Interim discussion regarding questions from the jury and Arias on the stand #79

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Can someone PLEASE verify for me whether the reported smell of smoke in the rental car was on PICKUP or RETURN?

The reason for my question is one that might be from posts a few pages back, but it's something I haven't read...doesn't mean it hasn't been debated to death though.

People have questioned the smell of the gas cans that we know for a FACT she had at least 2 and I think 95% of people believe she had a 3rd.

I am thinking she was covering the gas smell with smell of smoke. Smoke is innocent...at least as far as covering up a murder and would raise no flags, though the rental company might have something to say about it. Recorded smell of gas in the car is a MUCH DIFFERENT STORY when it comes to investigation.

But I have read that the smoke was reported before rental...so that wouldn't fit my theory. It does NOT mean she didn't do the same thing I mentioned, it's just not "proof" of anything.

OK...now back to the page I was reading. LOL!!

Return. The car rental dude testified to it.
 
do we know anything about matt McCarthy? has anyone posted anything about him at all? is he even on the witness list??
 
Can someone PLEASE verify for me whether the reported smell of smoke in the rental car was on PICKUP or RETURN?

The reason for my question is one that might be from posts a few pages back, but it's something I haven't read...doesn't mean it hasn't been debated to death though.

People have questioned the smell of the gas cans that we know for a FACT she had at least 2 and I think 95% of people believe she had a 3rd.

I am thinking she was covering the gas smell with smell of smoke. Smoke is innocent...at least as far as covering up a murder and would raise no flags, though the rental company might have something to say about it. Recorded smell of gas in the car is a MUCH DIFFERENT STORY when it comes to investigation.

But I have read that the smoke was reported before rental...so that wouldn't fit my theory. It does NOT mean she didn't do the same thing I mentioned, it's just not "proof" of anything.

OK...now back to the page I was reading. LOL!!

Was it ever noted what kind of smoke it smelled like? This time I was thinking cigarette, now I'm thinking from a fire she set to burn evidence.
 
(Quoted Tex Mex from previous closed thread)

Tex Mex: "For some reason I think she stashed her weapons under the sink by the shower. She puts them there, then she talks him into the photos. She turns around and grabs the knife. The cabinet door under the sink was open in crime scene photos."

I think that is an interesting theory. We do know that is where the cup came from that was left in the shower after the murder.

I was thinking the same thing - that she had used that piece of duct tape to hide the knife under the sink during one of her "housekeeping" visits.

Many liars have a grain of truth in what they say - I believe that's why she kept insisting that the knife had been in the bathroom. JMHO
 
Originally Posted by nells
Jose Baez discusses the Jodi Arias trial:

http://www.kpho.com/story/21551041/c...R6HKMs.twitter

He is crazy if he thinks that no one told Jodi not to talk to the press. EVERY one knows that whether being told or not. She can not STOP herself from talking.

This is all about Jodi and not anyone not giving her good counsel.

I find the fact that now Jose is being asked whether JA is getting adequate counsel hilarious. As if his opinion is the benchmark. :floorlaugh:

Crawl back into the woodwork JB. Of course she was counselled not to speak to the press. remember your er "difficult" client? You know, the one who also had a lying problem and a listening to her advisers problem.

MOO
Aint nobody got time for all that.
 
I'm just watching the last part of yesterday's testimony so I can see JM in action again. I love it when Nurmi asks her "the ultimate question - why should anyone believe you", and she not only makes that amazing gaff when she says "protecting Travis' ego, er I mean reputation", she babbles off about "if I'm convicted it will be because of my own bad choices". Juan objects and Nurmi throws in the towel at that point. There's just no shutting her up is there? :great:
 
I wanted to jump off Zeno's post, but that thread closed.

I think it is pretty ridiculous that Jodi expects people to believe that she was so concerned about getting stuck in the desert that she needed extra gas.

If she was really concerned about getting stranded she would have 1) made sure her cell was working and 2) not traveled during the wee hours of the morning when it would be more like that any gas stations that do exist may be closed.

I think it was Zeno who said she could have bought a new charger at any major truck stop. The cell phone would probably be the number 1 thing to make sure was in working order, as this could also help her ensure she would not get lost.

You can tell that is just a convenient excuse for how she could supposedly get lost, and not be tracked into AZ.

Also, it strikes me that someone so worried about getting stranded on the road would also not be sleeping in the car on the side of the road for 10 hours.

I really think at this point, the jury is probably going to disregard all her 17 days of testimony.
 
I am sorry did anyone laugh when she said "flammability?" or am I the only one that found that funny? Also "edify" really? who uses these words? LMAO.
 
I understand how the 3rd gas can proves premeditation and is very, very bad for Jodi.

