MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #16

[katydid23]

From last thread:
Cool J:
In my opinion an immediate threat to the public would have to mean to someone in the immediate area. Someone who for one reason or another OW had probable reason to believe MB might hurt them. There has to be someone who is actually in danger. It is not an open ended bounty on this fleeing felon in case he MAY hurt somebody somewhere... If so, how long would this last? The rest of the day? Weeks?
Nope, I do not think that is how the law looks at it.=========================================================

There were plenty of people in the immediate area. He could have tried to jack a car, for all OW knew. Or strong armed his way into a strangers apt.

Please remember, OW was blindsided. He did not expect to be attacked when he began to step out of the car. So at that moment, he has to assume that this perp is DESPERATE. or NUTS. You'd have to be to assault a cop and grapple over his weapon. That is a death wish.

And OW has no way to be certain if OW or DJ had any weapons or not. They may have had a knife or DL may have had a gun. How many times do you think that OW searched a young male and found them to be armed? I'd say quite often.

As for the time limit, it is somewhat open ended. If MB had escaped, they would have brought in lots of back up to search for him. He would be a suspect in a robbery and an attack on an officer, perhaps even attempted murder, since they fought over the gun. So there would be no time limit and he would be expected to comply fully and freeze when apprehended, or perhaps be met with lethal force. Even if it was a week later when they found him, he would be considered dangerous.

 

[TheDuchess]

Going back to my earlier post regarding the contrast of the 2 players in our scene, OW and MB. I would love to see a split-screen presentation of the morning of August 9th, 2014. I believe it would go something like this:

8:00 a.m. - OW showers and dresses for work, grabs a quick bit, kisses his girlfriend and possibly his young child goodbye
- MB sleeps
9:00 a.m. - OW is at his morning briefing, having a cup of coffee, getting ready to start his day
- MB wakes up, as a bite, plays some video games
10:00 a.m. - OW is on patrol on a typical Tuesday morning, insuring the neighborhood is safe for its residents
- MB gets high
11:00 a.m. - OW is going about his morning, perhaps responding to calls, perhaps continuing to patrol, etc...
- MB meets up with DJ, talks about bad vibes and a trip to the convenience store for some cigarillos, he has no money on him
11:30 a.m. - OW receives a sick child call and heads to over to respond
- MB walks to the store with DJ, talks incoherently about Jesus, bad vibes, etc...with someone he has never met
11:45 a.m - OW is taking a call with the sick child, perhaps comforting the parent, trying to relax the child, reassuring them that everything will be ok
- MB grabs a $50 box of cigarillos that don't belong to him and when confronted by the store clerk, roughs up the old man and leaves
Noon - OW is driving down the road away from the sick call and toward MB
- MB is walking down the road toward OW with a box of stolen cigarillos in his hands

NOW - they meet - and within the next 2 minutes MB is dead, hailed as a victim, a hero, a symbol of the civil rights movement - his parents will become personal friends of some of the most important leaders in all the world - OW will need to go into hiding, reviled by the entire world for being a racist, bloodthirsty cop looking for a young black man to execute in the middle of the street on a beautiful day

 

[JLSChook]

So he gets away and then it is just open season? He now has a bounty on his head?
That just isn't the way it works.

It is the way it works. (Not how it is worded in your post, however. Lol)

I don't know how many times this has been posted in response to some of your opinions. The law disagrees with what you think or feel.
Tennessee vs. Garner. (again)

and
http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/c500-599/5630000046.htm

 

[Footwarrior]

Who was he a threat to when he was running away?

Wilson must have been justified in shooting Brown. If Brown was a threat, that would justify the shooting. Therefore Brown was a threat even when he was running away.

The logic is backwards, but that type of thinking is all too common.

What is clear is that Brown's alleged crimes are being exaggerated. Shoving the store clerk and stealing cigars is the kind of crime that seldom results in a jail sentence unless the perpetrator has a prior record.

Slugging a police officer is more serious, but even that does not always result in a jail sentence. Neither of these crimes are even close to capital offenses. But you might not know that from reading this thread.

