UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon charged, Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #7

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StillDiggin

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Police are searching for a couple who have gone missing with their newborn baby after their car broke down on a motorway.
Constance Marten and Mark Gordon left the car near junction four of the M61 near Bolton on Thursday night and walked towards Anchor Lane bridge, Greater Manchester Police (GMP) said.
Officers believe Ms Marten had recently given birth and neither she nor her baby had seen medical professionals.
They are appealing for information.
The bridge the couple walked towards links the Highfield and Little Hulton areas.

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I can’t get my head around this case, it seems like CM genuinely felt that this was the only option available to her. I’m really surprised that the defence hasn’t said there are any mental health problems impacting upon decision making (for them both). I wonder if this is CM’s own directive and wonder if this is why she went through a couple different legal representatives? JMO
 
- 2018 - FF's interim care order is discharged
- Late 2018 - GG is born in Wales, and social services become involved again
- 2019 (?) - CM falls from a window. Details are unclear, but this is later determined to be an incident of domestic violence. CM & MG also evade an investigation by SS into the wellbeing of the children.

2019 - FAILED ESCAPE TO IRELAND ATTEMPT HERE

- Jan 2020 - local authority starts care proceedings, and at the same time Napier Marten starts an application for wardship of FF and GG - it is unclear what the aim of Napier's action was, as it's a tool rarely used since 1989. CM claims in police interview that SS removed her children after MG was blamed for her falling out of a window. She also revealed that her family were involved with SS and had hired private investigators "trying to get involved with my children".
- 4 Feb 2020 - CM posts a facebook album with three children entitled "my love sprogs", with different children labelled bty / cof / dav. IMO she posted that in the hope that it would make it easier for the children to find her on social media when they're older. Many of her facebook friends express surprise that she has any children at all. One of the comments suggests that a picture is taken in Ilford, East London.
- Some point between Jan and June 2020 - baby HH is born
 
So she is claiming that the CCTV of their arrest has been edited…

Marten claims that CCTV footage of her and Gordon has been edited.
She claimed the police deliberately put a torch in part of the film to block out them assaulting Gordon.
Judge Mark Lucraft said to Marten: ‘You are making very serious allegations against other people in this court.
‘Bear in mind that there may well be consequences to you of doing so. It is important that I warn you of that.’


 
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She told the jury: “I had spoken out about serious abuse by that family member and as a way to get back at me they tried to take my children away from me.


She said her original plan had been to go abroad but Mr Gordon’s passport had been removed and she was subject to a travel ban as a result of previous wardship proceedings, when a family member had tried to get custody of her first four children.





 
- 2018 - FF's interim care order is discharged
- Late 2018 - GG is born in Wales, and social services become involved again
- 2019 (?) - CM falls from a window. Details are unclear, but this is later determined to be an incident of domestic violence. CM & MG also evade an investigation by SS into the wellbeing of the children.

2019 - FAILED ESCAPE TO IRELAND ATTEMPT HERE

- Jan 2020 - local authority starts care proceedings, and at the same time Napier Marten starts an application for wardship of FF and GG - it is unclear what the aim of Napier's action was, as it's a tool rarely used since 1989. CM claims in police interview that SS removed her children after MG was blamed for her falling out of a window. She also revealed that her family were involved with SS and had hired private investigators "trying to get involved with my children".
- 4 Feb 2020 - CM posts a facebook album with three children entitled "my love sprogs", with different children labelled bty / cof / dav. IMO she posted that in the hope that it would make it easier for the children to find her on social media when they're older. Many of her facebook friends express surprise that she has any children at all. One of the comments suggests that a picture is taken in Ilford, East London.
- Some point between Jan and June 2020 - baby HH is born




The jury was told that an order was made which allowed for FF ( child One ) to be cared for by the couple under social services supervision. This order was discharged in 2018.

After that the couple moved away from Wales, and had three more children.
But after the birth of their second child, referred to in court as GG, social services became involved again
.


 
So she is claiming that the CCTV of their arrest has been doctored…

Marten claims that CCTV footage of her and Gordon has been edited.
She claimed the police deliberately put a torch in part of the film to block out them assaulting Gordon.
Judge Mark Lucraft said to Marten: ‘You are making very serious allegations against other people in this court.
‘Bear in mind that there may well be consequences to you of doing so. It is important that I warn you of that.’


Gosh. JMOO, I’d thought she actually believed what she was saying to a point, but now I’m reconsidering. Does she mean around 33 seconds in where she says “Daddy Bear?” and, if that was true, would be sound not be heard?

