GUILTY CA - Aramazd Andressian, 5, South Pasadena, 18 April 2017 #2

[everybodhi]

A woman claimed she saw father and son at Cachuma Lake in Santa Barbara the day before he was reported missing but LE could only confirm the father being there.
I drove through that area recently, it's very rugged mountains, it would be easy to dump a small body off a mountain there to never be found. The canyons are so steep and deep, it would be very hard to search, IMO.
I found the woman to be very convincing in her interview with the media.

“"It was between 11:30 [a.m.] and 2 o’clock [p.m.]” she said, “for sure. I saw the gray BMW, I was by myself.”
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”
She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat."
https://www.google.com/amp/losangeles.cbslocal.com/2017/04/26/missing-boy-aramazd-andressian/amp/

"Los Angeles County investigators believe he drove about 120 miles northwest to Cachuma Lake. Los Angeles County sheriff's Lt. Joe Mendoza says Tuesday that surveillance video showed the father was at the lake, but there was no sign the son was there."
https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxn...e-missing-boy-was-at-california-lake.amp.html

 

[Laocoon]

You are making a very good point. He may have dumped the little boy's body before he got to the lake or soon afterward.

This case is really affecting me. I feel like I want to go and search myself, using drones and satellite images, getting down into these steep canyons.
I spoke to some people in the community (though not a part of it per se, I speak their native language and grew up very familiar with the culture, hence brought it up). People seem to be convinced that the child is alive and doing well, safely tucked away with dad's extended family and friends.
In the meantime, my anxiety is growing exponentially. I feel like the search was incomplete, and I want a re-do. Instead of my usual observer position, I want to become an active participant.

How often does this happen to you? How do you deal with it?

 

[GigTu]

Child killing is incredibly rare in all cultures. But it still happens. This guy lived in Los Angeles most of his life. He was an American and deeply immersed in the LA culture with his BMW and his tech job. I don't know why people keep bringing up Armenian culture. I see it as completely irrelevant.

You see it as irrelevant while others see it as relevant. Which opinion is the correct one?

 

[GigTu]

A woman claimed she saw father and son at Cachuma Lake in Santa Barbara the day before he was reported missing but LE could only confirm the father being there.
I drove through that area recently, it's very rugged mountains, it would be easy to dump a small body off a mountain there to never be found. The canyons are so steep and deep, it would be very hard to search, IMO.
I found the woman to be very convincing in her interview with the media.

“"It was between 11:30 [a.m.] and 2 o’clock [p.m.]” she said, “for sure. I saw the gray BMW, I was by myself.”
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”
She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat."
https://www.google.com/amp/losangeles.cbslocal.com/2017/04/26/missing-boy-aramazd-andressian/amp/

"Los Angeles County investigators believe he drove about 120 miles northwest to Cachuma Lake. Los Angeles County sheriff's Lt. Joe Mendoza says Tuesday that surveillance video showed the father was at the lake, but there was no sign the son was there."
https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxn...e-missing-boy-was-at-california-lake.amp.html

You are making a very good point. He may have dumped the little boy's body before he got to the lake or soon afterward.

This case is really affecting me. I feel like I want to go and search myself, using drones and satellite images, getting down into these steep canyons.
I spoke to some people in the community (though not a part of it per se, I speak their native language and grew up very familiar with the culture, hence brought it up). People seem to be convinced that the child is alive and doing well, safely tucked away with dad's extended family and friends.
In the meantime, my anxiety is growing exponentially. I feel like the search was incomplete, and I want a re-do. Instead of my usual observer position, I want to become an active participant.

How often does this happen to you? How do you deal with it?

Maybe she did see them, and he was crying because he knew he would hand off his son to someone and not see him again. The reason she isn't given credibility is.... why? Because there isn't a second witness? It's pretty closed minded of LE because she could have seen them first, before he went to the store.

 

[everybodhi]

Maybe she did see them, and he was crying because he knew he would hand off his son to someone and not see him again. The reason she isn't given credibility is.... why? Because there isn't a second witness? It's pretty closed minded of LE because she could have seen them first, before he went to the store.

There were are lot of divers in the lake at one point so they must have given her some credibility.

"Aerial video from Sky5 showed a sheriff's helicopter flying above the lake, with divers and at least one boat in the water near*Tequepis Point."
http://ktla.com/2017/04/25/search-f...bara-county-dive-team-k-9s-looking-for-child/

 

[katydid23]

Maybe she did see them, and he was crying because he knew he would hand off his son to someone and not see him again. The reason she isn't given credibility is.... why? Because there isn't a second witness? It's pretty closed minded of LE because she could have seen them first, before he went to the store.

I don't give her much credibility because of her description of what happened and her lack of response.

She said that she saw a crying man, who appeared drunk, who had an unbuckled child in his car, and he was driving erratically across the lawn area of the park.

Did she get help, notify anyone? Call anyone? NO, apparently not. And i find that hard to believe.

 

[GigTu]

I don't give her much credibility because of her description of what happened and her lack of response.

