2012.02.07 - 911 Tapes Released

[marlame]

I agree with much of what you say.

However, I do think the system needs specific reforms. I've worked in family law and have seen similar potential problems in my state. It's true Josh was/is the only one legally and morally culpable (IMO) for these horrific acts. Nevertheless, we should use this as an eye opening experience to change the system for the better.

Off the top of my head:

1. Once the judge determined last Wednesday that the Cox's would retain primary physical custody of the boys, Josh should have been denied any visitation, supervised or not, until he underwent and passed the psycho-sexual and polygraph exams.
2. His status as a person of interest in his wife's disappearance, along with his tenuous alibi, while having no impact criminally, should have been considered in determining custody.

3. Additionally, there should have been more than one case worker assigned, and any visitation that had existed in the past should have occurred at a neutral location over which Josh had no authority.
Would Josh still have gone postal somewhere else? Perhaps. But the system made it far easier for him by entrusting him control over length of time, place and manner in which to plan, prepare and engage in cold-blooded murder.
To brush this under the rug as an unpreventable atrocity by an evil being risks the occurrence of a similar tragedy in the future. We can do better.

BBM
This is a great post! After last Wednesday's hearing I was concerned he would do something and wondered why the Judge gave him until next summer to under go testing. Obviously, there was enough concern on the Judge's part to have ordered the psycho-sexual evaluation, why not make it conditional on even seeing his children?

The visitation taking place in his home and not at a neutral location is what has me so upset! I wonder if the Judge was aware and signed off on allowing DSHS to switch the location of the supervised visits to Josh's house?

The reason for supervised visitation is to PROTECT the children! Why his visitation was switched from a neutral facility to his home is the "FATAL" question...

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Why are we STILL questioning the actions of the sw?

Putting "hypothetically" in front of the post does not change things.

 

[Paige SC]

I thought she was on the phone with 911 when she smelled gasoline.

She had to go back to her car to get the address. I assume while in the car she mentions a "btw, I smell gas". It can be looked at from more than one angle, this is just the way I interpret the transcript. I can't imagine she would smell gas once in her car and not from the front porch.

SOCIAL WORKER: It’s 8119 and I think it’s 89th -- I don’t know what the address is.

911 OPERATOR: OK, that’s pretty important for me to know.


SOCIAL WORKER: I’m sorry, just a minute. Let me get in my car and see if I can find it. Nothing like this has ever happened before in these visitations, so, I’m really shocked and I can hear one of the kids crying but he still wouldn’t let me in. OK, it is one, uh, one ... Oh, just a minute I have it here. You can’t find me by GPS?
911 OPERATOR: No.
(Pause of approximately 10 seconds.)
SOCIAL WORKER: OK, it is — I still can’t find it. But I think I need help right away. He’s on a very short leash with DSHS (Department of Social and Health Services), and CPS (Child Protective Services) has been involved. And this is the craziest thing. He looked right at me and closed the door. Are you there?
911 OPERATOR: Yes, ma’am, I’m just waiting to know where you are.
SOCIAL WORKER: OK. It’s 8119 189th St. Court East, Puyallup, 98375. And I’d like to pull out of the driveway because I smell gasoline and he won’t let me in.
911 OPERATOR: You want to pull out of the driveway because you smell gasoline but he won’t let you ...?
SOCIAL WORKER: He won’t let me in.
911 OPERATOR: He won’t let you out of the driveway?
SOCIAL WORKER: He won’t let me in the house.
911 OPERATOR: Whose house is it?


http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...powells-home/2012/02/08/gIQAcKKOzQ_story.html

 

[rotterdam]

I thought she was on the phone with 911 when she smelled gasoline.

I thought she called her office(employer) first, prior to the 911 call.
Apparently that was a requirement of her employer.
We do not know the length of that first call.

 

[Nixie]

hypothetically speaking she may have been pounding on the doors and windows trying to get in which has been reported. She may have panicked and tried to get Josh to open the door. She may have been doing what a lot of people would do and that is try to get to the children.

