'baby'

[Ames]

thx,I didn't,last I heard about it was Helen Reddy wasn't saying who it was about.
I still wonder who Carly Simon wrote 'You're So Vain' about.Last I heard she only let one person know.I think it was the winner of some sort of charity auction.

I think Carly's song was about Warren Beatty.

 

[Ames]

i think "baby" and "that child" are common to the south as terms of endearment in the one case and specific reference in the other. after having heard these terms used for years in everyday conversation i do not put too much weight on the way they were used by patsy (or darlie, etc).

Did the Ramsey's EVER refer to JonBenet as JONBENET...in any of their interviews...or was she just "THAT child"? "THAT child"...DID have a name.

 

[philamena]

I was born and raised in SC, ....my family still lives there. I would never use the words "THAT child"...while speaking about my murdered daughter.

I guess it all depends on where in the south you were raised. I too was born and raised in the south. Just yesterday a friend of mine and I discussed her babysitting her grandson. She said, "That child is a handful." I never thought a thing of it. Although I do think it was more than odd that the Ram's never, to my knowledge anyway, called their little girl by her name.

 

[Ames]

I guess it all depends on where in the south you were raised. I too was born and raised in the south. Just yesterday a friend of mine and I discussed her babysitting her grandson. She said, "That child is a handful." I never thought a thing of it. Although I do think it was more than odd that the Ram's never, to my knowledge anyway, called their little girl by her name.

Now, I can understand using the phrase "THAT child"....when speaking about another child that is a handful...or one with a discipline problem. But, to refer to your OWN DEAD child...as "THAT child".....it makes me cringe. To me, its as almost as if, Patsy was trying to detach herself from her daughter. Why not say..."we loved JonBenet.....", or "we loved our daughter....". We loved "THAT child"....like I said in an earlier post....it reminds me of Bill Clinton..."I did NOT have sex (sexual relations) with THAT woman". Funny thing....HE was lying too!

 

[coloradokares]

I guess it all depends on where in the south you were raised. I too was born and raised in the south. Just yesterday a friend of mine and I discussed her babysitting her grandson. She said, "That child is a handful." I never thought a thing of it. Although I do think it was more than odd that the Ram's never, to my knowledge anyway, called their little girl by her name.

Note That child was used in description of the child being a handful. Not my grandson is delightful. You just proved the point. THAT kind of is meant to denote anything from a handful to incorigible. However yes they called JonBenet by her name a few times that I can think of post death. However it was after having used That child...... and I am sure lawyers and PR team informed them that best be the last of using that term. The term of endearment for JonBenet was Jonnie B. I thought everyone knew her nickname.

 

[JMO8778]

Now, I can understand using the phrase "THAT child"....when speaking about another child that is a handful...or one with a discipline problem. But, to refer to your OWN DEAD child...as "THAT child".....it makes me cringe. To me, its as almost as if, Patsy was trying to detach herself from her daughter. Why not say..."we loved JonBenet.....", or "we loved our daughter....". We loved "THAT child"....like I said in an earlier post....it reminds me of Bill Clinton..."I did NOT have sex (sexual relations) with THAT woman". Funny thing....HE was lying too!

Yea,I think I would use my child's first name,so that ppl would remember it, and as a matter of respect..not trying to be petty,I just think I would.
I agree,it sure does sound like Clinton and "THAT woman !!!" A distancing and put down of sorts(even hate??),not to mention some blame thrown in that person's way,IMO.

 

[Ames]

Note That child was used in description of the child being a handful. Not my grandson is delightful. You just proved the point. THAT kind of is meant to denote anything from a handful to incorigible. However yes they called JonBenet by her name a few times that I can think of post death. However it was after having used That child...... and I am sure lawyers and PR team informed them that best be the last of using that term. The term of endearment for JonBenet was Jonnie B. I thought everyone knew her nickname.