 

[TheDuchess]

IMO, the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior, and MB had already assaulted the store keeper and Officer Wilson, so the next person he came upon could have been in danger too.

BBM/ULBM - I will see your "could" and raise you a "would."

 

[mdana]

Do people realize there is a concurrent Justice Dept. investigation going on and unless you get a showboat like Chris Christie they tend to keep mum until they have all their ducks in order? For all we know they have video, and could be holding onto it to use for obstruction of justice charges down the road. They may be keeping mum, because OW acted appropriately. We just don't know at this time, but everyone seems to have made up their minds on just exactly what happened, when I am sure there are quite a few more interesting tidbits to challenge our perceptions on the incident no matter how one may feel at the moment.

 

[katydid23]

So he gets away and then it is just open season? He now has a bounty on his head?
That just isn't the way it works.

Uh, yes. Pretty much it is the way it works. If you attack an officer, bum rush him, punch him in the face, to the point of fighting over his weapon, then it is taken quite seriously. You DO in effect have a bounty over your head.

Do you know how many officers are shot by random perps, while they are out doing their jobs? Way too many. And if they know that someone has attacked an officer, without warning, and went for his weapon, they are not going to let him walk around free. They are going to go to great lengths to find him and lock him up. If he runs, he may be shot at. It is really his decision at that point, to comply or not.

What if a serial rapist was roaming the neighborhood. And then he 'stopped' raping and ran off. Should the cops put a 'bounty' on his head and try and apprehend him? or should there be a 'time limit'?

 

[TheDuchess]

Uh, yes. Pretty much it is the way it works. If you attack an officer, bum rush him, punch him in the face, to the point of fighting over his weapon, then it is taken quite seriously. You DO in effect have a bounty over your head.

Do you know how many officers are shot by random perps, while they are out doing their jobs? Way too many. And if they know that someone has attacked an officer, without warning, and went for his weapon, they are not going to let him walk around free. They are going to go to great lengths to find him and lock him up. If he runs, he may be shot at. It is really his decision at that point, to comply or not.

What if a serial rapist was roaming the neighborhood. And then he 'stopped' raping and ran off. Should the cops put a 'bounty' on his head and try and apprehend him? or should there be a 'time limit'?

Yes-and don't forget that OW was also dealing with a 2nd person who could have been armed.

 

[PaperDoll]

All the shots were on the front of the diagram. There is no evidence by Ms. Case that proves for certain all the shots, specifically the ones on his hands and arms were delivered while Michael Brown was facing Officer Wilson. There were four shots, most likely taken once MB turned back towards OW. However, 6 shots hit MB and some of those shots most likely were hit when Brown was fleeing.

Why doesn't the diagram show shots from the backside? I'm curious..

 

[katydid23]

Wilson must have been justified in shooting Brown. If Brown was a threat, that would justify the shooting. Therefore Brown was a threat even when he was running away.

The logic is backwards, but that type of thinking is all too common.

What is clear is that Brown's alleged crimes are being exaggerated. Shoving the store clerk and stealing cigars is the kind of crime that seldom results in a jail sentence unless the perpetrator has a prior record.

Slugging a police officer is more serious, but even that does not always result in a jail sentence. Neither of these crimes are even close to capital offenses. But you might not know that from reading this thread.

Let's describe it more accurately than just slugging an officer. Just HYPOTHETICALLY speaking now. Let's say an officer is stepping out of his vehicle to question someone, and that person suddenly, without provocation, rushes him, pushes him back into his car, and begins to punch him in the face. And then they struggle over the weapon and a shot is fired. Do you think that in that hypothetical, the person would not go to jail? You don't see that assault as a serious offense? Because I see it as potentially an 'attempted murder of a police officer' charge. Once you touch their weapon, you are in way over your head.

And you don't have to commit a capital charge to be seen as a dangerous threat to an officers safety during his interaction with you. Once you attack him physically, and fight with him over his weapon, you are seen as a potential killer. Done and Done.

