Trino
Well-Known Member
If they made it only a few feet in the house, where was Jayme? If she was in bed, would she have come out to see what was going on and he grabbed her that fast? Or was she up at that hour?
Or, did she walk out?
If they made it only a few feet in the house, where was Jayme? If she was in bed, would she have come out to see what was going on and he grabbed her that fast? Or was she up at that hour?
The Daily Mail article states:
Both Denise and James died 'instantly' of their wounds, he (Fitzgerald) said.
That could be interpreted as they died instantly after being shot, perhaps due to location of shots to the body (head wounds), rather than they both died at the same time. James shot at entry, Denise/Jayme arguing or pleading with perp(s) one of them was able to call 911 somehow. Perp became aware, disabled phone, shot Denise and left with Jayme in tow.
JMO
Thanks Daisy6441, You always make good points.
Maybe the perp was not inclined to "venture into the house", .....because some part of his leg was hurting from having kicked in the door.
Maybe adrenaline helped him then. But what about later?
I hope LE checked nearby hospitals, and chatted up the local orthopedic surgeons in the surrounding areas.
"Any males come in with a leg/ankle/knee in pain?"
"...and with an interesting 'story' on how it happened?"
On the other side, it could also be the type of injury which someone (a friend/relative/co-worker of the perp's) might not realize that they hold a critical piece of information that could solve this. Its implausible, but maybe they could remember it six weeks later:
"Yeah, Frank was limping last month. I asked him about it. He said he slipped on the ice and hurt his hip while fishing at his cabin north of here. "
If she had bolted, and was outside when they grabbed her, who’s yelling on the 911 call? Parents are instantly gone isn’t leaving a lot of room for either to try to dial. Is it possible Jayme called and two perps are heard freaking at each other over the murders? Jayme bails and they snatch her outside just before or as police arrive and hold
A gun to her to ensure she stays quiet? They leave by foot to a hidden car nearby after cops enter the home knowing they have a few mins before cops come back out and more LE arrive on scene? Could it be that simple? They just hid outside for a few mins til the perp was sure cops were busy inside?
This is where my mind went after this new set of information. Perhaps she wasn’t in her room or in the back of the house. That said, I do wonder about the validity of the source (DM) of this new information.What if Jayme, for whatever reason, was outside?
Was grabbed outside and then the perp went in and shot the parents. Parents might already have had a feeling something was wrong and were close to the front door. So the perp didn't have to go in more than 5 feet.
It’s contradicting for sure because it has been said that nothing can be made out from the 911 call, just muffled noise from afar.Maybe. But wouldn’t they have said they thought the yelling could have come
From a tv? They know Jayme was home at the time of the murder. They didn’t seem to know a young girl lived there for sure until they connected with the school officer. Something on the tape tells them she was home at the time of the murders along with other evidence at the scene (we were told this by LE). So that leaves a parent screaming for someone not to hurt her or a perp yelling at Jayme to move or two perps arguing about the kid and how to deal with her (speculation!). Evidence at the scene would include Jayme’s cell phone being on the charger in the kitchen.
Not necessarily. When I dial on my phone, many times there is a delay from the time I dial until the call actually starts going through. I've had it take up to 20 seconds before the call actually connects. Plenty of time for her to dial and then if the killer saw it, shoot her. I have no idea if it is my carrier or the area where I live, but I'm only about 40 minutes from Barron.
I would say "sleuthing" on this forum can include things like naming a friend/family member, discussing things posted on their social media, or sharing information (regardless how publically available it is) about their address, employment, background, associations, etc. It does not have to be a negative insinuation or an explicit accusation to be considered sleuthing. Something as innocent as "her brother Bob works at the car wash" can turn into a whole rabbit hole of speculation and discussion that would probably upset Bob if he were to stumble across the thread. The intent of the "sleuthing" rules is to protect the privacy of people who have a connection to a victim and prevent innocent people from any unfounded speculation that might impact their life/reputation. HTH@Mistermagoo I am a little confused on the word sleuthing itself since it indicates investigating someone. Some info is not the result of such nor is the info accusatory. It's simply info that happens to be connected. Hoping for clarity. Can a connection found involving a victim or family member be talked about if there is no negative connotation, blame, etc being stated about them. EX: Inadvertent contact and possibly unaware association of someone not known to be of questionable character. The victim is in no way responsible for anything aside from innocent, random, or unrelated to case, contact. Gray areas are tough because no one wants to break the rules and I hate bothering the mods to ask (though I have lol)
That could work. That scenario also works if u are on move outback in 3/4 minutes... based on pattern.. as long as they get to moving cops all came from one direction..