On the Gumtree comment, I think it shows a huge disconnect (JMO). She was willing to give the entire parental rights to someone else via a birth certificate change and risk that that person could disappear at any point. She was also willing for them to be in another country. It’s like a bizarre mimicry of adoption, but without the processes that are supposed to make it safer. There was no guarantee she’d ever get Victoria back and no consideration (it appears so far from her evidence) of the damage that could be caused for her. I can hugely understand and empathise with desperation to keep your children, but the whole idea of that is so concerning.
 
Sorry to double post but a couple of questions and brain being slow.

Is this the first time we’ve heard drugs referred to? (CM claiming her family said she was a drug addict.)
Is she suggesting the family member she made allegations of abuse against is the family member who made the trafficking allegation and drugs allegation against her?

I don’t think she’s done herself any favours suggesting her family thought she wanted to sell children on the black market. She’s basically described that as she’d sign over all parental rights through birth certificate. It’s just raised further questions about her actual motivations and where they stemmed from.

Edited to add: On the Harley St comment, that seems weird too. How would they have got there quickly enough? Babies can go downhill very quickly and travelling from wherever they were in the country that day seems risky because of the potential speed of deterioration. JMO but is it a case of using a known name for the weight it carries rather than just saying ‘whichever private health care was closest at the time’? Or a case of not having thought it through and picking the most known name as a fast option? Either that or it’s another bizarre disconnect. Imagine if your baby developed a rash that you believed for be meningitis - or was sucking in under their ribs, you wouldn’t drive for hours to Harley St?
 
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Do we think MGs "half a toe" is down to trench foot then? Would explain the rotting flesh smell from the hotel, the plastic bags & the stick.

And if so how could a baby be kept dry and warm if a grown man couldn't manage it.
 
Gosh. JMOO, I’d thought she actually believed what she was saying to a point, but now I’m reconsidering. Does she mean around 33 seconds in where she says “Daddy Bear?” and, if that was true, would be sound not be heard?

On the Gumtree comment, I think it shows a huge disconnect (JMO). She was willing to give the entire parental rights to someone else via a birth certificate change and risk that that person could disappear at any point. She was also willing for them to be in another country. It’s like a bizarre mimicry of adoption, but without the processes that are supposed to make it safer. There was no guarantee she’d ever get Victoria back and no consideration (it appears so far from her evidence) of the damage that could be caused for her. I can hugely understand and empathise with desperation to keep your children, but the whole idea of that is so concerning.
I don't think there is anything rational about their decision making ever since they met. You can see why there were such significant concerns
 
Sorry to double post but a couple of questions and brain being slow.

Is this the first time we’ve heard drugs referred to? (CM claiming her family said she was a drug addict.)
Is she suggesting the family member she made allegations of abuse against is the family member who made the trafficking allegation and drugs allegation against her?

I don’t think she’s done herself any favours suggesting her family thought she wanted to sell children on the black market. She’s basically described that as she’d sign over all parental rights through birth certificate. It’s just raised further questions about her actual motivations and where they stemmed from.

Edited to add: On the Harley St comment, that seems weird too. How would they have got there quickly enough? Babies can go downhill very quickly and travelling from wherever they were in the country that day seems risky because of the potential speed of deterioration. JMO but is it a case of using a known name for the weight it carries rather than just saying ‘whichever private health care was closest at the time’? Or a case of not having thought it through and picking the most known name as a fast option? Either that or it’s another bizarre disconnect. Imagine if your baby developed a rash that you believed for be meningitis - or was sucking in under their ribs, you wouldn’t drive for hours to Harley St?

We know she wouldn't have sought any medical attention IMO because ... in the most terrible of circumstances ...she didn't.

So JMO but I don't believe this statement. Medical attention for the baby was nowhere on their list of priorities.
 
Do we think MGs "half a toe" is down to trench foot then? Would explain the rotting flesh smell from the hotel, the plastic bags & the stick.

And if so how could a baby be kept dry and warm if a grown man couldn't manage it.

Perhaps he has feet infections from unmanaged diabetes, what with all the sugary sweets they seemed to purchase, or his foot was burned in the car fire and got infected?
 
Do we think MGs "half a toe" is down to trench foot then? Would explain the rotting flesh smell from the hotel, the plastic bags & the stick.

And if so how could a baby be kept dry and warm if a grown man couldn't manage it.

Because the baby was under her coat, silly :rolleyes:
If MG had only wrapped his feet in there too everything would've been grand!

(We need a blowing raspberry emoji as well as a vomit one!)
 
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