UK - 39 bodies found in lorry container, Essex, 23 Oct 2019 #2

[alice500]

Brief list of who I can gather up from links on these threads as the players in this ring:

One also wonders whether the 100 Vietnamese people who were attempting illegal entry into the UK, should also be added ... they were after all... "players in this ring"?

Perhaps a little more attention should be given to the stories of these individuals..

We seem to know little except the list of names of the 39 who died.

Of these Pham Thi Tra My has had an amount of coverage in the press, due to the harrowing text message, and reports that she had already been in the UK, caught, and sent back (to ?????) , only to try again?

And the teenage boy (was he named?) who had been in a "safe haven" for migrants in Belgium.

 

[CSIDreamer]

@alice500

Twice now, you've quoted me but edited my original post to suit the point you want to make.

If there's a sentence you want to highlight, you can actually change that to bold within my post you're quoting and then add BBM (bolded by me).

Thank you.

 

[alice500]

@alice500

Twice now, you've quoted me but edited my original post to suit the point you want to make.

If there's a sentence you want to highlight, you can actually change that to bold within my post you're quoting and then add BBM (bolded by me).

Thank you.

BBM ...?

 

[CSIDreamer]

BBM ...?

Yes, thanks.

 

[HongKongPhooey]

One also wonders whether the 100 Vietnamese people who were attempting illegal entry into the UK, should also be added ... they were after all... "players in this ring"?

Perhaps a little more attention should be given to the stories of these individuals..

We seem to know little except the list of names of the 39 who died.

Of these Pham Thi Tra My has had an amount of coverage in the press, due to the harrowing text message, and reports that she had already been in the UK, caught, and sent back (to ?????) , only to try again?

And the teenage boy (was he named?) who had been in a "safe haven" for migrants in Belgium.

Yes indeed, utterly tragic for the poor people who died. I hope their stories may be told one day to highlight their desperate plight. However, we should make it clear they were victims, not players.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Here's a dose of reality. Pictures.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...odbye-daughter.html?__twitter_impression=true

 

[CSIDreamer]

More photos.

Repatriation of Essex lorry victims to Vietnam completed

 

[alice500]

Yes indeed, utterly tragic for the poor people who died. I hope their stories may be told one day to highlight their desperate plight. However, we should make it clear they were victims, not players.

Are we in a position to determine who are victims?

Maybe this depends on the frame of reference, and knowing all the facts?

The Irish Sun posted an article which painted truck drivers as victims...
(shown earlier in this thread)

Right wing publications try to portray illegal immigrants as perpetrators ..

I think you are right .... the stories of each individual involved are needed to shed more light on this matter.

 

[Sera]

Are we in a position to determine who are victims?

Maybe this depends on the frame of reference, and knowing all the facts?

The Irish Sun posted an article which painted truck drivers as victims...
(shown earlier in this thread)

Right wing publications try to portray illegal immigrants as perpetrators ..

I think you are right .... the stories of each individual involved are needed to shed more light on this matter.

BBM

Yes, the people who died in the back of a lorry are victims.

 

[CaptainNancy]

The crime being investigated is the death of 39 people in the back of a lorry and how they came to be in the lorry, and dead.

Some truck drivers are reported to be victims of migrants trying to board their vehicles, some lorry drivers report being victims of grooming attempts. However, if they have been groomed, they are still a part of a network that aims to put people in the back of sealed lorries...and the migrants are the victims of that.

The T&C of this forum are clear about being victim-orientated and not victim blaming.

 

[alice500]

Thank you, CaptainNancy, for clarifying the terms of reference for this thread.

I would also like to apologise to anyone who felt any of my posts to be victim blaming. That is not, and never was, my intention.

How they came to be in the back of the lorry? ... it has been suggested that this is the "grass route" that they and their families borrowed the money to buy.

People smuggling from Vietnam to Europe: The facts

'Grass' or 'VIP'? How rural Vietnamese make treacherous journey to Europe



How they came to be dead?..... is missing a lot of information ..

Starting with times and causes of death ...

 

[CaptainNancy]

Thanks alice500. It is such a sensitive case, in the midst of a complex issue. Sorry if I sounded accusatory / bossy.

I suspect that not all the victims were travelling under the same t&c. Some may have paid for what they thought was a better method of travel, some not, and I worry a lot about the unaccompanied minor who had vanished from a minors asylum centre. Given what happens to many.

And you are right: the time and cause and location if death has not been made public. That information must be central to the police evidence, and so might not be stated until the trials.

 

[HayLouise]

7 December 2019

Police have refused to be drawn on why arrest warrants have not been issued for two Irish fugitives wanted in connection with the deaths of 39 people.

An international manhunt is underway for brothers Ronan and Christopher Hughes whom police suspect of manslaughter and people trafficking.

Detectives in Essex describe the hauliers brothers from Co Armagh, as “wanted”.

Essex deaths: No arrest warrants for 'wanted' fugitive Hughes brothers

 

[HayLouise]

More:


Investigation timeline

• October 23: 39 bodies discovered in container and driver Mo Robinson arrested.
• October 23: Ronan Hughes phones police in England
• October 30: Mirror reveals details of phone call from Hughes to investigators
• October 31: An ‘R Hughes’ lorry is stopped, searched and seized by PSNI in Lisburn
• November 1: Essex police confirm Ronan Hughes contacted them by phone
• November 7: Gardai launch a series of raids targeting Hughes brothers
• November 29: Christopher Hughes lost his heavy goods vehicles licence
• December 6: Police describe Hughes brothers as “wanted”.