I have to think jayme was heard on 911 call though... Fitzgerald said she was at home during murders based on 911 call.
It’s weird the more info we get, seems possible perp list grows.
Local druggie / pissed off fired Jeanie o employee / ex military/ cop / online crush / online stalker / local divorced hunter/ drug payback wrong house / sex offender / family associate...
Really could see anything above playout... and not get answer for 5 or 10 yrs
It’s contradicting for sure because it has been said that nothing can be made out from the 911 call, just muffled noise from afar.
Don't kill my dog?Home but didn’t appear to resist going with perp. So if she’s on the tape, what do we imagine she may have been saying? :/
The Daily Mail article states:
Both Denise and James died 'instantly' of their wounds, he (Fitzgerald) said.
That could be interpreted as they died instantly after being shot, perhaps due to location of shots to the body (head wounds), rather than they both died at the same time. James shot at entry, Denise/Jayme arguing or pleading with perp(s) one of them was able to call 911 somehow. Perp became aware, disabled phone, shot Denise and left with Jayme in tow.
JMO
I thought about that too. The sound of the door being kicked in? It's puzzling as to what clued the sheriff into the 4 minutes.
Ok so denise calls and is shot so she dies instantly. Who’s left yelling on the 911 if Jayme didn’t resist? Only the perp. Yelling for Jayme? That’s maybe how they knew Jayme was home when this went down?This. They died instantly after being shot, they weren't necessarily shot instantly, although we (some of us) believe that James may have been based on where he was found. I believe Denise was further in the house when she was shot. Just looking at my house, you step 5 ft in and I'm coming around the corner, you'll get me point blank. The call log was released four days after the murders without anything redacted as @girlhasnoname also said. We saw the actual PDF or some scanned document of the call, didn't we?
911 dispatch log: Call made from Denise's cell phone, door kicked in
"COULD HEAR A LOT OF YELLING"
^^ That tells me Jayme wasn't the only one alive at the time of the call so Denise probably made it and it was dropped right before she was shot...MOO.
The Daily Mail article states:
Both Denise and James died 'instantly' of their wounds, he (Fitzgerald) said.
That could be interpreted as they died instantly after being shot, perhaps due to location of shots to the body (head wounds), rather than they both died at the same time. James shot at entry, Denise/Jayme arguing or pleading with perp(s) one of them was able to call 911 somehow. Perp became aware, disabled phone, shot Denise and left with Jayme in tow.
JMO
Ok so denise calls and is shot so she dies instantly. Who’s left yelling on the 911 if Jayme didn’t resist? Only the perp. Yelling for Jayme? That’s maybe how they knew Jayme was home when this went down?
This. They died instantly after being shot, they weren't necessarily shot instantly, although we (some of us) believe that James may have been based on where he was found. I believe Denise was further in the house when she was shot. Just looking at my house, you step 5 ft in and I'm coming around the corner, you'll get me point blank. The call log was released four days after the murders without anything redacted as @girlhasnoname also said. We saw the actual PDF or some scanned document of the call, didn't we?
911 dispatch log: Call made from Denise's cell phone, door kicked in
"COULD HEAR A LOT OF YELLING"
^^ That tells me Jayme wasn't the only one alive at the time of the call so Denise probably made it and it was dropped right before she was shot...MOO.
Or, Denise makes the 911 call, is shot dropping the phone before call is picked up by the 911 operator, and the commotion is the perp grabbing Jayme.IMO, If Denise died instantly, the 911 call was made before the shot. Therefore the shot was heard in the 911 call.