I knew that Jonnie B was her nickname..but, I never heard the Ramsey's call her that, in any of their interviews. Maybe I just missed it...

 

[Ames]

Yea,I think I would use my child's first name,so that ppl would remember it, and as a matter of respect..not trying to be petty,I just think I would.
I agree,it sure does sound like Clinton and "THAT woman !!!" A distancing and put down of sorts(even hate??),not to mention some blame thrown in that person's way,IMO.

Exactly....almost like the person that they are referring to, is beneath them, in some way. "THAT woman"...."THAT child".....like they were not even going to give them the decency of using their name.

 

[Lisahas2cats]

On our local news today there was a blurb about an area man who was arrested a couple of years for raping and murdering his 14 month old daughter. His confession has been thrown out and he's been released on bond. Anyway, the baby's grandmother was being interviewed, and she said something along the lines of "How could he do that to that baby? That baby never hurt anyone?".

The more I've thought about it, I have found myself referring to kids as "that baby" in a strong emotional way...."That baby didn't deserve such treatment", etc. Even with my own kids...."Leave that baby alone".

This is a really interesting topic...I know that there's a class at the University of TN in Knoxville on regional dialects, I wonder if they have any information on the usage of certain terms in certain areas of the country?

 

[Solace]

Exactly....almost like the person that they are referring to, is beneath them, in some way. "THAT woman"...."THAT child".....like they were not even going to give them the decency of using their name.

Ames: I never use to think it was a big deal that she referred to JonBenet as that child, but I have changed my mind. It is distancing. I believe that now.

 

[santos1014]

Baby does not bother me. THAT child. Infuriates me. I also have family in the South. .... If Atlanta counts and they picked up on That child. As usually when That child or That husband or That neighbor or That is used displeasure is the motivation. Other than that its MY baby.........MY MY MY....not our daughter. MYdaugher etc.

I agree CK. I do that myself. If I am angry or disgusted with someone, I will use THAT...to describe them...THAT man...THAT woman...and so on. Probably just me, but you summed it up very well. I can't imagine describing one of my daughters as THAT child, unless I was completely upset with them.... jmo

 

[Ames]

Ames: I never use to think it was a big deal that she referred to JonBenet as that child, but I have changed my mind. It is distancing. I believe that now.

It bothered me when I first heard her say it. I have always known that they were guilty.

 

[Ames]

I agree CK. I do that myself. If I am angry or disgusted with someone, I will use THAT...to describe them...THAT man...THAT woman...and so on. Probably just me, but you summed it up very well. I can't imagine describing one of my daughters as THAT child, unless I was completely upset with them.... jmo

I feel the same way. I have NEVER described my child...as THAT child.

 

[julianne]

I don't think Patsy using the term "that child" signifies anything. I, like other posters, have heard it used numerous times, being used by both mothers and fathers who love their children immensely, who are not using the words in an effort to "distance" themselves from the child. In my experience, it is mainly used when one is discussing the child to someone who doesn't personally know the child. That's all. One can THINK that it would only be used to "distance" themselves from the particular child spoken about, but here we have posters who say that isn't the case, and that it is used in many instances that basically proves it isn't necessarily akin to "distancing". Therefore, IMO, the fact that the phrase is and has been used before by others when NOT trying to "distance", makes the fact that Patsy said it completely irrelevant.

 

[Ames]

I don't think Patsy using the term "that child" signifies anything. I, like other posters, have heard it used numerous times, being used by both mothers and fathers who love their children immensely, who are not using the words in an effort to "distance" themselves from the child. In my experience, it is mainly used when one is discussing the child to someone who doesn't personally know the child. That's all. One can THINK that it would only be used to "distance" themselves from the particular child spoken about, but here we have posters who say that isn't the case, and that it is used in many instances that basically proves it isn't necessarily akin to "distancing". Therefore, IMO, the fact that the phrase is and has been used before by others when NOT trying to "distance", makes the fact that Patsy said it completely irrelevant.

