Weekend Discussion thread 04/21-24/2012

[otto]

IMO - this 'date' video, on the LFP website, shows how completely enamored TLM was with MR. Apparently, this was just days before the abduction.

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/03/14/19503341.html

What exactly are they doing on that date? That's a pretty weird looking date.

 

[BorgQueen]

IMO - this 'date' video, on the LFP website, shows how completely enamored TLM was with MR. Apparently, this was just days before the abduction.

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/03/14/19503341.html

It does appear that she is quite enamoured with him. And it shows that he seemed to be embarrassed to be too close to her in public. Going as far as spinning to get away from her when she put her hand on him. Or was he afraid that one of his other females would see him with her? In any event, she seems quite smitten, and appears to be beaming the entire time, while he looks somewhat aggravated.

 

[brighidin]

I was not aware that CS testified that they would share the profits, do you have a link for this.

All the links that I have read do not include the word share.....

The 26-year-old said during their relationship she and Rafferty discussed how to improve their finances and they decided she would get into the escort business and would give him all of those earnings.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/04/20/rafferty-stafford-phone-calls.html

She certainly did not say they were going to share the profits.
Steven D'Souza ‏ @cbcsteve
Spitzig says discussed getting in escort business with all money going to #Rafferty. Says in spring 2009, she'd give money to Rafferty #sl

I think the OP needs to re-read the tweets.

 

[BorgQueen]

What exactly are they doing no that date? That's a pretty weird looking date.

If my memory is serving me right, that was their 'movie date' where they had (allegedly) had sex in the theatre. {insert barfing emoticon here}

 

[otto]

If my memory is serving me right, that was their 'movie date' where they had (allegedly) had sex in the theatre. {insert barfing emoticon here}

Are they at the movie theatre flipping a movie menu? ... unable to pick the movie? Sex in the movie theatre? ... what kind of movie was it?

 

[Ardy]

I don't know for sure, but I think it would go to relevance. IMHO, the women have been introduced as witnesses to demonstrate MR's state of mind at the time of the murder. Whether he was sexually deviant wouldn't really be relevant to the trial - since there are no sexual deviance charges (other than sexual interference with a child). The trial can't be a fishing expedition to infer that there was other sexual deviance during the child rape.

But they did testify to sexual intimacy, and none of them said MR showed or expressed any deviant sexual interest.

They testified to why the relationships ended and none of the women said it was because of deviant sexual interests.

The opportunity was there.

JMO...........

 

[Macright]

to answer the demands of others wanting a link to my post I admit I should have added JMO to that statement about sharing the profits...JMO that they shared the profits as I will never believe that there wasn't another reason behind her depositing money into his account and I do not believe that she was depositing all her hard earned cash to MR...JMO and with that I will no longer be commenting on that subject as it now has become old hat to me and nothing that has been posted has made me change my mind on that issue. goodnight all until the next time....

 

[Wondergirl]

TLM told VS that she wouldn't let anything happen to her, according to her own testimony.

She either lied to VS then, or she is lying about it now.

She lied to VS family and said MR killed VS.

TLM is a sociopath. She lies just because she can. She has no moral code.

If a Judge stepped forward and said MR was at his house the day of the abduction, TLM would simply change her story to include the Judge.........

That is how sociopaths operate.

JMO............

BBM: That is exactly how the Crown has shown that MTR's operates, also.

As a sociopath.

JMO

 

[girlfriday]

What exactly are they doing on that date? That's a pretty weird looking date.

I'm not sure - I wondered too. It reminded me a bit of the Silver City at Masonville Mall in London Ontario (a movie theatre)... but when they are looking at the book, it seems odd.

 

[otto]

It does appear that she is quite enamoured with him. And it shows that he seemed to be embarrassed to be too close to her in public. Going as far as spinning to get away from her when she put her hand on him. Or was he afraid that one of his other females would see him with her? In any event, she seems quite smitten, and appears to be beaming the entire time, while he looks somewhat aggravated.

It looks like he's trying to get away with something. He's spinning around in a coy way .. pulling away from her arm but not ever entirely pulling away from her. In fact, the menu "indecision" looks like he's either completely befuddled about why he brought his date to the theatre, or he's trying to look like Mr Nice Guy by letting her pick the movie. If they had sex in the theatre, then I suspect that he had that in his mind the entire time ... nohing to do with going to a movie ... so looking like Mr Nice Guy and letting her pick the movie was always about him.

 

[Kamille]

I would also be interested in seeing a link to prove your assertions about the physical effects of Oxycontin addiction. By your logic, TLM's not an addict either, as her teeth haven't rotted out and no one has mentioned her scratching all the time. Also, she's physically attractive. So there goes that theory.

Also, how do you explain the numerous women who testified about his Oxycontin addiction?

Well you know he had all that back pain and possible colon cancer from all the dancing he was doing both while he was teaching and while he was in dance school. I hope someone warns those kids that who go on that "So You Think You Can Dance Show" or who dance every day in stage productions and on Broadway about these dangers

Or maybe it was from that hard labour in construction/home renovations? Hard to say.


MOO

 

[otto]

I'm not sure - I wondered too. It reminded me a bit of the Silver City at Masonville Mall in London Ontario (a movie theatre)... but when they are looking at the book, it seems odd.

Maybe there's a movie menu for people that show up at the theatre and don't know what movie to walk into late?

 

[Kamille]

You don't have to have kids, or be involved with kids to know right from wrong... I didn't have kids till I was 27 and I certainly would have known putting another persons child in my car was probably not a good idea unless I had permission from the parent, not the word from an 18 year old with a checkered past...