She said that she saw a crying man, who appeared drunk, who had an unbuckled child in his car, and he was driving erratically across the lawn area of the park.

Did she get help, notify anyone? Call anyone? NO, apparently not. And i find that hard to believe.

- Funny how perceptions can be so different.

I see her as a woman able to successfully recall and regurgitate memories with great detail. I imagined her to be quite organized, and in the workplace I think she would be a reliable asset in recalling comments from past meetings, for example.

From her location, and based on her experiences in life, to her he appeared to be crying. Or drunk as an afterthought.

She did not say he was driving erratically. In fact, when I read her accounting, I felt he was probably driving unusually slow, but not paying attention to staying in the boundaries of the road.

Having a kid in the front seat unbuckled isn't really that alarming if they're in a parking lot, or moving slowly between extremely short locations. She said he drove around then back again and over to a trash can.

I imagined she saw a total of 30 seconds at most, yet she could write 1000 words detailing every bit of minutiae. I imagine she also recalled what color they were each wearing for shirts, and possibly even other details of this fashion that she's been asked not to disclose. The fact that she gave such detail after a mere glance makes her credible, imo.

Funny how perceptions can be so different. -

 

[everybodhi]

You are making a very good point. He may have dumped the little boy's body before he got to the lake or soon afterward.

This case is really affecting me. I feel like I want to go and search myself, using drones and satellite images, getting down into these steep canyons.
I spoke to some people in the community (though not a part of it per se, I speak their native language and grew up very familiar with the culture, hence brought it up). People seem to be convinced that the child is alive and doing well, safely tucked away with dad's extended family and friends.
In the meantime, my anxiety is growing exponentially. I feel like the search was incomplete, and I want a re-do. Instead of my usual observer position, I want to become an active participant.

How often does this happen to you? How do you deal with it?

BBM

You make a good point too, I feel more hopeful having read your post.
I pray you are right and someone that loves him took little Aramazd, or Piqui, as his mother affectionately called him, and hid him away and he's safe. Watching her plea for her only child, I cannot believe she has him. The father is not so convincing.
http://abc7.com/news/missing-south-pasadena-boys-mother-to-speak-out-for-first-time/2003944
I think there's a good chance the lake area is where he disappeared, but it's just a guess.
Maybe LE is just waiting and watching until someone messes up so they can find out who has him and go get him.

About the anxiety and feeling of personal connections to people we sleuth, it happens to me sometimes, I have been known to obsess.
Sometimes I have to make myself walk away from it and go back to my life.

 

[katydid23]

- Funny how perceptions can be so different.

I see her as a woman able to successfully recall and regurgitate memories with great detail. I imagined her to be quite organized, and in the workplace I think she would be a reliable asset in recalling comments from past meetings, for example.

From her location, and based on her experiences in life, to her he appeared to be crying. Or drunk as an afterthought.

She did not say he was driving erratically. In fact, when I read her accounting, I felt he was probably driving unusually slow, but not paying attention to staying in the boundaries of the road.

Having a kid in the front seat unbuckled isn't really that alarming if they're in a parking lot, or moving slowly between extremely short locations. She said he drove around then back again and over to a trash can.

I imagined she saw a total of 30 seconds at most, yet she could write 1000 words detailing every bit of minutiae. I imagine she also recalled what color they were each wearing for shirts, and possibly even other details of this fashion that she's been asked not to disclose. The fact that she gave such detail after a mere glance makes her credible, imo.

Funny how perceptions can be so different. -

Here is where she said he was driving erratically:

"She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat.

“When he was driving by,” she said, “he was kind of swerving on the grass. I thought maybe he had a couple of drinks in him.”

She said the man stopped at a trash bin for about a minute before driving off."


So he was swerving as he drove by on the grass? Sounds a bit dangerous.




And then:
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”




The reason it bothers me that she did not report him is that I know that Lake area pretty well. We camped a few times when the kids were young.

If there is a car driving on the grassy area, that is very dangerous. That is where the kids play and run around. It is not a huge campground area.

So if there is a crying, drunk driver with an unbuckled child, swerving on the grassy play area, some one needs to call a ranger.

 

[everybodhi]

We know for sure dad was at Cachuma lake the day before Aramazd Jr was reported missing, that was verified, from surveillance cameras, according to LE.
He had his son at Disneyland the night before until after midnight, seen on surveillance cams.
He must have left his son somewhere that day if he was alone at the lake..

 

[everybodhi]

Here is where she said he was driving erratically:
>snip

“When he was driving by,” she said, “he was kind of swerving on the grass. I thought maybe he had a couple of drinks in him.”

>snip
So he was swerving as he drove by on the grass? Sounds a bit dangerous

I read that as he was *kind of* swerving off the road onto the grass, not driving full on in the grassy area.