It's not only the use of THAT child...that makes her look suspicious in my eyes...the list goes ON AND ON...of the Ramsey's suspicious behavior. "THAT child"...is just one of many on that list. Obviously we disagree....you are entitled to your opinion, just as I am entitled to mine.

 

[santos1014]

thx,I didn't,last I heard about it was Helen Reddy wasn't saying who it was about.
I still wonder who Carly Simon wrote 'You're So Vain' about.Last I heard she only let one person know.I think it was the winner of some sort of charity auction.

I thought Tanya Tucker sang that song..Delta Dawn. Did Helen REddy write it?
Recently saw a special where they were discussing Carly Simon's song. She had narrowed it down to 3 men. James Taylor, Warren Beatty, and Mick Jagger. I don't think it's James, cuz they married and the lyrics don't fit him..and Mick sang backup on that song..so if it is about him...probably an inside joke. So I vote for Beatty..he was such a playboy in the 70's!!
She told Regis that she would give 3 letters of his name away,...
E...R...and A...LOL all in those guys names.

sorry to have gotten off topic.

 

[coloradokares]

I don't think Patsy using the term "that child" signifies anything. I, like other posters, have heard it used numerous times, being used by both mothers and fathers who love their children immensely, who are not using the words in an effort to "distance" themselves from the child. In my experience, it is mainly used when one is discussing the child to someone who doesn't personally know the child. That's all. One can THINK that it would only be used to "distance" themselves from the particular child spoken about, but here we have posters who say that isn't the case, and that it is used in many instances that basically proves it isn't necessarily akin to "distancing". Therefore, IMO, the fact that the phrase is and has been used before by others when NOT trying to "distance", makes the fact that Patsy said it completely irrelevant.

That is your opinion and of course you are right to support your opinion as we are ours.

 

[julianne]

That is your opinion and of course you are right to support your opinion as we are ours.

Absolutely.

 

[Solace]

I don't think Patsy using the term "that child" signifies anything. I, like other posters, have heard it used numerous times, being used by both mothers and fathers who love their children immensely, who are not using the words in an effort to "distance" themselves from the child. In my experience, it is mainly used when one is discussing the child to someone who doesn't personally know the child. That's all. One can THINK that it would only be used to "distance" themselves from the particular child spoken about, but here we have posters who say that isn't the case, and that it is used in many instances that basically proves it isn't necessarily akin to "distancing". Therefore, IMO, the fact that the phrase is and has been used before by others when NOT trying to "distance", makes the fact that Patsy said it completely irrelevant.

Julianne, since I am almost as sure that Patsy did this as I am positive that Jeffrey Macdonald slaughtered his entire family, I am going to say that that phrase is distancing, since I think she killed her.

And the more I think of Ames' observation that Patsy did not get off the couch when Fleet White came running up the stairs shouting "call an ambulance", the more I realize that Patsy knew she was already dead. Nothing I have read has made me believe more than this one observation by the very very good AMES. So glad you are here Ames.

This clinches it for me.

 

[Ames]

<snipped>
And the more I think of Ames' observation that Patsy did not get off the couch when Fleet White came running up the stairs shouting "call an ambulance", the more I realize that Patsy knew she was already dead. Nothing I have read has made me believe more than this one observation by the very very good AMES. So glad you are here Ames.

This clinches it for me.

WOW....:blushing: You make me blush. Thank you! I just found that odd that she just sat there...and had to be PULLED by her friends down the hall, after John yelled "I found her"....and Fleet yelled to "call an ambulance". My butt would have been making a bee line, down that hall...knocking people down, if I had to. I mean, that and the fact that she was found IN the house...and after those statements made by John and Fleet..."I found her"..."call an ambulance"...she still didn't budge. If I had of heard those phrases...AND she was STILL in the house.....I would think that she was INJURED but not dead. So, that's really THREE things all in a course of a few minutes....that point to Patsy knowing "THAT child" was already dead.