Max's Search Warrants Released!!!! Discuss Max's Death here #2

[TorisMom003]

LE has not exactly been forthcoming in the whereabouts of everyone involved nor even who is involved. For instance, if we had not received the SWs we would not have known about Nina or Howard being anywhere around the Coronado area. How do we know for sure that LE has not also covered for the Shacknai family and left out that the other 2 children were in the home at the time of Max's accident as well?

I firmly believe that LE needs to be examined closely as to how they have handled both cases and that a new investigation needs to be done for Max and also Rebecca. It also needs to be completely transparent. No more hiding the witnesses or leaving out vital information.

MOO

 

[SmoothOperator]

That may be true concerning her statement to LE. I believe she said Max said "Ocean' when she reached him but then we have what Rebecca's sister has said or told Bremner about the other Shacknai children being in the home and Max was planking.

Where did that come from if not Rebecca? Didn't Rebecca tell LE there was no one in the home at the time but her sister and herself? IIRC, that was mentioned in the PC.

IMO

Making such a leap of an assumption IMO has zero basis.. There is nothing to suggest ever that Rebecca made any statement ever to anyone about additional ppl being present.. This is nothing but a complete leap to suggest Rebecca said it..

A statement made by Bremner that never so much as even implied anything was told by Rebecca or came from Rebecca.. I have no clue, nor does anyone else here who stated there were others present, implied possibly they were, or if Bremner pulled it out of her azz.. Who knows?? No one here!! But what is known is that there is nothing to even suggest that Rebecca made this statement to ANYONE WHATSOEVER OF OTHERS BEING PRESENT..

 

[Betty P]

Not to mention allegedly riding a scooter over a railing, swinging from a chandelier, while hitting a wall, slamming a back on a railing, and going down the stairs and getting a scooter across a leg while not getting a single chandelier cut, and doing it all without a sound. Remarkable.

1. It has not been established that he was riding the scooter when the accident took place. There are a number of scenarios in which he could have fallen from the 2nd floor. The LE accident report lists only one scenario. None of the scenarios they discuss includes MS hitting a wall, but there is an illustration of their theory at the link below. It has been discussed and analyzed quite a bit here. Links to verify known facts have been provided to you ad nauseum.

Link: http://www.sdsheriff.net/coronado/ms.pdf

2. Cut from the chandelier? It likely didn't break until it hit the ground. If you've ever owned a chandelier and cleaned it regularly, you would know they don't have edges sharp enough to cut a person. They would only be that sharp if broken.

3. Without a sound? Both RZ and her sister reported hearing a loud crash when MS fell. That information has been included in the SD Sheriff Dept. report, as well as the search warrants. Do you have some evidence that the MS accident took place without making a sound?

Link: http://www.sdsheriff.net/coronado/index.html

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Supposedly JS's two older children were there up until Monday morning until they left early for the airport.

Bremner said Zahau was not alone in the mansion when Max had his accident She said that two of the child’s teenage siblings were present as well and that Zahau was in the shower at the time of the accident. Max’s mother and Jonah Shacknai were divorced, and Zahau had recently divorced as well.

Bremner said investigators told her that the child had been conducting a trick known as “planking,” or lying horizontally in unusual locations, around the staircase when he fell. Planking is a fad popularized with photographs and videos online. One planks while the other one takes the photo.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...remner+says+Max+shacknai+was+planking&ct=clnk

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Yet in her police statement she and her sister are the only ones there.

She is in one bathroom and her sister is said to be in another bathroom. But both close enough to hear the crash.

IMO

 

[curiousjo]

From what we know... GS was at the mansion on Monday am then left for airport - at undetermined time - prior to paramedics arrival per news interview with teen boy neighbor who is an AZ highschool classmate. Its possible the teens (GS and XZ) were taking planking pictures before she left for the airport. MS must have seen the teens planking, and probably doing it too.

----The attorney may have misspoke, and meant the teens were present in the morning(pre accident) and had been planking.
-Maybe even taking picture of MS planking?
-Consequently, one may conclude that its always possible MS tried to plank later that morning, then fell.

However, XZ has yet to tell us her story. She was there, and would know if teen(s) had left for airport.

