Deaths of Male College Students-General Discussion #1

[eve]

We are all baffled at the response from LE in every case. However, as I pointed out. No evidence means no investigation. Case closed.

They are not going to consider any drowning case related to what the Detectives have lined out on purpose. I think the reason they are closing them so quickly is to play down any connection right from the start. They strongly disagree with the theory presented by these men. I wouldn't be surprised if they were not getting a quick response from the FBI to shut down the cases, too.

SS,

I understand about a lack of evidence - my ex was a prosecutor and he was always a nay-sayer, you know, "can't charge it out without the evidence!" But, but, but, usually a few dedicated cops would get the bug and keep chasing it down! I can't figure out in this case, why so many of the cops seems so stubborn in their positions! Is it because the vics are young men who are partying? Methinks so! Also, the local yocal type cops and campus cops don't want a panic. AND, they have become rabid on the issue of student drinking, absolutely demonizing it in many cases. It's pc to blame everything on drinking/substance abuse. I have personal experience with it as I have mentioned in other threads, with my son (who would fit this profile to a t except he is much taller than most of these vics, I think).

Eve

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Which Josh? Guimond?

was it prescribed?

Joshua Snell, IIRC. I will have to go back and find out for certain.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I think LE is taking the stance because they honestly believe THEY are right on this. It is an EGO thing. Two cops breeze in from NY and they want to shake up the good ole' boy network...and they are not allowing it to happen. That is just my take on it...but it is what I believe I see happening here.

 

[Silver~Bell]

Swim in it? I doubt that has ever been done. It is barely more than a stagnant mud puddle.


For those who think this is some sort of satanist-crap. Get real. This isn't a movie. This was probably done by some copy-cat who decided he/she wanted to cause a disturbance, get attention, create a scene, etc. There are sick people who get off on this type of thing and they don't need to be a satan worshipper nor part of some nation-wide underground organized terrorism unit devoted to killing off innocent college freshmen. Let's be realistic here.

Wow, you sound really sure and really angry. There's lots of weird and terrible things that happen that aren't "realistic" at all and would sound "made up" if you read about them without knowing they really happened. How about a scenario of a big-game hunter in Alaska kidnapping prostitutes and then FLYING them to remote areas, "releasing" them and hunting them down? Really happened. How about the Manson family? Really happened. How about hidden polygamy compounds? Really happening.

I personally doubt the satanic angle but I am open to any theories that are honestly considered and presented. And the idea of underground killing groups is one I consider plausible based on similar fetish groups that proliferate on the internet right this minute.

 

[Cirrus]

SS,

I understand about a lack of evidence - my ex was a prosecutor and he was always a nay-sayer, you know, "can't charge it out without the evidence!" But, but, but, usually a few dedicated cops would get the bug and keep chasing it down! I can't figure out in this case, why so many of the cops seems so stubborn in their positions! Is it because the vics are young men who are partying? Methinks so! Also, the local yocal type cops and campus cops don't want a panic. AND, they have become rabid on the issue of student drinking, absolutely demonizing it in many cases. It's pc to blame everything on drinking/substance abuse. I have personal experience with it as I have mentioned in other threads, with my son (who would fit this profile to a t except he is much taller than most of these vics, I think).

Eve

This is exactly why I think they've ruled out foul play so ludicrously early in the Jacobson case. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it had a lot to do with the fact that the body was found ON CAMPUS. As soon as he was found, I started hearing whispers about the 'smiley face killer' all over the halls - The last thing these people want or need is 6000 college students terrified to leave their dorms. And hey, Alcohol's an easier thing to blame.

 

[SuziQ]

http://capitalnews9.com/content/hea...logist-discusses-szostak-autopsy/Default.aspx

At the above link that SS provided, there is a good interview with Dr Baden regarding Josh's autopsy. He talks about determining cause of death vs manner of death. Cause is for the medical examiner to determine and manner is for LE. Was this the procedure in all the cases? Was there a determination of accident from LE despite what the ME finds? It would be great to get our hands on some of these autopsies.

 

[Randal Graves]

This is exactly why I think they've ruled out foul play so ludicrously early in the Jacobson case. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it had a lot to do with the fact that the body was found ON CAMPUS. As soon as he was found, I started hearing whispers about the 'smiley face killer' all over the halls - The last thing these people want or need is 6000 college students terrified to leave their dorms. And hey, Alcohol's an easier thing to blame.

Yea. If they declared a murder investigation finals would be cancelled and people would generally freak out. Especially considering we've had about 4 burglaries and one armed robbery in the past month. It would be a nightmare. Then again if something else happens they should be sued for gross negligence.

