Why do the McCanns care about us?

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blaize said:
I understand your point Texana but to be honest I don't think the McCann's can or should be engaged in another campaign yet, that could involve them in more legal wrangling. Their focus should be on finding Madeleine.

By the way my comment about the PI's was not aimed at you or anybody else here either.
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Blaize, I hear you. I don't think the McCanns should be taking on a global kind of campaign either, with Madeleine's fate still unknown. However, they did that themselves from the very beginning:

"Kate hints her future may lie in helping other families cope with abductions. "There are so many missing children out there, abducted children and sexually-exploited children," she said.

"Once you know all that you can't turn a blind eye to it. Madeleine is our priority but we have to help. We can't just ignore those other children.

"Whatever comes out of our experience, anything that can make the tiniest bit of difference to make the world safer place is going to be a good thing. I feel a moral obligation.

"Madeleine means so much to me, but you can't take it away from the bigger picture."

http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=1590&id=1223682007

If they are going to be talking about other children, then at the very least, they need to be saying that the whole "baby listening" idea is not safe. That would make the tiniest bit of difference, as Kate says, wouldn't it?

The whole "can't take it away from the bigger picture" emphasis is just so odd to me. I fully agree that everyone grieves uniquely. But to be talking so soon about "the bigger picture" is atypical in the extreme.

I have a good friend who lost a two year old suddenly to an undiagnosed medical condition twenty years ago. He was literally healthy one minute and then dropped into unconsciousness.

She spent four years in the Compassionate Friends support group (a national organization for parents who have lost their children) and only then did she spend another six years in the group helping others. (She says she felt she needed to help others as she was helped.)

The McCanns set themselves up early on as global activists for missing children, but they haven't really said the one thing that might stop other children from being abducted. Both things just don't make sense to me.
 
I'd think that if a couple had plenty of money and an abducted child, they would want to lay low and start hiring outside experts to infiltrate areas so that the girl could eventually be rescued or find someone who knows of the pedophile abduction rings. Getting a little girl back or finding her should be the one and only top priority or interest for a long time.
 
I did not know the Mc Canns care about us. I personally think they care about themselves (who wouldn't in a situation like that?) IF they are guilty, then they need to keep pretending and clear up their names somehow because these people have careers, etc. IF they are innocent, heck...it is not a nice position to be AT ALL.

So I think is a natural thing to want to defend yourself IF you feel you are being wrongly accused.

Having said that, some of their statements (in my view) are idiotic as to defend the fact they left their tots alone. After the amount of criticism they got from around the world, you would at least think they would accept it was stupid.

So I really do not think they care about us at all but themselves.
 
I would have said that they care what people think, but Sleuthmom, thinking over what you said, I'm not so sure I wouldn't change my mind to agree with you...
 
txsvicki said:
I'd think that if a couple had plenty of money and an abducted child, they would want to lay low and start hiring outside experts to infiltrate areas so that the girl could eventually be rescued or find someone who knows of the pedophile abduction rings. Getting a little girl back or finding her should be the one and only top priority or interest for a long time.
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Agree 100%.
 
Texana said:
Blaize, I hear you. I don't think the McCanns should be taking on a global kind of campaign either, with Madeleine's fate still unknown. However, they did that themselves from the very beginning:

"Kate hints her future may lie in helping other families cope with abductions. "There are so many missing children out there, abducted children and sexually-exploited children," she said.

"Once you know all that you can't turn a blind eye to it. Madeleine is our priority but we have to help. We can't just ignore those other children.

"Whatever comes out of our experience, anything that can make the tiniest bit of difference to make the world safer place is going to be a good thing. I feel a moral obligation.

"Madeleine means so much to me, but you can't take it away from the bigger picture."

http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=1590&id=1223682007

If they are going to be talking about other children, then at the very least, they need to be saying that the whole "baby listening" idea is not safe. That would make the tiniest bit of difference, as Kate says, wouldn't it?

The whole "can't take it away from the bigger picture" emphasis is just so odd to me. I fully agree that everyone grieves uniquely. But to be talking so soon about "the bigger picture" is atypical in the extreme.

I have a good friend who lost a two year old suddenly to an undiagnosed medical condition twenty years ago. He was literally healthy one minute and then dropped into unconsciousness.

She spent four years in the Compassionate Friends support group (a national organization for parents who have lost their children) and only then did she spend another six years in the group helping others. (She says she felt she needed to help others as she was helped.)

The McCanns set themselves up early on as global activists for missing children, but they haven't really said the one thing that might stop other children from being abducted. Both things just don't make sense to me.
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Hello Texana,

I think when or if Madeleine is found then definitely Kate or Gerry or both should then speak out. But right now, no. On the one hand no one knows to a legal certainty where Madeleine is or what may have happened to her & as long as her parents are suspects in her disappearance it serves no positive purpose for them to speak out.

