger scratches)

 

[cityslick]

Unless you think CPD was criminally corrupt by tampering with and adding incriminating evidence to frame BC, your argument doesn't hold water.

I don't think so but with some of the stuff I listed above, I don't think it's wrong to question it either.

 

[Just the Fax]

I don't think so but with some of the stuff I listed above, I don't think it's wrong to question it either.

Big difference in inexperience and honest mistakes made vs felony corruption by CPD to frame BC.

 

[luckyme]

Im multitasking today. So how will we know what is going on in court room? Is there any posters there?