What I do not understand is why she filled 3 gas cans in UTAH, after she had already committed the murder and left Arizona. Was it really just to save a few pennies?! How utterly stupid and self-defeating!

It would support her original 'story' that she took the cans to buy gas in Utah because it was cheaper than in CA.
 
How many find it shocking that Jodi's Defense team, given 3.5 years, had not gotten a copy of her Washington Mutual Credit Card statement. And if they had, they didn't dissect the transactions on the exact days before during and after the Murder? Of all people, they had first dibs to gather this information? I would think Bank records would be the first thing she turned over. IF they knew about 3 gas cans (and they are arguing there are 2, but not anymore, they are caught) IF they knew about 3, they would simply have a story made up about it. They would work with the information and excuse it away. As it stands, this is two or three fold "bad". First she is caught in a blatant Lie. Most serious offense on the stand for a Defendant is getting caught in a lie. This lie her team could have worked with if she just told them everything.

SURPRISE.jpg
 
What a compelling post by Mormon Attorney. Hope no one minds that I've brought it over from the previous thread.

Mormon Attorney: Your sincerity and good heart shine through. A question though: What is the clinical diagnosis of the kids you deal with? PTSD? (Sorry if I missed where you previously explained this.)

For all the kids I work with, there is a high need for control, no empathy, no conscience. It is a sliding scale - some have serious issues, some are more mild. The nonsense lying is constant. It is a sign that they feel the need to control - like their life literally depends on it.

For days, I have seen her have the flat affect and the blank eyes. Sometimes, when she says "I don't remember," I almost see her as dissociating. It is odd. You think about how many times she has said "I don't know" about her own reasons and her own feelings.

Often, with my kids, that is the way it is. They literally cannot connect to their feelings enough to know why they did what they did. So much of it is truly reactive. That does not mean there is not planning. They are highly susceptible to tremendous rage and anger at the feeling of abandonment or loss of control - even perceived abandonment or loss of control.

They have a very fake exterior. I call it the "china doll." It is the smiley, happy, totally in control face you see when she does all the interviews. It is so skilled it is uncanny. It is totally a survival mechanism that they have learned very early on. Out of all kids, these kids are the most socially adept and good at being believed. Even when flat out lying.

But, today has been different. I have to say it has hit me very hard personally. I got into this field because I adopted a child who has had extreme attachment issues. Due to years of helping my child, I have come to see first hand how hard it is to raise a child with these traits of no empathy and no conscience.

Like someone posted the other day, you go round and round with the lies - the endless nonsense lies - even the control on little things like the mayonnaise and mustard. The blank eyes and china doll face. You always hope you can make a difference but daily you face issues like JM has on the stand.

But, then there is a point. If you can hang in there and be lovingly therapeutic and outlast the chaos, there is a point that you can get to with these children that the total look of all their bottled up shame comes up. They let down their guard for a few moments and you can see the darkness, anger, rage, and pain they carry. Almost a look of defeat.

I saw that look in Jodi today and, for me as a mom, it was the weirdest feeling. I honestly felt love. I recognized that look as the point on the children I work with when they give up the baloney and know they cannot continue - that the act and fake stuff isn't working. At that point, I know as a mom I can help.

Of course, in our home and many others, it is little things like mayonnaise or mustard or lying about who hurt the family dog, not murder. But, at the end of the day, all of my families are working to help our kids get conscience and empathy so that things like this don't happen.

With my child, I wait for that look of defeat, of resignation, to know that my child is willing to trust me to help. So many times, I have had to wait patiently, through lots of stuff, to get to that point. But, the moment my child gives up the act, I know I can help. Often, those are some of our most tender moments.

It takes so much for a child who has been significantly hurt (such that he or she forms no attachments) to trust with true emotion. When they will trust you, you have a chance to teach them another way. It is incredibly hard because that has been their sole survival.

Today, when I saw the deflated look, I knew JA knew the jury wasn't buying it. She can tell her way hasn't worked. The shame - not of killing TA - but of how defective and different she is from everyone else has hit her. She knows she is different, fundamentally flawed, but, if she can keep up the act and others will believe the act, she feels on top of the world. When that starts to crack, it is a tremendous fall. For a younger child, it is a point of help. For JA, it is a point of realizing it has not worked.

Sharing alot here. But, I work with families all over the world who have adopted kids with the same issues. I go to court with them to get help. I hold their hands when their child beats them up. I help them deal with the no conscience or empathy. I help protect them when their children physically harm them. I love those families because they do the hardest job in the world. JA has highlighted why we do what we do.

When I saw her deflated look, I knew she knew it was over. Today, instead of dark eyes and the smile, I could see the dark eyes and fallen countenance. I saw the "child" that was stunted many many years ago.