I really don't get it the poor woman witnessed something horrible. She had been doing the visits sense Nov and had no problem. She loved those little boys and had a bond with them according to reports. Why would anyone second guess someone who went through a situation like that? She was right there as sick as I get just reading about it for her to have been there it must be torture. To hear the little boys cry and not be able to help them, to see the house explode and know they were in there. to go through that then have others second guess what you did........hypothetically or not no ones knows what they would do or how they would handle it. No one knows what she was told to do in a situation like that. The case worker is lucky she is alive and could have survivors guilt. We know she has emotional distress from reports. There is no reason to attack a victim in a case who had no part in what went wrong. Not like she just stood there and watched or something. My goodness I need to take a step back this is all to much 2 little boys are dead at the hands of their own father and people are second guessing other victims.

 

[Just K]

I know many caseworkers and to one who is very close to me I just sent this email.


This is very important to any Social Worker who drops off children or supervises any form of visitation. This father, Josh Powell, was suspected of killing his wife who went missing in December of 2009. At some point the father moved the kids out of their home...I believe even getting rid of the mothers personal belongings. Anyway, he moved them to the State of Washington and into a house with his father/the grandfather to the two boys. In September of 2011, the grandfather to the children was arrested and charged with child p()rn and voyeurism. The father of the boys also came into the spotlight of the investigation and the boys were put into the custody of their maternal grandparents. For a time, the kids had 2x a week "supervised visitation" at a community-based "safe house." Josh Powell complained that while there the boys had to share toys and they just didn't get quality time together. Then, last Wednesday there was a court hearing and the judge agreed to continue the court ordered "supervised visits"
but that the father could not regain custody until he underwent psycho-sexual exam and a lie detector tests.

Anyway, on Sunday, the boys were driven from their grandparents home to the father's home...for some reason DSHS (the equivalent of our DHS/CPS) agreed to let the visitation be at the father's newly rented home. He had moved from the boys grandfather's (the pervert's) home into that rental.

When the caseworker arrives, she talks to the father on the porch...she says the boys are just a step or two ahead of her. The father opens the front door and the boys go in while the father rushes in and locks the caseworker out. She tries, to no avail, to get him to open the door. Then she goes to her car, which is in the driveway, and calls 911. The dispatcher keeps her answering stupid questions for seven minutes as the home explodes...killing the boys and the piece of **** who they called father.

This is the 911 transcript:
http://www.ksro.com/news/article.aspx?id=1680530

If you find yourself in any situation where you have to call 911 on a custodial caregiver or a parent:

Make sure you know the address! Have the address readily available.
Give the address and tell of the threatening nature at the beginning of the call!
Make sure they hear the urgency in your request!
If you are seriously concerned demand to talk a 911 call center supervisor!
Do not delay in getting out the details and communicating the urgency!!!

 

[annalia]

It looks like some facts are getting slightly changed which paints a different picture than what actually happened.

- She didn't wait 10 minutes before calling 9-11. As someone already posted she gave an approximation when she was in the middle of the 9-11 call.
- She didn't say that she heard one the boys screaming, she said she heard one of the boys crying, and she didn't say that she heard one of the boys crying at the exact time that she first went to the door with them. It may have been a few minutes later.
- It was really does seem to have been just a matter of minutes, she said that she tried to get him to open the door, she thought at first that he didn't understand that she was supposed to come in. A few minutes for that then calling 9-11. Where is all of this wasted time??
- She was at her car on the phone with 9-11 when she said she smelled the gas and wanted to move her car out of the driveway. What difference did it make at that point? She was already with 9-11.
- She also said immediately to the dispatcher that she needed someone there right away, that was a sense of urgency.

If she's said to be at fault, what exactly was it that she didn't do that she should have done?

It's one thing to point to the system, the courts and judges, but it's another thing to say that the SW was so improperly trained that she made major mistakes.

It's easy to dissect it now and sit back and say she should have done this immediately and she should have said that instead of this but we're not talking about a scripted episode of Law & Order here. I don't see what training was that would have changed anything.

JMHO

 

[Paige SC]

I know many caseworkers and to one who is very close to me I just sent this email.


