Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #8

[geddis]

Speaking as a UK citizen, a reputed nation of animal lovers, I do wonder if this case would still be making news a week later if there was not a dog involved.

I recall a bombing in London around 1981 when some ceremonial soldiers on horseback were killed by a car bomb. I cannot remember the names or even the number of soldiers killed, but I can still remember the name of a wounded, surviving horse: Sefton.

 

[Wishbone]

IMO no third party involvement, just the recent police actions show that it's thought a potential exit from bench area via road and possibly a different initial entry point to the river. <modsnip - no link from an approved source> Sadly, IMO they may find Nicola around here.

She left on her on her own down the road and then fell in the river elsewhere?

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Updated Mail article

'The truth is nothing makes sense': Police extend search for missing Nicola Bulley to the sea after finding no evidence she fell into river - despite diver saying it's IMPOSSIBLE she will be found there and friend revealing doubts over detectives' theory​

• Team of 40 detectives currently working on around 500 different lines of inquiry
• Search has expanded closer to Morecambe Bay, where river meets the sea

Police extend search for Nicola Bulley towards the sea

Heather Gibbons has joined Ms Bulley's family and friends in questioning Lancashire Police's theory that she may have fallen into the River Wyre while walking her dog on January 27.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Thank you very much for posting, to quote form article: 'For Nicola to get out to sea would be impossible, literally, it's such a long way in the 11 days. It's an awful long way down,' Mr Faulding said.

Not impossible for her to be at least closer to the sea IF this was closer her entry point in the first place. Is this part of the information he's not yet privy to?

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

She left on her on her own down the road and then fell in the river elsewhere?

In the article posted upthread the family say they don't think she 'fell'. <modsnip> and they acted absolutely immediately to find Nicola. Her husband too, rushed immediately to the scene as soon as he thought he knew where she was. There was a phone and tied dog to a bench. She'd been there earlier at least.

 

[Wishbone]

In the article posted upthread the family say they don't think she 'fell'. <modsnip - no link from an approved source> and they acted absolutely immediately to find Nicola. Her husband too, rushed immediately to the scene.

maybe I get ya.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

One reason why some individuals take a risk and enter water, is to save a struggling animal.
I've thought about Willow not being present when/if NB entered the water, so could Willow have wandered off whilst NB was at or near the bench distracted by her team call, then chased a deer or sheep into the water nearby ? That could create something of a panic for NB (with the notice about dogs being kept on leads) and resulted in an accident, without the dog entering the water.
She may even have harnessed and tied up the dog quickly first, but Willow then got lose and could not find NB.

I agree, very good call. I thought exactly the same thing and she clearly loved animals. As all the best people do in life. A splash a yell would likely result (?)

I feel strongly now that as the police have flagged the gravest sensitive context/back story & data on all of this, and are seemingly so adamant about Nicola being nearer the sea, that THIS is exactly the key. Think about what we know and who has been interviewed and how they have reacted in the light of this, quite carefully. Some have been criticised, even, (unfairly) for being impersonal, numb even angry. How might you react if you feared the worst and then seemingly had that confirmed in your mind?

The answer therefore may lie within the video upthread I believe. The focus on the cars/dash-dam, main road exit, and all the resource focus here, shows they believe a good chance Nicola exited here. The focus on the area towards the sea, which is currently foxing Peter F as seemingly makes no sense, she CAN'T have travelled there, he says. Oh, but she can IF this is closer to where she really entered the river.

 

[Owlpellet]

There might be other data on the phone apart from the fitbit, that gives clues. My iphone has the built-in health app that measures all my steps and the stops I make, alongside the meters travelled and the date and time. It's very detailed. A lot of people don't even know it's on their phone. (It's under Settings, Health, Data Access and Devices, then the name of your device.) But this data could perhaps be cross analysed with other location data to give the police a very clear idea of her journey. There's also an "unstable gait" analyser that I think would register any out of the ordinary movements where she was being pulled or ended up on the ground. I think all of this data taken together (assuming her phone does have these same apps) would tell a story if anything out of the ordinary had happened, other than Nicola completing the loop in the fields and walking back to the gate/bench.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

There might be other data on the phone apart from the fitbit, that gives clues. My iphone has the built-in health app that measures all my steps and the stops I make, alongside the meters travelled and the date and time. It's very detailed. A lot of people don't even know it's on their phone. (It's under Settings, Health, Data Access and Devices, then the name of your device.) But this data could perhaps be cross analysed with other location data to give the police a very clear idea of her journey. There's also an "unstable gait" analyser that I think would register any out of the ordinary movements where she was being pulled or ended up on the ground. I think all of this data taken together (assuming her phone does have these same apps) would tell a story if anything out of the ordinary had happened, other than Nicola completing the loop in the fields and walking back to the gate/bench.

