TX - Uvalde; Robb Elementary, 19 children and 3 adults killed, shooter dead, 24 MAY 2022

[Friday Fan]

The feds determined that Salvador Ramos acted alone with no connection to outside groups.

Since the Border Patrol was active in the response, I'm hoping more will come of this

We have Texas DPS and their investigation, so hopefully the feds will provide another set of eyes.

 

[Seattle1]

I wonder if the door was propped open regularly. How many days of school cctv footage is likely to be available to investigators?

Would their be cctv from other buildings that may show external doors of the school, or are those buildings too far away?

What about car dashcam footage? ^^bbm

Initially, I believed the door may have been unlocked because of the award assembly held at the school that concluded only about 30 minutes before the shoot was on campus.

However, after today's presser with the head of DPS, he provided that a teacher propped open the door to retrieve their phone (presumably from their vehicle parked outside). I don't think propping the door open is a regular occurrence.

Also, I believe the teacher propping open the door was detected by surveillance video so I do think video coverage exists at this location. MOO

 

[Ravenmoon]

Let's make sure we have the full story before hurling judgment at the officers for not going in. They probably didn't know if he had a bomb, accomplices, etc. and that "going in" would increase the casualty count.

Typically, I would side with your statement...but unless the facts that are surfacing are somehow inaccurate- this feels impossible.

Little kids were calling 911 repeatedly..begging for help. That is what hurts me the most. Little kids...telling 911 their class mates are dead- but there are lives left to be saved.

I don't know- maybe I shouldn't judge, but 1 hour and 15 minutes. I know the goal was not to lose innocent lives...but after that long- it just feels like a sacrifice.

MOO

 

[Lexiintoronto]

There appears to be several hundred windows in Robb Elementary. I'm sure they are not bullet proof. The shooter could have opted to shoot them out to enter the school. He could have shot out the window in the back door where he entered.

The school is spread out, he could have entered and killed several people before half the school would have been aware that children were being killed. If he was athletic there are numerous ways he could have climbed on the roof; climbing on top of several air conditioning units; fencing close to the building that would allow him to get up there.

The gym or auditorium appears to have clerestory windows which could have allowed him to kill numerous people. If he'd been there one hour earlier he could have lain on the roof and shot children and their parents during their graduation. He could have just walked around on the roof taking pot shots into the classrooms below. The ammunition he used would have made that easy. He could have picked them off one by one when they ran from the buildings.

He could have run back and forth from building to building using the covered walkway as a means of transport. He could have done a lot of things that no one can ever prepare for. I don't think this guy expected to survive the event so thinking a locked door would have stopped him is short sighted, imo.

If there was a film taken of this event from beginning to end, we could rewind it pointing out every short fall that occurred up to his death. There: the open door, there: no officer on site, there: no armed teachers: etc etc etc. But the problem is the beginning of the event wasn't filmed when this young man was able to buy two high powered rifles online and ammunition used by US military. The ammunition was introduced to cut costs as a lighter product producing less recoil as the 7.62 mm but being able to travel at supersonic speed and still be able to pierce a standard issue ballistic helmet at 500 yards. Think about that for a while. He was an 18 year old who was able to buy that product. He couldn't drink until he was 21 but he was able to buy bullets that would obliterate a child's body into a pink mist.

Link to US Defense News YT video regarding 5.56 ammo.

Excellent post.

 

[Seattle1]

I wonder why that door was unlocked to begin with.

We learned today from the presser that the door was NOT unlocked but propped open by a teacher that went out (presumably to their vehicle) to allegedly retrieve their cell phone. It's unknown why the teacher did not close the door after re-entering the building. If the teacher was interviewed about the incident, no further information was disclosed to the public during the press update.

 

[steeltowngirl]

A minute-by-minute break timeline of Uvalde school shooting

Here, a minute-by-minute breakdown of how the shooting in Uvalde folded and how police did nothing while waiting for back up because they thought all of the kids in the classroom were dead.

www.dailymail.co.uk

View attachment 346468

Wait. There were 19 cops in the hallway at 12:03 pm? And the monster was alive until 12:50. He shot the door at 12:26 pm. I thought police thought he was already dead when they entered? What happened between 12:26 and 12:50?

 

[K9Enzo]

May 27 Texas school massacre news

Nineteen children and two teachers were killed in a shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, on Tuesday, the Texas Department for Public Safety said. Follow here for the latest news updates.

www.cnn.com

​

CNN analyst explains why a school district police chief took control as "incident commander" during shooting​

From CNN's Dave Alsup

Anthony Barksdale, CNN law enforcement analyst and former acting Baltimore Police Commissioner, offered some context as to why larger law enforcement agencies responding Tuesday to the deadly mass shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, were taking commands from the school district's police chief as they arrived on scene.


But if officers on the scene of an incident come to believe the "incident commander" is making the wrong calls, they can ignore or overrule his decisions, Barksdale said. "And you face him later on and... deal with it," he added.

"This was a case where they should have kept the pressure up; kept engaged trying to breach that door and deal with this shooter,” Barksdale continued. "If things get quiet, if there’s a lull, maybe there’s a weapon malfunction. Maybe he’s trying to reload. Maybe he’s out of ammo. And that’s the time to get him. You keep going; you pour it on. You put the pressure on, and you don’t stop until that threat is completely incapacitated."

“You’re going in there to kill this shooter. Those little kids deserved that on that day,” said an emotional Barksdale. “And they didn’t get it."

In dog training I call it intelligent disobedience.

I’m struggling with the information coming out that the officers in that hallway felt the IC was making the right call. This had to feel wrong to many of them. I’m trying to reserve judgment, but I have a strong feeling this is going to blow up as the investigation continues. IMO

 

[Dotta]

What I find incredible is that there is an expectation that doors are bolted at all times lest a person come through it and randomly murder school children. It sounds like a problem found only in a war zone in a developing nation.