This is very important to any Social Worker who drops off children or supervises any form of visitation. This father, Josh Powell, was suspected of killing his wife who went missing in December of 2009. At some point the father moved the kids out of their home...I believe even getting rid of the mothers personal belongings. Anyway, he moved them to the State of Washington and into a house with his father/the grandfather to the two boys. In September of 2011, the grandfather to the children was arrested and charged with child p()rn and voyeurism. The father of the boys also came into the spotlight of the investigation and the boys were put into the custody of their maternal grandparents. For a time, the kids had 2x a week "supervised visitation" at a community-based "safe house." Josh Powell complained that while there the boys had to share toys and they just didn't get quality time together. Then, last Wednesday there was a court hearing and the judge agreed to continue the court ordered "supervised visits"
but that the father could not regain custody until he underwent psycho-sexual exam and a lie detector tests.

Anyway, on Sunday, the boys were driven from their grandparents home to the father's home...for some reason DSHS (the equivalent of our DHS/CPS) agreed to let the visitation be at the father's newly rented home. He had moved from the boys grandfather's (the pervert's) home into that rental.

When the caseworker arrives, she talks to the father on the porch...she says the boys are just a step or two ahead of her. The father opens the front door and the boys go in while the father rushes in and locks the caseworker out. She tries, to no avail, to get him to open the door. Then she goes to her car, which is in the driveway, and calls 911. The dispatcher keeps her answering stupid questions for seven minutes as the home explodes...killing the boys and the piece of **** who they called father.

This is the 911 transcript:
http://www.ksro.com/news/article.aspx?id=1680530

If you find yourself in any situation where you have to call 911 on a custodial caregiver or a parent:

Make sure you know the address! Have the address readily available.
Give the address and tell of the threatening nature at the beginning of the call!
Make sure they hear the urgency in your request!
If you are seriously concerned demand to talk a 911 call center supervisor!
Do not delay in getting out the details and communicating the urgency!!!

:tyou: ! This is what I feel we should expect from ALL our trained professionals designed to protect the innocent.

 

[Adrienne37]

The fault of this entire situation is on no one other than Josh Powell. However, 2 things that need to be changed based on this case at this point that I can see are first off, after Wednesday's hearing, all access to those boys should have been taken away from Josh, supervised, unsupervised, whatever. Secondly, the 911 operator clearly needs additional training in how to properly speak to a person when they are calling to 911 seeking emergency services. This guy was wwwwaaayyyy out of line, his condescending attitude to this woman and just quite frankly his whole lack of concern whatsoever is very concerning to me. Listening to the call just makes me want to put my arms through my monitor and shake him. It's just such a very very sad situation.

 

[Paige SC]

It looks like some facts are getting slightly changed which paints a different picture than what actually happened.

-She didn't wait 10 minutes before calling 9-11. As someone already posted she gave an approximation when she was in the middle of the 9-11 call.
-She didn't say that she heard one the boys screaming, she said she heard one of the boys crying, and she didn't say that she heard one of the boys crying at the exact time that she first went to the door with them. It may have been a few minutes later.
-It was really does seem to have been just a matter of minutes, she said that she tried to get him to open the door, she thought at first that he didn't understand that she was supposed to come in. A few minutes for that then calling 9-11. Where is all of this wasted time
-She was at her car on the phone with 9-11 when she said she smelled the gas and wanted to move her car out of the driveway. What difference did it make at that point? She was already with 9-11.

If she's said to be at fault, what exactly was it that she didn't do that she should have done?

It's one thing to point to the system, the courts and judges, but it's another thing to say that the SW was so improperly trained that she made major mistakes.

It's easy to dissect it now and sit back and say she should have done this immediately and she should have said that instead of this but we're not talking about a scripted episode of Law & Order here.

JMHO

the very SECOND a supervised case worker is prevented from entering a home where innocent children at risk, a 911 call should be dispatched. No ringing the door bell, no knocking on windows, no calling supervisors, no nothing but 911. In all states, in all cities and in all counties. No ifs ands or buts. Now that we know it's not required, it's a good time to start the ball rolling.

 

[CarolinaMoon]

Watching JVM, she called 911 first, it took the social worker 6 minutes to convince the dispatcher that it was an emergency. I just wish she had had the address handy.

 

[Just K]

[/B]:tyou: ! This is what I feel we should expect from ALL our trained professionals designed to protect the innocent.