Yes, good points. It would also show if not much happened, by the same token, and just placed on bench or dropped on ground. It's amazing what they can ascertain and that they can download the data etc.

 

[Allabouttrial]

Speaking as a UK citizen, a reputed nation of animal lovers, I do wonder if this case would still be making news a week later if there was not a dog involved.

I recall a bombing in London around 1981 when some ceremonial soldiers on horseback were killed by a car bomb. I cannot remember the names or even the number of soldiers killed, but I can still remember the name of a wounded, surviving horse: Sefton.

I honestly believe it's just pot luck sometimes. Some garner the media's attention in a big way and others get virtually no coverage.

I am surprised the media picked up on this one though considering the police from the get go have said there's a high probability she's in the river. Not much of a story to that scenario.

 

[JennieM]

Huge credit to Superintendent Sally Riley and her team for working so tirelessly against a tirade of criticism. It's easy for us to judge, and we have judged, when we don't have all the facts. Another poster described her as a class act and I will agree. I really hope they find Nicola soon for her family's sake. Thoughts to her family, especially her two beautiful girls.

 

[acutename]

I honestly believe it's just pot luck sometimes. Some garner the media's attention in a big way and others get virtually no coverage.

I am surprised the media picked up on this one though considering the police from the get go have said there's a high probability she's in the river. Not much of a story to that scenario.

the weird thing about it to me is that she seemed healthy; it was daylight; she was not drunk(!); and it was a path she walked so many times before... which makes it seem that it could happen to anyone which is not a pleasant thought.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

In an update on the twelfth day since the dog walker’s disappearance, Lancashire Police superintendent Sally Riley said members of the public “taking the law into their own hands” were not helping, notably those burgling and trespassing in their attempts.

Supt Riley also urged people to stop speculating over what may have happened to Ms Bulley, warning they were frustrating the police investigation and distressing affected family members.

She was speaking after Peter Faulding, head of a private company employed to search the river, said if Ms Bulley were not found today he would suspect a “third party” was involved in her disappearance.

Supt Riley said officers still believe Ms Bulley fell into the river and Mr Faulding is not privy to all police knowledge.

Police say ‘possibility’ Nicola Bulley left area on path not covered by CCTV

Lancashire Police say members of public searching St Michael’s on Wyre not helping

www.independent.co.uk

Peter Faulding, founder of Specialist Group International who are helping the police search admitted the complicated case has left him "baffled".

He told TalkTV: "After 25 years of doing this kind of work, after hundreds of cases, I am well and truly baffled.

"Normally you would expect the divers to find them easily. When people drown they generally go down where they are. We normally find them within five to ten metres of where they went down."
…..

Leanne Grace wrote on Facebook: “I’m about to watch the sunset on another day.

“The hours are passing so slowly yet have somehow turned to days and now over week. Every day is getting harder for your friends and family and our hearts breaking a little more.

“Trying to carry on with everyday life just doesn’t feel right. We will not give up on you Nicola. Please keep searching everyone.

“Despite the police hypothesis that Nicola may have fallen into the water, please be aware that there is no evidence to back this up.“

Social media site 'taking action' after Nicola's family 'vilified' by trolls

SEARCH teams in the Nicola Bulley investigation did the best job they could in challenging conditions and will be “gutted” she was not found sooner, a former police officer has said. Fo…

www.thesun.co.uk

 

[Wishbone]

In an update on the twelfth day since the dog walker’s disappearance, Lancashire Police superintendent Sally Riley said members of the public “taking the law into their own hands” were not helping, notably those burgling and trespassing in their attempts.

Supt Riley also urged people to stop speculating over what may have happened to Ms Bulley, warning they were frustrating the police investigation and distressing affected family members.

Despite opening 500 lines of inquiry and contacting 700 drivers who were in the area when Ms Bulley was last seen on 27 January, police said they had “so far not found anything of note”.

She was speaking after Peter Faulding, head of a private company employed to search the river, said if Ms Bulley were not found today he would suspect a “third party” was involved in her disappearance.

Supt Riley said officers still believe Ms Bulley fell into the river and Mr Faulding is not privy to all police knowledge.

Police say ‘possibility’ Nicola Bulley left area on path not covered by CCTV

Lancashire Police say members of public searching St Michael’s on Wyre not helping

www.independent.co.uk

Peter Faulding, founder of Specialist Group International who are helping the police search admitted the complicated case has left him "baffled".

He told TalkTV: "After 25 years of doing this kind of work, after hundreds of cases, I am well and truly baffled.

"Normally you would expect the divers to find them easily. When people drown they generally go down where they are. We normally find them within five to ten metres of where they went down."