While she tries to come across as intelligent and is very sophisticated at the act, she seems to me to be emotionally stunted at a 12 year old level. Today, in her countenance, I could see "behind the curtain" of the wizard of Oz. The grand act came crashing down.

I am not saying she will not try to regain the image. And, I am definitely not saying she will not lie. She has to lie to feel any control at all. She almost can't help it, even on stupid things.

But, today, I could see and so recognized the look. I have seen it many times before. The moment she realized it was done. That the act hadn't worked and that people could see through the fake exterior. For her, that was crushing.


Please don't bash here. It took a lot to share this. Please know that, if you have read the posts, I am huge on accountability for JA. I feel very strongly that she must be held accountable for what she did. When I describe the love and empathy I felt, it surprised even me. It is not a reflection of what I think needs to happen, but a reflection of all the young children I love that show so many traits of JA - lacking conscience, no empathy, rage, violence, non sense lying, no close attachments.

Daily, I work with families that fight the good fight, with such small progress, never knowing if their patience and therapeutic parenting will make any dent in the symptoms or not. JA represents the worst outcome for us. Each day, we hope that we can help turn that around for the kids we love so much. When you talk about the mom laughing in the court room, I bet I could speak volumes as to what she has lived with. I don't know her and won't speculate, but if she is anything like the parents I work with, her emotions seem odd because parenting JA was nothing like parenting a typical child.

While totally inappropriate in some of her actions, her mother heart forces her to be there until the end, even as her child testifies she is an abuser and they are not close. I bet that mom would have loved the experience of knowing her child really loved her, even once. Just a guess, but sometimes people laugh so they don't cry.

Thanks for letting me share. I hope this is understood the way it was intended. If not, let me clear it up before you jump on me - grin!
 
do we know anything about matt McCarthy? has anyone posted anything about him at all? is he even on the witness list??


JMO.....I think he is going to be the one to ensure she is guilty 'without a doubt.' ....if anyone is on the fence about it.
 
How many find it shocking that Jodi's Defense team, given 3.5 years, had not gotten a copy of her Washington Mutual Credit Card statement. And if they had, they didn't dissect the transactions on the exact days before during and after the Murder? Of all people, they had first dibs to gather this information? I would think Bank records would be the first thing she turned over. IF they knew about 3 gas cans (and they are arguing there are 2, but not anymore, they are caught) IF they knew about 3, they would simply have a story made up about it. They would work with the information and excuse it away. As it stands, this is two or three fold "bad". First she is caught in a blatant Lie. Most serious offense on the stand for a Defendant is getting caught in a lie. This lie her team could have worked with if she just told them everything.

SURPRISE.jpg


:floorlaugh: Farmville
 
UM, This was the least of the stupid things she did. :twocents:

EXACTLY!!!! Compared to calling the cops, allowing herself to be interrogated, making up that ninja story, going on TV, trying to represent herself - the gas can thing is nothing.
 
I am sorry did anyone laugh when she said "flammability?" or am I the only one that found that funny? Also "edify" really? who uses these words? LMAO.

How about 'pejorative' and 'derogative'

And 'attribute' with the emphasis on the wrong syllable.

She speaks in lifetime movie dialog. Or novellas.
 
(Quoted Tex Mex from previous closed thread)

Tex Mex: "For some reason I think she stashed her weapons under the sink by the shower. She puts them there, then she talks him into the photos. She turns around and grabs the knife. The cabinet door under the sink was open in crime scene photos."

I think that is an interesting theory. We do know that is where the cup came from that was left in the shower after the murder.

From the crime scene photos, there were two yellow markers on the linen closet shelf. Maybe she hid the gun there?
 
Was it ever noted what kind of smoke it smelled like? This time I was thinking cigarette, now I'm thinking from a fire she set to burn evidence.

I think many think smoke from fire...but I don't.

Out in the desert...most likely days before she returned the car but even a few hours...I don't think would encapsulate the car so much that it would take over the smell of gas.

Who would be stupid enough to light a fire to burn things so close to the car with gas cans in the trunk? I mean, not saying she didn't but if she did in fact do that she's lucky she didn't explode with the car! LOL!!

So I think, personally, that smoke from fire is not likely. Plus, I am not thinking that a rental car dude is actually "looking for" that type of smell...ya know?

They WOULD care about someone smoking in the car because that's probably against the contract - though that's just my presumption. I know smoke gets into the a/c system and could make renting to the next person especially with the quick turnaround on rental cars difficult.

I just can't explain the lack of smell in the car if gas cans were stored in there like they clearly were...and her getting some cigarettes to cover the smell would again, go to premediation after the fact? LOL!!
 
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