GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #3

[gngr~snap]

I can't get away from the dogs not finding the child. Can anyone shed some light on the vacant apartment? The Cherokee Ledger News writes - Jorelys was taken to a vacant apartment unit in a building adjacent to her family’s building inside the complex, and investigators say what they believe to be samples of blood were taken to the GBI crime lab. The article does not state that the murder was committed at the vacant apartment.

The arrest warrant does unit #10009?http://api.viglink.com/api/click?fo...ling/nFwjb//&jsonp=vglnk_jsonp_13234828633411

 

[abagale]

So, can Ryan Brunn could actually qualify for the death penalty even though he will plea not guilty?

 

[tlcya]

Let the dance begin. Although it has always seemed more like fencing to me, with feints, parries and thrusts.

 

[gngr~snap]

DNA will be important but IMO he was ID'd by fingerprints AT the scene.
Bloody finger prints even.
A much quicker match than DNA.
~jmo

 

[tlcya]

So, can Ryan Brunn could actually qualify for the death penalty even though he will plea not guilty?

Can you elaborate? I'm not sure what you are asking?

 

[Kat]

I read an article earlier today that said K9 dogs and a helicopter aided in the search and afaik, K9 dogs search for missing children but it didn't say anything more about what happened and where they went.

Using dogs which search for missing children would have really helped in this case since the crime was fresh and committed in a confined area.

Another article (link below) said Troopers were dispatched to check licenses and cars on the road in front of the complex. Thigpen said they had two machines that read license plates and instantly checked for warrants, stolen car reports or registrations to sex offenders while two drug-sniffing dogs circled each car.

NG over the years has had several search dogs on with their trainers who explain the capabilities of the dogs and because JR was last seen at the playground, they should have been able to pick up and follow her scent with ease so I was surprised to learn the dogs didn't help LE find the vacant apartment or dumpster where she was placed, that's all.

http://www6.lexisnexis.com/publishe...=100020422&docId=l:1556784692&isRss=true&Em=4

I think we need Sarx or Oriah to come and expand on this subject.

Because of the different types of dogs and what their capabilities are, and if a child is moving through a complex alive on a regular basis would scent dogs be able to track her? (The reason I ask this is because I don't know dogs that well and IIRC in another missing child case there were alerts down by a river close to that child's home but it was later revealed that the skin cells that the dogs pick up were carried by the wind).

Also I wonder how far away do the cadaver dogs when used can detect a deceased body? Like ---yards, feet and such KWIM?

I'm curious too.

 

[Kat]

So, can Ryan Brunn could actually qualify for the death penalty even though he will plea not guilty?

One has nothing to do with the other Abagale. The state decides if it will seek the DP as a sentence for the charges.

RB just pleads to the charges.

 

[abagale]

Since he didn't take a plea. If he is found guilty of murder, then can the state charge him with the death penalty?

 

[katydid23]

don't freak on me katydid, the TOD has been called at around 6:30, I was just off on one of my tangents, lol

Me and my whatifs.

Ok. I feel calmer now. I was just trying to imagine how those searchers and first responders would have felt if she was steps away from them, being murdered while they were outside calling her name. I think it is hard enough for them as it is. :rose:

 

[katydid23]

DNA will be important but IMO he was ID'd by fingerprints AT the scene.
Bloody finger prints even.
A much quicker match than DNA.
~jmo

I think so too. At least I hope so.

 

[sherbetjello]

IDK but I have heard rumors in political circles in the city of Canton that the local PD botched the initial investigation.

This statement alone scares the heeby jibbies (ms) out of me.

I wish LE would release what it was that lead them to arrest RB. I wish they would say why they are checking his past (which it has been checked, sort of). There has to be something that leads this department to believe this crime attaches itself to more.

RB has no prior history behind him, that's on record. That in my opinion is really scary - can't put how scary it is into words.

I find I am having bad logic in how RB murdered JR, dumped/hid her body, went to the leasing office, and JR's apartment to get a picture to show everyone, and then participated in the search for her.
Maybe someone can help me with that.

I am not defending this person RB - I have to clarify that.
I am naturally confused to what makes LE so confident it is RB and I wish they would release some of the convicting information so I/we know they have the right man.

 

[gngr~snap]

All I see is guilty as charged. I believe they have finger print evidence that connects him and only him to the scene, his apartment and his car.
NOT a lot of wiggle room the DNA will seal the deal and he will plead for his life.
IMHO

 

[Kat]

Since he didn't take a plea. If he is found guilty of murder, then can the state charge him with the death penalty?

If the state chooses the DP as a possible sentence for the charges then yes he can face sentencing of DP.

But the DP would come in the sentencing phase after a conviction.

(ETA: His plea has to do with charges brought against him, not the sentencing after conviction).

 

[tlcya]

I think we need Sarx or Oriah to come and expand on this subject.