In fact playing devil's advocate here now, if they were guilty and spoke out about their own stupidity in leaving the children alone and how baby listening services could be dangerous etc, isn't it possible that they could garner a lot of distracting sympathy away from Madeleine's actual disappearance towards their own loss? Not only that but if they were found guilty wouldn't that totally detract from the any positive effect their speaking out might have had?

On the other hand if they're innocent and start a campaign against baby listening services right now or in the next few weeks isn't it likely that would take their focus & some resources away from finding Madeleine?

Personally I think one of the established internationally children's charities would be a better advocate for something like this anyway. Then when or if Madeleine is found or in the awful event she's not found & the McCann's are cleared of any involvement, there would be a neutral, unaffiliated body in charge of the campaign who can approach the McCann's as spokespeople or sponsors of the stop the baby listening service campaign.

Just my own opinion.
 
Blaize, it doesn't matter what you or I think the McCanns should have done in regards to setting themselves up as advocates for missing children worldwide, they've already done that. They did it from the very beginning. Maddie had been missing just a little over two months when Gerry McCann came to the United States, not as part of the search for Madeleine, but as a "fact finding" mission in preventing other child abductions.

"The father of missing Madeleine McCann will continue his visit to the United States today with a series of meetings with politicians.

Gerry McCann is in the US for a four-day fact-finding visit with the family’s campaigner Justine McGuinness.

He will meet a senior member of first lady Laura Bush’s staff as well as senators and congressmen in Washington DC.

Mr. McCann has already met US attorney general Alberto Gonzales to discuss efforts to tackle child abduction.

The meetings are part of a visit to the US to learn about the work of specialist agencies in preventing child trafficking and sexual abuse."

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2005320001-2007340178,00.html
 
STEADFAST said:
I'm not sure the McCanns do care what an American crime forum thinks of them. I guess that they care what the British public think because it would be so very helpful to have lots of public backing if they get into any more serious legal troubles and to be able to live comfortably among their neighbors. Also, in general, I think they (at least Gerry) like to get attention and admiration. There could also be a money angle.

Are there any pro-McCann posters on here? I mean people who think the McCanns are good parents or think they couldn't possibly be guilty of hurting Madeleine or who enjoy reading Gerry's blog? I've missed those posts.

There are posters, myself included, who haven't made up their minds about whether the McCann's are guilty. Not the same as being pro-McCann.
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Guess you haven't seen my posts then -- I am 'pro-McCann' and do not believe that they either murdered or accidentally killed Madeleine. There are quite a few of us actually on this board. I don't think anyone has parented mistake free. I don't think the McCann's are drunks or swingers or even bad parents. I can't join the rants of the majority on this board who have gone the path of wild speculation in this case.
 
Texana said:
Blaize, it doesn't matter what you or I think the McCanns should have done in regards to setting themselves up as advocates for missing children worldwide, they've already done that. They did it from the very beginning. Maddie had been missing just a little over two months when Gerry McCann came to the United States, not as part of the search for Madeleine, but as a "fact finding" mission in preventing other child abductions.
<Respectfully Snipped>
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Hello Texana, sorry not to reply sooner.

The McCann's have spoken as advocates & I understand that you say that their doing that and not speaking out against the listening service seems odd to you but as I've said in a previous post there may be a legal reason they haven't spoken out. That's just my take on it anyway.
 
BethyC said:
Guess you haven't seen my posts then -- I am 'pro-McCann' and do not believe that they either murdered or accidentally killed Madeleine. There are quite a few of us actually on this board. I don't think anyone has parented mistake free. I don't think the McCann's are drunks or swingers or even bad parents. I can't join the rants of the majority on this board who have gone the path of wild speculation in this case.
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Hi BettyC,

Good to hear from you. So, now that you've posted, I wonder if you could share your take on why the McCanns seem to care so much about what is said in the media, while not always taking some very obvious actions toward finding their daughter? Here is one example:

Madeleine is likely to look different now, at almost 4.5 years, than she did in the most recent pictures taken of her. The McCanns could (and should) do something that is routinely done here in the U.S. (and which they must know about): That is, "virtual aging" of a picture.

We all feel sorry for the McCanns, especially over flurries of excitement (like the one this past week) when children who look like Maddy are spotted.

On the other hand, this would happen less if an ACCURATE picture of Maddy were to be released. The most recent picture of Madeleine that the McCanns have released (shown for much of the day on www.cnn.com), is really old -- probably taken when she was TWO as it is very baby-like.

If finding their daughter matters more to them than getting media/public sympathy, shouldn't they release an accurate picture of her? This is inexplicable to me.