 

[Niner]

Interesting theory you both! :thinking:

There can be several reasons as to why he doesn't want to talk about it. Based on my observations, child-killing is extremely rare in Armenian culture. Fathers usually fiercely protect their progeny and, even if they are violent, the violence is often towards females (wives) but rarely towards children, especially sons.
However, males are often involved in cliquey behavior where they have some shady financial relationships with "friends". A scenario of owing money to a "friend" and having your child taken till you pay the debt is entirely possible.
Another thing that is possible: simply taking the child in order to have a leverage against a person.

Based on his less-than-honorable actions after Ara Jr's disappearance (not cooperating with police, making statements via proxy, not participating in the search etc), Ara Sr. is a shady person. So, the child may still be alive but taken by a third party. This is why it is very important to look into dealing of Ara Sr with others...

I absolutely agree. Perhaps he is remaining quiet because whoever took Ara Jr has threatened Sr and may be watching him as well. Still doesn't explain the passing out and gas on the car....unless of course that other party did it to show they mean business.

and :welcome6: Laocoon to WS! :greetings:

I found the woman to be very convincing in her interview with the media.

“"It was between 11:30 [a.m.] and 2 o’clock [p.m.]” she said, “for sure. I saw the gray BMW, I was by myself.”
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”
She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat."

I, too, find her story convincing! Especially the part where she says "The little boy was watching my son play...."

Maybe the surveillance video the LE watched is "after" A Sr. got rid OR hand off his son??? I hate saying the first part....

So nothing really "new" from LE?? Any more searches??

TIA!

 

[GigTu]

Here is where she said he was driving erratically:

"She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat.

“When he was driving by,” she said, “he was kind of swerving on the grass. I thought maybe he had a couple of drinks in him.”

She said the man stopped at a trash bin for about a minute before driving off."


So he was swerving as he drove by on the grass? Sounds a bit dangerous.

And then:
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”

The reason it bothers me that she did not report him is that I know that Lake area pretty well. We camped a few times when the kids were young.

If there is a car driving on the grassy area, that is very dangerous. That is where the kids play and run around. It is not a huge campground area.

So if there is a crying, drunk driver with an unbuckled child, swerving on the grassy play area, some one needs to call a ranger.

Yes, this is true. For some reason I picture it a slow moving vehicle, but even then, if he was even on the edges of the grass - your knowledge of the area makes it sound like she could have done more. Thanks.

 

[everybodhi]

Yes, this is true. For some reason I picture it a slow moving vehicle, but even then, if he was even on the edges of the grass - your knowledge of the area makes it sound like she could have done more. Thanks.

She did seem to genuinely regret not following her instincts after she saw them on the news.

 

[GigTu]

LE will make the determination on whether or not it's credible. I am merely stating my opinion that I still, even after the explanations, I still find her accounting credible.I remember a LOT of detail after glances of things that seem out of the ordinary. All the time. They usually seem odd but insignificant, or at least concerning but not so alarming that I would take action. I'm not so sure if I would have reacted any differently than the woman who says she saw AASr and AAJr. I really don't believe she acted any differently than most people would in that moment. jmo

 

[Laocoon]

Thank you all for the welcomes. I am truly honored!
I promise to try and keep my emotions in check. :tyou:

 

[Alethea]

LE will make the determination on whether or not it's credible. I am merely stating my opinion that I still, even after the explanations, I still find her accounting credible.I remember a LOT of detail after glances of things that seem out of the ordinary. All the time. They usually seem odd but insignificant, or at least concerning but not so alarming that I would take action. I'm not so sure if I would have reacted any differently than the woman who says she saw AASr and AAJr. I really don't believe she acted any differently than most people would in that moment. jmo

Agreed. I think we see a lot of odd things that at the time may stick out to us but aren't really criminal or nefarious at the time we see them so we mind our own business. Looking back once you have more information, you may view it differently (and darker).

 

[Jca2930]

This poor boy it just makes my heart hurt! I really and truly feel the dad holds the answers!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jnblsm]

This poor boy it just makes my heart hurt! I really and truly feel the dad holds the answers!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's a reason, imo, that he hasn't been talking.
Why?!??!

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

Here is where she said he was driving erratically:

"She thought the father appeared to be crying and/or had been drinking. She said the boy was sitting in the front seat.

“When he was driving by,” she said, “he was kind of swerving on the grass. I thought maybe he had a couple of drinks in him.”

She said the man stopped at a trash bin for about a minute before driving off."


So he was swerving as he drove by on the grass? Sounds a bit dangerous.




And then:
“He drove around again, and I made eye contact with him,” she says. “The little boy was watching my son play with his Marvel Avengers toys.”




The reason it bothers me that she did not report him is that I know that Lake area pretty well. We camped a few times when the kids were young.

If there is a car driving on the grassy area, that is very dangerous. That is where the kids play and run around. It is not a huge campground area.

So if there is a crying, drunk driver with an unbuckled child, swerving on the grassy play area, some one needs to call a ranger.

There are dirt trails (roads) all throughout the campsites that are not real defined. It would be easy to drive on the grass areas.
I am local and have been there 100s of times. There are also large trash receptacles all throughout this area. Just my thoughts. The woman seemed credible to me also.