But, I don't live in the US <modsnip>

The safety of pupils is utmost priority.
School is not a place where anybody can just walk into.
(Thieves, kidnappers, drunk people, etc)

 

[Seattle1]

Authorities say security video shows the back door of Texas school was propped open by a teacher just before the gunman attacked the school

Police believe the propped-open door was used by the gunman to enter Robb Elementary School on Tuesday.

www.insider.com

Security footage from Robb Elementary School in Texas shows that a back door was propped open by a teacher before Tuesday's deadly mass shooting, Texas law enforcement officials said.

At 11:27 a.m. on Tuesday morning, the door that police believe was used by the 18-year-old gunman to enter the school was propped open by a teacher, Director of Texas Department of Public Safety Steven McCraw said at a Friday press conference.

McCraw said the detail was confirmed through "video evidence."

After the gunman crashed his vehicle in a ditch just a minute later, the teacher ran to get a phone and walked back to the propped-open door.

 

[x_files]

Typically, I would side with your statement...but unless the facts that are surfacing are somehow inaccurate- this feels impossible.

Little kids were calling 911 repeatedly..begging for help. That is what hurts me the most. Little kids...telling 911 their class mates are dead- but there are lives left to be saved.

I don't know- maybe I shouldn't judge, but 1 hour and 15 minutes. I know the goal was not to lose innocent lives...but after that long- it just feels like a sacrifice.

MOO

I think maybe we'd feel better if the cops admitted they didn't know what they were doing and were afraid, rather than stonewalling and giving us 12 different versions of the "truth."

 

[Lexiintoronto]

ABC’s timeline (scroll down): Timeline: How the shooting at a Texas elementary school unfolded

WFAA quick, detailed timeline based on the news conference details:

 

[Sundog]

I'm sure she does, but her mistake was human error or carelessness which I find easier to excuse than the officers

I'm praying for her too.

I'm praying for all of the victims of this shooter, including the teacher and the officers who had to make some difficult decisions in the midst of this tragedy.

 

[steeltowngirl]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>
Screenshot of text in here School Drop-Out Gave Warning on Facebook Minutes Before Uvalde Massacre

 

[x_files]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>
Here's a bit of an update he was threatening girls with rape online WEEKS BEFORE the shooting.

Uvalde gunman threatened rapes and school shootings on social media app Yubo in weeks leading up to the massacre, users say | CNN

Salvador Ramos told girls he would rape them, showed off a rifle he bought, and threatened to shoot up schools in livestreams on the social media app Yubo, according to several users who witnessed the threats in recent weeks.

www.cnn.com

 

[Seattle1]

The Texan Working Overtime to Customize 19 Little Caskets

The nation’s only child-coffin maker is shipping them to Trey Ganem, who is determined that each massacre victim’s resting place tells the story of their young life.

www.thedailybeast.com

 

[Wise Old Owl]

UVALDE, Texas, May 25 (Reuters) - The Texas gunman who murdered 19 children and two teachers posted an online message warning that he was going to shoot up an elementary school minutes before he attacked, Governor Greg Abbott said on Wednesday, as harrowing new details of the massacre emerged. Minutes before school attack, Texas gunman sent online warning


It has come out that this girl was in Germany and they are speaking with her. She did not know him or why he decided to "talk" to her.

Yes, his online footprint should be interesting, although I remember seeing they didn't have internet at home - but he don't need it really if he had a phone. AND the argument with grandma that morning was over him paying for his own cell phone......................

 

[Bravo]

Yes so many gaps. Early reports are often skewed yet this had a different "feel" from the start. Things just were not making sense with the timeline. I'm still devastated by this. As we all are.

 

[MimosaMornings]

So if the SRO wasn't at the school was he on lunch break? If so shouldn't there be an officer at the post while he is out to lunch?
That part confuses me because it leaves the school a wide-open soft target right at lunch every day and anyone could easily figure this out by simple recon mission.

In my area - there are full-time school resource officers to all high schools and middle schools. Not elementary schools.

 

[steeltowngirl]

It does seem waiting for a key to get into the classroom would have been correct protocol once the monster was confirmed to be taken down. But why were police waiting - if they hadn’t confirmed he was in custody or dead?

This is from an article after the Michigan school shooting.
He maintained, however, that officers should never knock on doors during campus shootings or ask students to let them into classrooms. Instead, officers clearing the building should have access to a master key so they can enter classrooms “in a non-threatening way.”

“The doors are secured for a reason: Once you’re locked in, you don’t move until the threat comes into the classroom or an authority figure opens that door and lets everyone know it’s clear,” Canady said. The video showing the students’ unwillingness to open the classroom door suggests “that this is a school that has trained properly on lockdowns and trained students as to what to do.”

‘Look at My Badge, Bro’: Viral Video Inside Shooting-Scarred Michigan School Prompts Conversation about Active Shooter Drills

During a mass school shooting Tuesday that left four students dead, teens in one Michigan classroom were forced to grapple with whether they should trust emergency responders — or if someone claiming to be the police was the gunman in disguise. The incident, captured in a viral social media...

www.the74million.org

 

[Sundog]

Brian Entin
@BrianEntin

“It was the wrong decision. Period. There is no excuse for that.” Even as children called 911 and begged for help, the gunman at a Uvalde, Texas, elementary school was treated as a barricaded subject, and not an active shooter, TX DPS says. [News video at link]
2:32 PM · May 27, 2022

https://twitter.com/x/status/1530301009385377792

Note that he prefaced this statement with "With the benefit of hindsight . . . it was the wrong decision."