Would love to hear YOUR take on some of these matters -- That is, the "generous" intepretation of some of their choices. Thanks for any positive light you can shed on them. I'm sure many of us here would rather they not be involved, it's just that so much of their behavior is inexplicable.

Thanks so much.
 
SleuthMom said:
True, but some are surely idiocy-free.
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Of course I made mistakes in my parenting...and will no doubt make a few more before I die. (Parenting never ends - even when the kids are grown!)

But, here's one mistake I didn't and certainly would NOT have made. First off, I didn't leave my children alone at age three and under so I could go out and have a good time. Did I ever get tired of the responsibility of parenting and wish I could party hardy? Sure...but I took my duty as a mother seriously and knew that it would have been totally wrong to leave babies alone. The mere thought that one of them MIGHT have awakened and had the terrifying feeling of no mommy or daddy in the house would've stopped me cold.

But, you know what? I could probably forgive the McCanns if this had been the first time they ever tried that stunt. While I would've thought them rather stupid for setting up a scenario that invited trouble on so many levels, I still would've been devastated that someone chose that time to hurt/take their child and my heart would've gone out to the anyway.

What makes it very hard for me to go that full sympathy route is the knowlege that Maddie had cried for an extended period of time a few nights before. Criminy!! What kind of selfish parent could go off and leave their baby alone (away from the comfort of her own home..or country!), knowing full well she'd had to endure such agony just a few nights before???? In my book, that defines selfish and callous.

I do not rush to judgement on whether the McCanns are guilty of killing their daughter or not. When the Maddie picture came up yesterday morning, my heart soared. Even though I had doubts as to it really looking like Maddie, I prayed fervently it was her. And today, if more evidence came along that she was alive - I'd be the first to exult in that.

But, I'm not blind and dumb and I'm not a moron. PLE made Kate and Gerry arguidos. You don't make that kind of accusation on a whim. So, I have to factor that in. And while news on this case is confusing and contradictory, there are certain pieces of information and news that do stand out - most particularly the work of the cadaver dogs.

Added to that, the McCanns themselves keep changing their story. That's huge in my book. It is NOT a rush to judgement to evaluate their ever changing stories and wonder why they can't stick with one version of the important parts of the chronology of Maddies' disappearance.

I have the right, as a member of the human race, to not like certain things the McCanns do - selling Maddie items certainly ranks right up there as galling and sickening. Writing breezy blogs of their daily jogs and jaunts is a little weird. (I try to imagine me writing a blog after the death of my son...nope, can't picture that at all.) Washing Cuddle Cat - not something I've seen other grieving mothers do with precious belongings relating to their gone children...the list goes on.

But, in the end, I hold out hope that Maddie will be found alive and, if she is dead, I pray fervently that, whoever killed her will be found out and made to pay for their heinous deed.
 
Excellent post teacherbees!
 
teacherbees said:
Of course I made mistakes in my parenting...and will no doubt make a few more before I die. (Parenting never ends - even when the kids are grown!)

But, here's one mistake I didn't and certainly would NOT have made. First off, I didn't leave my children alone at age three and under so I could go out and have a good time. Did I ever get tired of the responsibility of parenting and wish I could party hardy? Sure...but I took my duty as a mother seriously and knew that it would have been totally wrong to leave babies alone. The mere thought that one of them MIGHT have awakened and had the terrifying feeling of no mommy or daddy in the house would've stopped me cold.

But, you know what? I could probably forgive the McCanns if this had been the first time they ever tried that stunt. While I would've thought them rather stupid for setting up a scenario that invited trouble on so many levels, I still would've been devastated that someone chose that time to hurt/take their child and my heart would've gone out to the anyway.

What makes it very hard for me to go that full sympathy route is the knowlege that Maddie had cried for an extended period of time a few nights before. Criminy!! What kind of selfish parent could go off and leave their baby alone (away from the comfort of her own home..or country!), knowing full well she'd had to endure such agony just a few nights before???? In my book, that defines selfish and callous.

I do not rush to judgement on whether the McCanns are guilty of killing their daughter or not. When the Maddie picture came up yesterday morning, my heart soared. Even though I had doubts as to it really looking like Maddie, I prayed fervently it was her. And today, if more evidence came along that she was alive - I'd be the first to exult in that.

But, I'm not blind and dumb and I'm not a moron. PLE made Kate and Gerry arguidos. You don't make that kind of accusation on a whim. So, I have to factor that in. And while news on this case is confusing and contradictory, there are certain pieces of information and news that do stand out - most particularly the work of the cadaver dogs.

Added to that, the McCanns themselves keep changing their story. That's huge in my book. It is NOT a rush to judgement to evaluate their ever changing stories and wonder why they can't stick with one version of the important parts of the chronology of Maddies' disappearance.