Not to mention we were all kids at one point and probably all at one time or another were left in the care of others and I as a child knew that even if a friend was over and my mom wanted to take us to McDonald's for lunch, that friend would call home and ask permission first and let his parents know and vice versa.

MR seemed to have no problem at all portraying himself as a worldly, compassionate all around great guy on POF, surely someone like that would know the ins and outs of child care, and have a good sense of right and wrong... Not to mention working as a "dance instructor" (bulk of people involved in dance lessons are minors) he would surely have had some of the "speak out" training that is now mandatory amongst coaches/ instructors here in Canada where working with children is involved... You know the common sense stuff that is expected from an adult when around children and what children should expect from an adult entrusted to their care....

Wasn't he a "step father" himself at this time?

MOO

 

[girlfriday]

But they did testify to sexual intimacy, and none of them said MR showed or expressed any deviant sexual interest.

They testified to why the relationships ended and none of the women said it was because of deviant sexual interests.

The opportunity was there.

JMO...........

Perhaps not in trial - but I read about such back when the story first broke and his ex's were coming forward to the news(papers). For one example, see my post #69, in this thread, with a quote and link to an article that is still online. I recall having read others on this board, back then too.

 

[flipflop]

to answer the demands of others wanting a link to my post I admit I should have added JMO to that statement about sharing the profits...JMO that they shared the profits as I will never believe that there wasn't another reason behind her depositing money into his account and I do not believe that she was depositing all her hard earned cash to MR...JMO and with that I will no longer be commenting on that subject as it now has become old hat to me and nothing that has been posted has made me change my mind on that issue. goodnight all until the next time....

I respect your opinion, but I do not agree with it. I believe the reason behind her depositing money into his account....she was another victim of being manipulated/cheated/lied (whatever word you want to call it) by MR. Just as he had manipulated TLM into what she thought was a real relationship, he had her wrapped around his baby finger and could get her to do whatever he asked.....and that was to kidnap a child for his sick fantasy. JMO

 

[otto]

to answer the demands of others wanting a link to my post I admit I should have added JMO to that statement about sharing the profits...JMO that they shared the profits as I will never believe that there wasn't another reason behind her depositing money into his account and I do not believe that she was depositing all her hard earned cash to MR...JMO and with that I will no longer be commenting on that subject as it now has become old hat to me and nothing that has been posted has made me change my mind on that issue. goodnight all until the next time....

Obviously she kept her cut for her escort services, but she handed a lot of it to MR (almost $17k) through bank transfers (possibly done online) and cash handouts. She was investing in him and in a future for her and her children. MR used the money to buy drugs, pay car and blackberry bills, seduce and manipulate other women

 

[Kamille]

Thanks ... I meant to say that. TLM must have used some sort of threat or promise to keep Tori quiet in the car for 10 minutes. The drugs were after the abduction and before the murder ... part of the plan.

Imagine the threats that MR was using to keep her quiet while TLM was in the Home Depot. Victoria was afraid of him remember? That's why he had to walk to Mt Forest and back while TLM had her little chat with her.

I wonder why he didn't take his phone?

MOO

 

[Kamille]

If my memory is serving me right, that was their 'movie date' where they had (allegedly) had sex in the theatre. {insert barfing emoticon here}

Yeah...during the day on a weekday. I guess that's when he would be sure that none of his other ladies would see him there.

MOO

 

[Tahorn]

MR certainly doesn't fit the profile of an oxycontin addict.

The first noticeable thing about addicts is their appearance.

As an addict, their life is consumed with the search for drugs or the money to buy drugs.

Their appearance no longer is a priority for them.

Their personal hygiene becomes noticeably lacking.

Their teeth rot out and they scratch all the time.

Even Christie Blatchford commented on MR's conventional good looks and appearance.

I think MR is either an addict of some other substance.........or he isn't an addict at all and his drug use has been blown out of proportions.

If he kidnapped and sexually assaulted VS........it wasn't drugs that made him do it.

TLM.............is a whole different story............JMO......

Armstrong considered Rafferty, 31, a "confidante" and sold him pills a few times a month for more than a year.

Armstrong testified she sold Rafferty more painkillers a few days later and met with him on a dozen more occasions until his arrest on May 19, 2009.

"He was looking haggard. He had a cold sore. He gets cold sores when he's super stressed," she said of their first meeting following Stafford's abduction. "He said that he hadn't been eating. He hadn't been sleeping. He was so stressed out, so many things going on in his life."

http://www.canada.com/Stafford+Tria...dealer+planned+search+Tori/6367050/story.html

It looks like he was fairly new to his addiction, he did have a proscription bottle in his bedroom. However after it looks like he changed his consumption level increased dramatically.

Rafferty asked the officers posing as inmates if they were carrying any drugs. They said no, but when he was asked what he was looking for, Rafferty said he wanted "Oxy," or OxyContin. He said he would take five 80 mg OxyContin pills a day, or 11 or 12 if they were 40 mg size. Rafferty said he would take 20 to 30 Percocets a day.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/04/05/rafferty-stafford-trial-thursday.html

 

[brighidin]

to answer the demands of others wanting a link to my post I admit I should have added JMO to that statement about sharing the profits...JMO that they shared the profits as I will never believe that there wasn't another reason behind her depositing money into his account and I do not believe that she was depositing all her hard earned cash to MR...JMO and with that I will no longer be commenting on that subject as it now has become old hat to me and nothing that has been posted has made me change my mind on that issue. goodnight all until the next time....

Nobody is "demanding" anything from you. It is the way websleuths works: either post a link or a moo. Not a big deal.