 

[SophieRose]

From what we know... GS was at the mansion on Monday am then left for airport - at undetermined time - prior to paramedics arrival per news interview with teen boy neighbor who is an AZ highschool classmate. Its possible the teens (GS and XZ) were taking planking pictures before she left for the airport. MS must have seen the teens planking, and probably doing it too.

----The attorney may have misspoke, and meant the teens were present in the morning(pre accident) and had been planking.
-Maybe even taking picture of MS planking?
-Consequently, one may conclude that its always possible MS tried to plank later that morning, then fell.

However, XZ has yet to tell us her story. She was there, and would know if teen(s) had left for airport.

With planking, he would have more or less rolled off the banister and straight down. He wouldn't have the momentum to swing the chandelier and hit the banister on the other side.

 

[curiousjo]

With planking, he would have more or less rolled off the banister and straight down. He wouldn't have the momentum to swing the chandelier and hit the banister on the other side.

You're right, unless he had to run towards balcony to get the momentum to raise up to height of staircase railing/balcony, then plank it,........as he did not have the strenght to do it like a teen might.

 

[justbetweenus]

Wednesday afternoon was after Rebecca's death.

I'm sorry I'm not sure I follow. Why are you mentioning this Wednesday in the link was after Rebecca's death?

 

[Rhyme & Reason]

I'm sorry I'm not sure I follow. Why are you mentioning this Wednesday in the link was after Rebecca's death?

Sorry, I'm lost LOL!! Let me go back & see why I said this.

 

[justbetweenus]

BBM: ITA! I believe JS/DS would have the best of the best, to diagnose Max. What I don't understand is that it sounds liek it took 4 days for docs to realize Max had spine injury? Wouldn't that be one of the first things they look for in a fall like that?

Maybe during these 4 days the only concern the drs. had was trying to save this childs life. What was the harm waiting to report it? He wasn't going anywhere. He wasn't going to be in anyone else's care.

ETA: sorry I mis-read your post Wendy. I'm not so sure it took 4 days. Just because Dina's mom said they were doing an MRI Wednesday (4 days after admitting) doesn't mean they didn't know until then he had a spinal injury. I would think they would of done a few MRIs before, just to see if there are any changes? Sometimes I think we read too much into the way the press words things.

Sorry if I misread you again lol. Got several things on the go here.

 

[Callie]

Hello Everyone


If you go to this site and click on the picture that depicts how the Sheriff's Department believes Max went over the railing, then click the picture again and see a larger view.

http://www.sdsheriff.net/coronado/

It shows Max 'sailing' across the alcove to the opposite side of the chandelier, then flipping over, hitting the lower railing on his back then flipping again to fall face forward on the floor. If you click on the other picture that shows the landing between the first and second floor and notice the height of the rail coming down from the top floor where they believe he went over you can see that it isn't a mere 20" high. Also notice the opposite wall. He'd have to go around that wall and step down a step or two to go over the rail as shown in the diagram. This whole fall does not make sense to me and I was elated to discover, The HinkyMeter and Valhall's interpretation of Max's fall.

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/

I do believe it was an accident just not like SD says it happened.
What would make him land on the opposite side of the chandelier rather than the side closest to him? What would make him fall from the chandelier to the rail rather than straight down to the floor? IMO, he had to have been traveling at a pretty good clip to achieve that maneuver as SD illustrates.
However, hitting the lower stair rail seems the only way for them to account for his back injuries.

I am wondering if XZ may innocently have played a part in the accident. How it may have actually occurred, I have no idea. It's rather difficult to believe she sustained a number of cuts bad enough to require stitches by just gathering up pieces of the chandelier. Not impossible, but to me, not likely. After all she was 13 yrs old not 3.
I would think that Rebecca would do all she could to protect her sister.

 

[rosemary]

I've linked both the SW and AR. Anyone can read both documents themselves and see that there are discrepancies between statements made to different officers.

so you're saying that the LE didn't do their jobs properly then when they ruled Max's death as an accident? wouldn't that mean that their ruling of suicide regarding Rebecca's death should also be viewed as suspect if that's the case?