I have the right, as a member of the human race, to not like certain things the McCanns do - selling Maddie items certainly ranks right up there as galling and sickening. Writing breezy blogs of their daily jogs and jaunts is a little weird. (I try to imagine me writing a blog after the death of my son...nope, can't picture that at all.) Washing Cuddle Cat - not something I've seen other grieving mothers do with precious belongings relating to their gone children...the list goes on.

But, in the end, I hold out hope that Maddie will be found alive and, if she is dead, I pray fervently that, whoever killed her will be found out and made to pay for their heinous deed.
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Do you understand the concept of arguido? Do you know that some people actually ask to be made arguidos because it gives them more legal protection? It's not the same as a suspect in the US or UK. The McCanns had to be made arguidos so that the police could ask them certain questions. Kate was questioned for the first day as a witness and was asked no questions about Maddie's disappearance. Then she was made arguido for the second day of questioning so that they could ask her questions about Maddie's disappearance.

They aren't they only arguidos and more people may be made arguidos.

ETa:- But you're right of course, the Portuguese police didn't make them arguidos on a whim. They made them arguidos based on their theory that the McCanns injected their daughter with a massive dose of sleeping tablets then kept her body for 25 days before disposing of it under the full glare of the world's media.
There is no doubt in my mind that they will be cleared of this. I haven't felt so sure of anything since the Danielle van dam case.
 
Do you know that some people actually ask to be made arguidos because it gives them more legal protection?
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That's correct although ...are you suggesting this is the case with the Mc Canns? Based on a little piece I read today from the latest of their blog, I do not have that impression AT ALL. Same, as just judging how worried sick Gerry Mc Cann looked after the last police interview when he was made an arguido.
 
I cringe when I read comments here where people define themselves as pro Mccaans or con Mccaans. I believe we should be neither of these and what we shold be is pro Maddie. This means finding Maddie should be they only thing we are "pro" about. In order to do this we must consider all evidence, all possibiities and all outcomes. This means that if we declare ourselves pro or con the mcCaans then we are distoring our reasoning which is a definite detriment to the ultimate goal of finding Maddie.

mjak
 
SleuthMom said:
That's correct although ...are you suggesting this is the case with the Mc Canns? Based on a little piece I read today from the latest of their blog, I do not have that impression AT ALL. Same, as just judging how worried sick Gerry Mc Cann looked after the last police interview when he was made an arguido.
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No I'm pretty certain they didn't ask to be made arguidos but the fact that many people do highlights the difference between a Portuguese arguido/a and a British/American suspect. You don't ever hear of anyone in the UK or US asking to be made a suspect!

It's a status which carries added legal protection. I understand that they are not allowed to ask questions pertaining to potential involvement without the interviewee having arguido/a status.

I'm sure I'd look worried sick if my child had been abducted and instead of looking for her, the police made their mind up that I'd killed her and someone disposed of her body under the full glare of the world's media.

I'm not even sure how the McCanns were supposed to have disposed of her body. I don't normally pack a shovel when I go on vacation and I don't know anyone who does. Nor have I ever stayed in a holiday apartment which had a shovel as part of it's inventory. Do the police suppose they used spoons to dig a grave?

Regarding the theory about them somehow persuading a British sailor to dispose of her body at sea.... The nearest marina is about 4 miles away from their resort (along a main road) and they didn't have access to a hired car at that time. You can check this easily on Google Earth.

There is not one shred of evidence which supports a parents did it theory. They didn't have the means, motive or opportunity IMO.
 
Jayelles said:
I'm sure I'd look worried sick if my child had been abducted and instead of looking for her, the police made their mind up that I'd killed her and someone disposed of her body under the full glare of the world's media.
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You mean if you was innocent. So far, the Mc Canns's names have not been cleared up by the police...which means they could or they could not have been involved.

I'm not even sure how the McCanns were supposed to have disposed of her body. I don't normally pack a shovel when I go on vacation and I don't know anyone who does. Nor have I ever stayed in a holiday apartment which had a shovel as part of it's inventory. Do the police suppose they used spoons to dig a grave?
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Not sure but is certain that those cadaver dogs did smell something.


There is not one shred of evidence which supports a parents did it theory. They didn't have the means, motive or opportunity IMO.
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Motive, perhaps...if it was an accident they do not need one. Means and opportunity? Heck, yes. No need to bury her, throw her in the ocean and job done.
 
They most certainly had the same opportunity to dispose of her that an abductor had to take her.

They would not need motive, as Sleuthmom said, for an accidental death.

And you don't really need a shovel if excavations are already taking place.

The cadaver dogs alerted to the scent of decomposition in the Renault Scenic. A DNA sample was recovered from the car.

That is evidence, which may or may not be connected to other evidence that ultimately convicts the McCanns, but it is evidence.
 
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