Essex deaths: No arrest warrants for 'wanted' fugitive Hughes brothers

 

[CaptainNancy]

No mention in the timeline on the reports that the Bros Hughes were apparently at home and relaxed while the CAB searches were conducted.

They could be anywhere by now. Given the ease with which migrants of many kinds get into the UK in lorries, it must be much easier to get out. Especially when you have practice, and networks.

 

[WelshWeb]

I have never really shown any interest in how the legal system works but this case for some reason really struck a chord - there appears so much about it I do not sit comfortably with. The latest is the Hughes brothers.

I hope I have not overstepped the forum boundaries (this is the first time I have ever posted on something like this but just wanted to get my views down in writing on the current situation and possibly play an active role going forward with questions and thoughts.

The cab is owned by C Hughes, I understand the trailer rented by R Hughes. Their failure to act on requests to come forward to the UK Police apparently hiding in plain sight is abhorrent. It’s almost as if they are mocking the whole system do others feel the same way or am I missing something here.

This weekend the wife of Chris Hughes and her successful business featured on a glossy local magazine with Mrs Hughes no less used as the cover. Whilst as far as I am aware there is no indication that she is in any way involved with the suspected activities of her husband and his brother does anyone feel that to run a feature on her at this time was extremely poor judgement by both the magazine and Mrs Hughes especially if she knows her husband’s whereabouts.

As things stand at the moment 39 are dead and 3 young hauliers stand accused of various offences.

As a parent of young adults. 21 to 25 who have travelled to the other side of the world living out their dreams and encountered all sorts of people am often surprised how trusting they can still be. I had a look at Mo Robinson’s public Facebook page and whilst he obviously has different interests I could have been reading my kids pages. The tone was this is not a bad person. As one paper in Australia headlined smuggler or was he played! I am guessing that any haulier that has found an illegal in the back and decided/been told to let them go and compensated to keep quiet because of the implications of admitting that one got through on their watch must be looking at the Robinson guilty plea for assisting illegal immigration and money laundering and must surely be thinking but for the grace of god go I.

As for those who lost their lives I really do not know what to say and what drives them to do what they did instead of trying to take legal routes into the UK. I know this part of this sorry state of affairs is a particularly sensitive issue so I will not comment.

Hope this note meets all standards for the forum

 

[Kudzu]

I have never really shown any interest in how the legal system works but this case for some reason really struck a chord - there appears so much about it I do not sit comfortably with. The latest is the Hughes brothers.

I hope I have not overstepped the forum boundaries (this is the first time I have ever posted on something like this but just wanted to get my views down in writing on the current situation and possibly play an active role going forward with questions and thoughts.

The cab is owned by C Hughes, I understand the trailer rented by R Hughes. Their failure to act on requests to come forward to the UK Police apparently hiding in plain sight is abhorrent. It’s almost as if they are mocking the whole system do others feel the same way or am I missing something here.

This weekend the wife of Chris Hughes and her successful business featured on a glossy local magazine with Mrs Hughes no less used as the cover. Whilst as far as I am aware there is no indication that she is in any way involved with the suspected activities of her husband and his brother does anyone feel that to run a feature on her at this time was extremely poor judgement by both the magazine and Mrs Hughes especially if she knows her husband’s whereabouts.

As things stand at the moment 39 are dead and 3 young hauliers stand accused of various offences.

As a parent of young adults. 21 to 25 who have travelled to the other side of the world living out their dreams and encountered all sorts of people am often surprised how trusting they can still be. I had a look at Mo Robinson’s public Facebook page and whilst he obviously has different interests I could have been reading my kids pages. The tone was this is not a bad person. As one paper in Australia headlined smuggler or was he played! I am guessing that any haulier that has found an illegal in the back and decided/been told to let them go and compensated to keep quiet because of the implications of admitting that one got through on their watch must be looking at the Robinson guilty plea for assisting illegal immigration and money laundering and must surely be thinking but for the grace of god go I.

As for those who lost their lives I really do not know what to say and what drives them to do what they did instead of trying to take legal routes into the UK. I know this part of this sorry state of affairs is a particularly sensitive issue so I will not comment.

Hope this note meets all standards for the forum

I absolutely love and agree with everything you said! Wonderful first post!

 

[CaptainNancy]

I too joined this forum having been struck by the human complexity of this case.

I have been to Vietnam, including to two of the provinces from which the dead came. Such hard working, family orientated people, and in the area they came from, the fishing industry was decimated just over two years ago due to s scandalous chemical contamination by a Chinese factory. It had a dreadful impact.

In my work I have had cause to engage with political refugees, and trafficked women.

The lorry drivers, the so called ‘tang’, full of hope for building a better life, a romantic optimism.

And yet.... I was looking back at the charges against C Kennedy: “It is alleged that he conspired to arrange or facilitate the travel of other people with a view to exploitation.”

Exploitation.

Aka modern slavery.

You are so right about the Hughes Brothers. And since he (I think) is listed as a director of his wife’s business then it is also his business being feted on the front of the magazine. (Can you link?)

I am very much hoping that the police are very busy behind the scenes.

 

[CaptainNancy]

Wife of man wanted for quizzing over migrant deaths splashed on magazine cover

“The Irish Sun can reveal today both Christopher Hughes, 34, and his brother Ronan have told how they may never face questioning over the horrific loss of life.

If UK cops can produce no evidence, and as long as they stay south of the border, the haulier siblings have said to close friends they cannot be picked up.”

 

[CaptainNancy]

EH next hearing in Dublin re the veracity if the EAW was due for today.
Any news?
MR and CK at the Old Bailey tomorrow.

AlisonB @ ABalharry62 says Standsted Man was bailed until tomorrow.

Also the Mahers.