 

[rosemary]

Except that it's been done before.

hanging naked outside over the balcony with bound hands and feet and a gag in the mouth has been done before? any links to that? most articles i've read stated that naked suicides often occur inside the house, not outside, and binding one's hands and feet and gagging oneself is also an extremely unusual thing to do. oh and btw, Rebecca did not fall into the Asian American group most at risk for suicide, nor was there any evidence that she lacked family support which is also one of the reasons why people commit suicide.

 

[rosemary]

BBM
-What series of bizarre incidents?
-Who is the "babysitter"? I thought JS PR team said she was his soon-to-be finace - meaning she would be the Stepmom/ parent caring for MS..... Why the anger towards RZ?

that's exactly what I meant when I said there was hostility and anger towards Rebecca by some people here. why call Rebecca a baby-sitter when she was Jonah's gf and according to Jonah's side of the story, she was someone very special to him? calling her a baby-sitter implies that she was nothing more than house hold help to Jonah Shacknai, which we obviously know is not true.

 

[rosemary]

Kids also like to climb on the outside of the railing . To see that at the top is terrifying .

I remember doing that myself with my siblings and cousins when we stayed over at our grandparents house. They have a similar set of stairs to the Shacknais and I remember we often got into trouble because of that. I remember it was just a fun thing for us to do, daring ourselves sometimes, even though we were aware of the dangers coz we were often scolded and told often about what could happen to us if we fell.

 

[SophieRose]

Bremner said Zahau was not alone in the mansion when Max had his accident She said that two of the child’s teenage siblings were present as well and that Zahau was in the shower at the time of the accident. Max’s mother and Jonah Shacknai were divorced, and Zahau had recently divorced as well.

Bremner said investigators told her that the child had been conducting a trick known as “planking,” or lying horizontally in unusual locations, around the staircase when he fell. Planking is a fad popularized with photographs and videos online. One planks while the other one takes the photo.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...remner+says+Max+shacknai+was+planking&ct=clnk

In the article Bremner says she and the family met with investigators for more than three hours, and says investigators told her that he had been planking when he fell. Why hasn't that been reported anywhere else? Why isn't that in the police reports?

 

[SnoopyDoobyDoo]

Sorry, I'm lost LOL!! Let me go back & see why I said this.

I just read it. The MRI (which, I believe, was the medical test that would have diagnosed Max's fatal injury) occured AFTER Rebecca's death, making whether or not the injury was found before Max's death a moot point. At the time R died, doctor's and CPS were working off the assumption that the symptoms didn't match the situation as presented and were therefore suspicious. It came under debate because there was no mention of an MRI in the AR (according to posts here, I can't bring myself to read the report myself), just repeat CT scans. The "MRI on Wednesday" thing came out to counter that information, and then it was pointed out that if said statement was accurate it was irrelevant in ascertaining Rebecca's/family member's state of mind at the time of Rebecca's death.

 

[Brit]

how would a person the size of Rebecca manage to throw an unconscious Max from the upper banister with enough velocity like you stated he needed to have had for his injuries? Your theory seems more implausible than the accident scenario imo.

I agree. Try packing a suitcase to 50 pounds, and then try throwing it. Also, rz was only 5'3".... That makes it even hard. Imo

 

[curiousjo]

When assessing head trauma, mental status changes, etc.... you start by ordering a Head CT Scan, then next step is Head MRI. Both studies offer different view and are tools to assess the extent of injury. A CT scan takes minutes, where as MRI will take nearly an hour and not safe for unstable patient. So, makes sense that the CT would have been done in ED, then after a couple days and stabilization, you do the MRI scan. The MRI would have been ordered by the Neurosurgeons to further assess brain edema, vasculature. The concerns with a head trauma, is the intracranial swelling /edema that happens @1-3 days later and may result in brain death. (Many patients may undergo this 2 step process. ex suffer a stroke, brain infection, tumor or simply to evaluate headache of undeterimed etiology.


CT scanning of the head is typically used to detect:
•bleeding, brain injury and skull fractures in patients with head injuries.
•evaluate the extent of bone and soft tissue damage in patients with facial trauma, and planning surgical reconstruction.

MRI Scan:
•Bleeding in the brain
•Brain tissue swelling
•Damage to the brain from an injury
•Hydrocephalus (fluid collecting around the brain)
•Structural problems in the brain, blood vessels, or pituitary gland



http://www.headbraininjuries.com/brain-injuries-mri-ct-scan