 

[SuziQ]

This is exactly why I think they've ruled out foul play so ludicrously early in the Jacobson case. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it had a lot to do with the fact that the body was found ON CAMPUS. As soon as he was found, I started hearing whispers about the 'smiley face killer' all over the halls - The last thing these people want or need is 6000 college students terrified to leave their dorms. And hey, Alcohol's an easier thing to blame.

Below is an example of College CYA. Did they think they could really get away with this?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3296170


Despite believing that Laura Dickinson had been raped and murdered in her dorm room, administrators at Eastern Michigan University took 10 weeks to tell her parents and university students and staff the truth.

In failing to tell the young woman's family, school safety experts say, the university acted immorally. But in failing to tell Dickinson's fellow students, campus law experts say, the university acted illegally.
On Dec. 16, 2006, the university sent a release out to students and faculty telling them the 22-year-old nutrition major had died but there was "no reason to suspect foul play." (more at link)

 

[Randal Graves]

Below is an example of College CYA. Did they think they could really get away with this?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3296170


Despite believing that Laura Dickinson had been raped and murdered in her dorm room, administrators at Eastern Michigan University took 10 weeks to tell her parents and university students and staff the truth.

In failing to tell the young woman's family, school safety experts say, the university acted immorally. But in failing to tell Dickinson's fellow students, campus law experts say, the university acted illegally.
On Dec. 16, 2006, the university sent a release out to students and faculty telling them the 22-year-old nutrition major had died but there was "no reason to suspect foul play." (more at link)

Yep. Colleges now are highly competitive for-profit businesses. Bad publicity is disasterous, especially for an expensive mediocre school like IC.

 

[cecileew]

http://mnspeak.com/mnspeak/archive/post-5273.cfm

For the record...My brother and I have many friends that are Native American and were always brought up to respect them. Take a visit to my grandparents farm and you will see all the artifacts and how the culture has influenced our lives. His costume a mockery....HARDLY.

Chris was also wearing clog shoes that were still on his feet. How in the world did they stay on? Every go cliff diving up north?? It doesn't work that way. Try wearing shoes with no heels in a pool and kick your legs around, do they stay on?

Chris was not drunk. He had a blood alcohol level of .1 after 4 months of decomposition in which a body is turned into a distillary it's likely he had hardly any alcohol in his system at the time of death (according to Dr. Michael Baden). Chris was kicked out of the bar because a married Minneapolis Police Officer who was working off duty at the bar had interest in his date that was wearing that officers uniform (funny Chris's date never got home that night and was with the officer somewhere). Chris's date worked at the Lone Tree so he wasn't just some kid at some bar he was the date of an employee that worked there.

You are all encouraged to speculate but you don't have the facts if you did you'd be outraged that police departments are overlooking this and our loved ones are being killed. You'd be outraged that someone like Chris was pegged as a case closed with no investigation. You'd be horrified that a police department gave evidence bags to a family before a case was closed. You'd be horrified to see that in that evidence bags was a wad of hair. A wad of hair that was in the palm of Chris's hand when his clenched hand was pried opened. This hair was not tested it was instead given to our family.

One of Chris's murders is in prision reason, well he killed a man using 10 weapons including an electric drill and then set the guy on fire.

This is a most unbelievable story and unfortunately it has become my life. We never asked for this but we did choose to do the right thing to prevent others from falling victim to the same fate.

»» Submitted by Sara at 4:07 PM on April 25


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[SeriouslySearching]

I won't discount any theory at the moment. I have been reading various articles and things which are very disturbing that people actually believe particularly in a setting chosen to expand minds and to influence the charting of lives. Colleges are there to inspire people to act, to create, and to become free thinkers in our society.

Is it out of the realm that some may take it far, far beyond the norm? Of course not. Look at some of the professors who have gone to extremes to point this out with their own views and to encourage their agendas on campuses.

Is it possible someone has latched onto a "religion" (satanic or otherwise) which bucks society and has expanded it to other areas of the country? Look at the FLDS. Look at Al Quaida. Look at Gangs. No one wants to believe it could be a subculture activity...but how else would you explain such a veil of secrecy, loyalty, and perfection?

If these are in fact murders which have been going on for so long undetected...we should broaden our scope. This isn't a madman on a rampage. This isn't Ted Bundy or Gacy. They aren't sloppy and they have calculated it to literally an art form.

 

[Blink34]

http://mnspeak.com/mnspeak/archive/post-5273.cfm

For the record...My brother and I have many friends that are Native American and were always brought up to respect them. Take a visit to my grandparents farm and you will see all the artifacts and how the culture has influenced our lives. His costume a mockery....HARDLY.

