Trial Discussion Thread #52 - 14.11.9, Day 41 ~announcement of the verdict~

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I am not sure if I can watch any more of this tonight. :mad:
 
Naturally gutted - like many of you - with Masipa's justifications for her acquittal on dolus eventualis. Don't really want to have to wait a couple of years to find out if State's likely appeal wins and her verdict for CH is overturned.

Sadly I can't keep up with the trial live due to work but, off topic and hopefully not repeating what others have said, I urge posters to read the Sam Taylor revelations in yesterdays Daily Mirror which, as it's a tabloid, is forbidden to quote from here(?)

If some of you want to disbelieve Sam as a lying, gold-digging, scorned woman then she must have had to do quite a bit of research on behaviour in classic Domestic Abuse scenarios.

It is mind-blowing and sickening. As a human being I could always find a small vestige of empathy for OP re his deserved comeuppance in SA BUT even that's now gone.
Personally, I believe her motivations are sincere ( she is a "survivor" telling her story) regardless of how much she got paid.
A lot of the stuff he did to ST, was not even in rage.
Cold, calculated abuse.
 
With all due respect to judge Marsipa, could it be that, at nearly 67 years old, she is simply too old to be on the bench? I believe she really got mixed up on the basic concept of "dolus eventualis," among other things. I know a lot of folks are still sharp minded into their 80's, but I think everyone starts to get extended "senior moments" in their 60's.
 
Val1 said:
To be fair, she couldn't tell stories about things she wasn't asked or crossed on, correct? Plus, who would have believed her, it's the "golden boy" of SA's word against hers and she'd already been portrayed as some bitter little witch with an axe to grind.
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She was a witness for the prosecution, if at anytime she was in fear for her life during their relationship, I'm pretty certain Nel would have brought it up?? That was the crux of their case..that OP killed Reeva in a fit of rage. Lol, I now have to go back and see exactly what she testified.
 
cottonweaver said:
Naturally gutted - like many of you - with Masipa's justifications for her acquittal on dolus eventualis. Don't really want to have to wait a couple of years to find out if State's likely appeal wins and her verdict for CH is overturned.

Sadly I can't keep up with the trial live due to work but, off topic and hopefully not repeating what others have said, I urge posters to read the Sam Taylor revelations in yesterdays Daily Mirror which, as it's a tabloid, is forbidden to quote from here(?)

If some of you want to disbelieve Sam as a lying, gold-digging, scorned woman then she must have had to do quite a bit of research on behaviour in classic Domestic Abuse scenarios.

It is mind-blowing and sickening.
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Read it and weep everyone. :cry: I believe every word ST said.
 
steveml said:
The so-called legal experts have been wrong on many things thus far. The TV lawyers have been are as bad as the press for sensationalising minor technicalities in an effort to retain public interest. It's worth remembering that many of these lawyers have as much experience at losing cases as they have of winning.
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I'm sure the 2 highly respected professors of SA law that both quoted that Masipa made an error in law in her judgement, will both thank you for your high praise in their opinion
 
Carol70 said:
She was a witness for the prosecution, if at anytime she was in fear for her life during their relationship, I'm pretty certain Nel would have brought it up?? That was the crux of their case..that OP killed Reeva in a fit of rage. Lol, I now have to go back and see exactly what she testified.
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Unfortunately I don't think Nel could lead character evidence at that stage in the trial. Perhaps another reason he should have reopened his case?
 
vanatos said:
He comes from old money, maybe socially people will give him crap, but he wont lack for food, shelter or luxury.

And there won't be a lack of girls willing to be attached to someone with old money.
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Wonder if the buxom blonde sitting next to his sister yesterday is his girlfriend.
 
Just heard on ENCA that there was an identical case to OP's being heard in the courtroom next to Op's at the same time, how weird. It was a guy who shot & killed his girlfriend in the middle of the night also. I would love to know the judgement in that case, are there any locals who can help us with this?
 
Carol70 said:
She was a witness for the prosecution, if at anytime she was in fear for her life during their relationship, I'm pretty certain Nel would have brought it up?? That was the crux of their case..that OP killed Reeva in a fit of rage. Lol, I now have to go back and see exactly what she testified.
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LOL?! - it was inadmissable evidence.................
 
With this case as precedent, I don't even know why SA needs dolus eventualis anymore. Haha
 
Mr Fossil said:
Seems clear to me that Masipa only tests Dolus in respect of the deceased rather than a person.

She agrees that he thinks there are intruders in the toilet at the time he fires four shots.

She says he acted unlawfully. I agree and if the test is applied to a person (the intruders) then it is Dolus.
She thinks it's improbable that OP could have made up a story ("it was an intruder") so quickly and maintained such a consistent story. I disagree. It's such a simple story to conceive and relate (it's only a few words) and he didn't have much option. He then went on to develop the story for the bail hearing, plea affidavit, evidence in chief and cross examination ... tailoring it as the evidence worked against him. It then became inconsistent.
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BBM

This is the error in law all the experts were alluding to.
 
Viper said:
OP will be convicted of CH tomorrow AJ. He's going to get a heavy prison sentence for that and for a couple of the weapons laws violations. And whether or not that happens the Pit Bull is still going to appeal all of it and go for Murder, seeking an even longer sentence. OP is caught up in the SA criminal justice system and getting out of it will take him at least two decades. Masipa is just his first step, that's how it works, and it is a beoch!!!! :smile:
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BBM So the PT can appeal the verdict? Is there no double jeopardy rule in SA?
 
aptopix_south_africa_pistorius_trial_34108993.jpg


http://o.canada.com/news/world/world-world/oscar-pistorius-murder-trial-not-guilty-of-murder-512263


Reeva's dad looking at OP yesterday. So heartbreaking for Mr and Mrs Steenkamp, what must they be thinking/saying? :(
 
Mr Fossil said:
I've seen something somewhere about this. Double jeopardy does apply in South Africa. I'll do some digging.

ETA: This report is interesting, see 2.14 onwards. http://www.justice.gov.za/salrc/reports/r_prj73_appeal_2000dec.pdf

This article is also interesting: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/oscar-pistorius-judge-error-prosecutors-article-1.1936371
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:gasp: the first article is 109 pages! Cliff notes needed as it's 2:09 and I didn't go to sleep yet...thinking 3:30 a:m would be a short session and I would be :eek:fftobed: at 4:30 am
 
atthelake said:
:gasp: the first article is 109 pages! Cliff notes needed as it's 2:09 and I didn't go to sleep yet...thinking 3:30 a:m would be a short session and I would be :eek:fftobed: at 4:30 am
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Here's hoping you're right about it being a short session. :)
 
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