Having been a Mental Health Therapist, in a residential facility and a Special Ed teacher with emotionally disturbed children, in one of the richest counties in the country and knowing tons of Social Workers, I have to tell you...I am unaware of a single "in service" (training seminar) where we were trained on how to get information out succinctly in a 911 call.

I hope all agencies will learn from this case and teach their caseworkers how to make a 911 call that gets an immediate response/action.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Even if she would have had the address handy, those boys were going to die that day.

Even if she screamed the address to 911 one minute after that door shut, those boys were going to die that day.


Nothing she could have done would have saved them.

JMO

 

[Paige SC]

Even if she would have had the address handy, those boys were going to die that day.

Even if she screamed the address to 911 one minute after that door shut, those boys were going to die that day.


Nothing she could have done would have saved them.

JMO

So then we should all ask "Why have supervised visits at all ?" Especially when outside vendors don't require MUCH IF ANY training on how to deal with an emergency situation involving the children they are there to supervise. What's the point? Obviously, in this particular case, there should have been NO visits but g-d forbid we put the safety of innocent kids before the rights of psychotic parents.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

You are right, there should have been no visit that day.

But there was one. A horrible one. One with pure evil.

That evil one is THE ONLY ONE that should be blamed for this.

OMGoodness.

She did the best she could.
She is a victim.

Shoulda, woulda, coulda.... And all that jazz!

Its like we are going around and around on a merry go round that just won't stop.

JMO

 

[Just K]

Some OP, above, said "kidnapped." That is absolutely what JP did. The minute he locked the caseworker out he was in direct violation of a court order. He did not have custody of those children and he was only allowed to see them with supervision.

Another lesson that agencies can learn. In the future, caseworkers must be told to use the word "kidnapped" when describing any situation where the non-custodial parent is not allowing the caseworker to see the children.

This is definitely not the caseworkers fault. She was under extreme stress and it seems unprepared by her agency. Then again, under that kind of stress, I'm not sure how much any type of crisis training would have helped.

 

[diphi]

The fault of this entire situation is on no one other than Josh Powell. However, 2 things that need to be changed based on this case at this point that I can see are first off, after Wednesday's hearing, all access to those boys should have been taken away from Josh, supervised, unsupervised, whatever. Secondly, the 911 operator clearly needs additional training in how to properly speak to a person when they are calling to 911 seeking emergency services. This guy was wwwwaaayyyy out of line, his condescending attitude to this woman and just quite frankly his whole lack of concern whatsoever is very concerning to me. Listening to the call just makes me want to put my arms through my monitor and shake him. It's just such a very very sad situation.

I just listened to all the 911 calls. Training is absolutely needed. I can't begin to fathom his nit-pickyness. Even when she did get the address correct, he continued to dismiss her concerns.

AND, how could ANYONE not know who Josh Powell was? In that town? How could they not get it? The 911 operator seemed totally oblivious to the whole situation.

IMO

 

[Dr.Fessel]

No wonder he always looked like he was sucking on lemons. He was holding back a taste much more acerbic than lemon juice. First he killed their mother, his wife, and concocted a cockamamie alibi that carried him forth until he could commit the ultimate betrayal. Then the son of a ***** tried to chop off their heads before immolating them in a homemade inferno that also spat him back into the hell from which he came.

http://theklaasact.blogspot.com/2012/02/son-of-*****-tried-to-chop-off-their.html

 

[bessie]

If you listen to the call you hear that the caseworker provided the address at approximately 1:45 minutes. The remaining five minutes were spent answering questions for the dispatcher.

http://today.seattletimes.com/2012/02/911-audio-from-josh-powells-sister-boys-caseworker/

 

[Adrienne37]

If you listen to the call you hear that the caseworker provided the address at approximately 1:45 minutes. The remaining five minutes were spent answering questions for the dispatcher.

http://today.seattletimes.com/2012/02/911-audio-from-josh-powells-sister-boys-caseworker/

Right down to the tag number and color of her car, I mean, c'mom, was that really pertinent information for the operator to know? Those are questions that could have easily been provided once he dispatched that call to the deputies. All of that is disturbing enough to me but top it off with his condescending attitude, and that makes it just much to bear.