Chris was also wearing clog shoes that were still on his feet. How in the world did they stay on? Every go cliff diving up north?? It doesn't work that way. Try wearing shoes with no heels in a pool and kick your legs around, do they stay on?

Chris was not drunk. He had a blood alcohol level of .1 after 4 months of decomposition in which a body is turned into a distillary it's likely he had hardly any alcohol in his system at the time of death (according to Dr. Michael Baden). Chris was kicked out of the bar because a married Minneapolis Police Officer who was working off duty at the bar had interest in his date that was wearing that officers uniform (funny Chris's date never got home that night and was with the officer somewhere). Chris's date worked at the Lone Tree so he wasn't just some kid at some bar he was the date of an employee that worked there.

You are all encouraged to speculate but you don't have the facts if you did you'd be outraged that police departments are overlooking this and our loved ones are being killed. You'd be outraged that someone like Chris was pegged as a case closed with no investigation. You'd be horrified that a police department gave evidence bags to a family before a case was closed. You'd be horrified to see that in that evidence bags was a wad of hair. A wad of hair that was in the palm of Chris's hand when his clenched hand was pried opened. This hair was not tested it was instead given to our family.

One of Chris's murders is in prision reason, well he killed a man using 10 weapons including an electric drill and then set the guy on fire.

This is a most unbelievable story and unfortunately it has become my life. We never asked for this but we did choose to do the right thing to prevent others from falling victim to the same fate.

»» Submitted by Sara at 4:07 PM on April 25


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CEC-
my sincere condolences for your loss. With all due respect, that is exactly why we are here on this thread. I'm sure I can speak with my colleagues here to say that we are spending hours on Chris's case, as well as others and we agree emphatically that he deserves justice. I am hopeful we will be able to get to the bottom of this. God Bless you and your family.

Are you open to any questions we might have to further our evaluation of his case?

 

[Blink34]

Cec-
think I got that wrong, you were posting Sara's response.
Notably, she is referring to Jaramy, and she is right, that murder was horrific.

 

[cecileew]

CEC-
my sincere condolences for your loss. With all due respect, that is exactly why we are here on this thread. I'm sure I can speak with my colleagues here to say that we are spending hours on Chris's case, as well as others and we agree emphatically that he deserves justice. I am hopeful we will be able to get to the bottom of this. God Bless you and your family.

Are you open to any questions we might have to further our evaluation of his case?

Hi Blink,

I am sorry for the misunderstanding. I am not family of Chris. I was researching and stumbled on this. It had info regarding his possible killer so I thought I would post in case there was a link to other killings. Sorry again.

 

[MCDRAW]

I have no doubts about this one anymore. They have to be waiting on an "opportunity" to act. Stalking/hunting is exactly what they have to be doing in order to perfect this.

I agree.

 

[angela]

I have been trying really hard to keep up with all of this but I could have missed something, so if this man has been mentioned, I apologize. I remember hearing about this when it happened and was never comfortable with it. His name is Lon Dowdle. He disappeared across the river from Cincinnati and was found drowned by family members 4 days later. He was past college but it's still creepy.

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2002/04/07/loc_searchers_mystified.html

 

[txsvicki]

I think police and prosecutors are the same everywhere. If they don't think there's any crime at all they practically laugh at and ridicule people who want help and there's many known murderers walking around scott free because some prosecutor doesn't know for sure that they would win the case. They want absolute evidence like a gunshot wound or to find someone bound or something before even considering murder.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Thanks, Angela for the heads up on that one. We should list him anyway because of the circumstances. Brian is older, but they believe they have connected him, too.

 

[SuziQ]

I think police and prosecutors are the same everywhere. If they don't think there's any crime at all they practically laugh at and ridicule people who want help and there's many known murderers walking around scott free because some prosecutor doesn't know for sure that they would win the case. They want absolute evidence like a gunshot wound or to find someone bound or something before even considering murder.

And in Chris Jenkins case they want a picture or video of his murder.

 

[SuziQ]

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/newyork/ny-nysmile0501,0,758981.story

(snip)
The FBI, meanwhile, has spoken with both detectives about their probe and to a tipster upon whom the detectives relied.

"To date, we have not developed any evidence to support links between these tragic deaths or any evidence substantiating the theory that these deaths are the work of a serial killer or killers," the FBI said in a statement about all the deaths. "The vast majority of these instances appear to be alcohol-related drownings." A law enforcement source familiar with the FBI's review of the deaths said the detectives never told FBI agents about the smiley faces. The source also said such graffiti was commonplace during the late 1990s.