Social media site 'taking action' after Nicola's family 'vilified' by trolls

SEARCH teams in the Nicola Bulley investigation did the best job they could in challenging conditions and will be “gutted” she was not found sooner, a former police officer has said. Fo…

www.thesun.co.uk

If they really believed this was a strait forward accident no information would be withheld. By withholding information and admitting to it makes it appear to be something more........IMO

 

[tree1]

The police are so adamant she’s in the water, it makes me rethink my stance. They must have a reason to be so sure.

This has all made me question my thoughts on her not being in the river. The police refer to sensitive information. Now wondering if they had also received a call they haven’t published saying someone spotted someone in the water, that same morning and within the time frame of Willow being found etc. I imagine that could be seen as too sensitive for the family although I imagine they would be told,. I hope I am not breaking any ‘speculation’ rules. I apologise if so. I can’t spare the time to go back through previous threads but wonder if the arrival of police and divers that morning coincides accurately with the publicised sequence of events.

 

[Mr X]

The situation about having an audience is an interesting problem to have.
I think if and when the body is located in the water it would be wise to get rid of the audience. For dignity other apart from anything else. As mentioned it is not all that pleasant seeing a body come out of the water. I found a body in the Thames floating past my boat some years ago and although it was not all that shocking to me I could see it being upsetting for some people.

It isn't the kind of thing which should be happening in front of the public. It is not appropriate.

A possible reason for police being so sure the body is in the river could be because it has already been found but deliberately not recovered while there was a public audience.

This would certainly fulfil the definition of 'sensitive information'.

Hopefully this will be resolved soon.

All JMO.

 

[Furore]

If they really believed this was a strait forward accident no information would be withheld. By withholding information and admitting to it makes it appear to be something more........IMO

Disagree. Nicola is a mum, daughter, partner. The public just need to know what the evidence points towards and how they can help. Whilst sleuthers may wish to know every detail, it doesn’t actually help Nicola or her family for police to reveal everything, be it to public or anyone else. I’d be furious if private info was being sensationalised during my anxiety and grief, remembering children will be able to look all this up one day :/ the very fact PF goes to chat to his journalist friends every single day is reason enough not to tell him further details imo. He’s there to exclude a body in the river, not to lead the investigation or update the public appetite…

 

[Allabouttrial]

If they really believed this was a strait forward accident no information would be withheld. By withholding information and admitting to it makes it appear to be something more........IMO

They may believe she had an accident but until they find her they're not ruling out other possibilities, however slim, so they're just doing their due diligence by not disclosing all the details, just in case it turns out to be foul play.

 

[CustardTart]

With regards to the fitbit. My fitbit refuses to autosync to my phone. I have to do it manually all of the time. Sometimes I forget for days if I'm not working out or something - but when it does sync it updates all of the info from the days it has missed so it is stored on there for a good while. Is there a way that this info might be in the cloud or something and LE might be able to access it without having the device?

I feel sure they know something they are not making public, as to say they are pretty certain she went in the river without any kind of evidence is so odd. I followed the Libby Squires case closely as a local, and it was very clear they knew from the start most of what had happened. They only ever searched Oak Road and the river for her. It was just never made public until they had enough evidence to charge.

You’re speculating about whether the Fitbit has synced or not. Either it did at the time it was near her phone, or it didn’t. If it didn’t, then unless it’s found or comes close to a phone or device that is paired to it and that syncs it again, its data cannot be retrieved. I cannot understand further speculation on this topic.

 

[Caroclaud]

IMO I think the video upthread, shows we can rule out abduction, there is some sad, sensitivity and full context the police can tell us but only when the time is 'right' [source video upthread]. They are going to look closer to the sea soon which relates to this context that they can't YET tell us, they have to be sensitive, they say, so they are holding back on it now until they have their ducks in a row and evidence. They are looking at the main road as possible exit and gleaning 'dash cam' evidence. The river can be accessed elsewhere. You can reflect on these facts and words spoken by the police and place in your own context on certain interviews thus far and see how they might make sense. Think in particular of the tone, attitude of key people and whether they name others (or not) and on whom their priorities now lie with as they say in own words. Legally, although it might make sense to do so, they have to be sensitive/fully appropriate and can't tell Peter F (yes, even he, they say) the context, relevant back history etc, as yet. I feel there is a chance he may intelligently surmise tomorrow. Bear in mind the police have been excellent and bear in mind they acted immediately.

I do think that PA and the police acted extremely quickly to events after PA called them to report her missing. I can well believe there is some personal context which explains why they were on red alert from the get go and sprang into action. I thought it weird that PA didn’t even go down and check what was going on down at the river but was immediately concerned enough to call the police.

 

[annpats]

My comment is based on the video showing the red coat lady as the first witness.

Isn't the yellow coat with pushchair lady the first witness as she saw her approx. 08.45..?
Or do I have that wrong?