Because of the different types of dogs and what their capabilities are, and if a child is moving through a complex alive on a regular basis would scent dogs be able to track her? (The reason I ask this is because I don't know dogs that well and IIRC in another missing child case there were alerts down by a river close to that child's home but it was later revealed that the skin cells that the dogs pick up were carried by the wind).

Also I wonder how far away do the cadaver dogs when used can detect a deceased body? Like ---yards, feet and such KWIM?

I'm curious too.

I think we have a general SARS Q & A thread somewhere. I should pull it up and link it.

 

[georgiagirl]

I just got home from the vigil and the viewing....I am forever changed as a mother and a human being. What I saw tonight will never ever leave me. There are no words.....

 

[gngr~snap]

This statement alone scares the heeby jibbies (ms) out of me.

I wish LE would release what it was that lead them to arrest RB. I wish they would say why they are checking his past (which it has been checked, sort of). There has to be something that leads this department to believe this crime attaches itself to more.

RB has no prior history behind him, that's on record. That in my opinion is really scary - can't put how scary it is into words.

I find I am having bad logic in how RB murdered JR, dumped/hid her body, went to the leasing office, and JR's apartment to get a picture to show everyone, and then participated in the search for her.
Maybe someone can help me with that.


I am not defending this person RB - I have to clarify that.
I am naturally confused to what makes LE so confident it is RB and I wish they would release some of the convicting information so I/we know they have the right man.

He could have taken less than 30 min doing the "deed"- sorry
He didn't really clean up the scene imo.
May even have his shoe prints there in blood.
Possibly wore a disposable cover all? When he killed her.
Tossed his shoes in the trunk of his car leaving another shoe print...
(it was dark he didn't realize it.) drove to his place...
Washed his hands rinsed his shoes and whammo!
45-50 min later is ready to aid in the search?
Never made it back to his car to clean up evidence due to high police presence that he didn't count on.
IDK something like that.

 

[tlcya]

Couldn't find a non case specific forum one but here is one that has been a great resource in Kyron Horman's case

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119509&highlight=SARS

Better more general one

Dogs - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[abagale]

I read an article earlier today that said K9 dogs and a helicopter aided in the search and afaik, K9 dogs search for missing children but it didn't say anything more about what happened and where they went.

Using dogs which search for missing children would have really helped in this case since the crime was fresh and committed in a confined area.

Another article (link below) said Troopers were dispatched to check licenses and cars on the road in front of the complex. Thigpen said they had two machines that read license plates and instantly checked for warrants, stolen car reports or registrations to sex offenders while two drug-sniffing dogs circled each car.

NG over the years has had several search dogs on with their trainers who explain the capabilities of the dogs and because JR was last seen at the playground, they should have been able to pick up and follow her scent with ease so I was surprised to learn the dogs didn't help LE find the vacant apartment or dumpster where she was placed, that's all.

http://www6.lexisnexis.com/publishe...=100020422&docId=l:1556784692&isRss=true&Em=4

This statement alone scares the heeby jibbies (ms) out of me.

I wish LE would release what it was that lead them to arrest RB. I wish they would say why they are checking his past (which it has been checked, sort of). There has to be something that leads this department to believe this crime attaches itself to more.

RB has no prior history behind him, that's on record. That in my opinion is really scary - can't put how scary it is into words.

I find I am having bad logic in how RB murdered JR, dumped/hid her body, went to the leasing office, and JR's apartment to get a picture to show everyone, and then participated in the search for her.
Maybe someone can help me with that.

I am not defending this person RB - I have to clarify that.
I am naturally confused to what makes LE so confident it is RB and I wish they would release some of the convicting information so I/we know they have the right man.

John Wayne Gacy killed 33 young men and boys. He stored the bodies in and around his home for years. He was also known as the neighborhood clown. He would actually be asked by parents to attend their kids birthday parties dress up as the birthday clown. That takes a lot of nerve.

Jeffrey Dahmer killed 17 young men, but he had to befriend them first. He was giving. He was generous to them. He was kind until he got them back to his apartment and you know the rest.

I think Ryan is a Serial Killer. He is cunning, smart, and likable. Each of these killers had their own ordinary attraction. It is almost like they have two sides. They are sort of a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde combination.

 

[tlcya]

dogs are trained for different scents, this is a very important point. Bombs don't lose their scent, that is why they can be found decades later. Drugs keep their scent for years as well, hence why they can find drugs that haven't been touched for years. It takes years for decomposition to happen, again, why a cadaver dog can find a body that's been missing for years and years.
Now, here is where it changes. Area search dogs are air scenting and picking up "the cone" of traces of human scent. This disappears very fast and they will have no success if the person isn't there as there is nothing for them to smell.
Trailing dogs are scent specific looking for a particular person and are following tiny particles of human tissue and skin cells. These tiny skin cells (think micro dander) only have a limited shelf life. Also important is that sun and heat are the enemy and will greatly shorten the life of the trail.

interesting tidbit from SARX

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Dogs

 

[krimekat]

So, can Ryan Brunn could actually qualify for the death penalty even though he will plea not guilty?

his plea has nothing to do with the maximum sentence to the crime