 

[katydid23]

I know of one recent case where one of my friends college kid got really drunk during spring break, and was in a street fight with some other guys. They were in Santa Barbara punching each other wildly for no apparent reason. The cops came to break it up and her son punched a cop in the chaos.

He spent the night in jail, had a pretty big bond to pay. but it all eventually got pled down to drunk and disorderly because HE DID NOT INTEND TO PUNCH THE COP. Even the cop knew that. Oh, and the kid is not a white kid. But it was obviously not a malicious action just a stupid drunken teenaged mistake.

Now if he had walked up to that same cop while he was in his squad car, and purposely punched him and grabbed for his gun, the kid would probably be dead right now. jmo

 

[JudyBolton]

All the shots were on the front of the diagram. There is no evidence by Ms. Case that proves for certain all the shots, specifically the ones on his hands and arms were delivered while Michael Brown was facing Officer Wilson. There were four shots, most likely taken once MB turned back towards OW. However, 6 shots hit MB and some of those shots most likely were hit when Brown was fleeing.

So are you saying that MB is so amazingly *fast* that the bullet left OW's gun while MB was fleeing (facing backward) but BEFORE the bullet(s) reached him - he turned around facing OW? I'm going to consult my physics book.....

 

[sonjay]

What is clear is that Brown's alleged crimes are being exaggerated. Shoving the store clerk and stealing cigars

Well, no, there's no exaggeration needed. Assaulting a cop is a felony. Strong-arm robbery is a felony. (And during the course of the strong-arm robbery he also committed assault against the store clerk.) That's at least two felonies in ten minutes.

Minimizing Brown's alleged crimes by referring to them as "shoving" and "stealing" and "slugging" makes it sound like 10-year-old boys having a scuffle on the playground. This was no playground fight. If OW had allowed MB a second chance at getting his gun, it's exceedingly likely that the recent funeral would have been OW's. IMO.

 

[Apollo]

All the shots were on the front of the diagram. There is no evidence by Ms. Case that proves for certain all the shots, specifically the ones on his hands and arms were delivered while Michael Brown was facing Officer Wilson. There were four shots, most likely taken once MB turned back towards OW. However, 6 shots hit MB and some of those shots most likely were hit when Brown was fleeing.

The results of Dr. Case's autopsy haven't been released so how do you know there is no evidence that not all shots were delivered while MB was facing OW? What suggests any of those shots hit MB when he was fleeing?

 

[Linda7NJ]

Wilson must have been justified in shooting Brown. If Brown was a threat, that would justify the shooting. Therefore Brown was a threat even when he was running away.

The logic is backwards, but that type of thinking is all too common.

What is clear is that Brown's alleged crimes are being exaggerated. Shoving the store clerk and stealing cigars is the kind of crime that seldom results in a jail sentence unless the perpetrator has a prior record.

Slugging a police officer is more serious, but even that does not always result in a jail sentence. Neither of these crimes are even close to capital offenses. But you might not know that from reading this thread.

Would you now kindly provide some links to back up your assertions ....and whoever said anything about capital crimes?

Geeesh shaking my head....


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[katydid23]

Do people realize there is a concurrent Justice Dept. investigation going on and unless you get a showboat like Chris Christie they tend to keep mum until they have all their ducks in order? For all we know they have video, and could be holding onto it to use for obstruction of justice charges down the road. They may be keeping mum, because OW acted appropriately. We just don't know at this time, but everyone seems to have made up their minds on just exactly what happened, when I am sure there are quite a few more interesting tidbits to challenge our perceptions on the incident no matter how one may feel at the moment.

If the DOJ had a video that showed OW doing anything illegal, he would be in :jail: right now. And Holder would be having a press conference.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Do people realize there is a concurrent Justice Dept. investigation going on and unless you get a showboat like Chris Christie they tend to keep mum until they have all their ducks in order? For all we know they have video, and could be holding onto it to use for obstruction of justice charges down the road. They may be keeping mum, because OW acted appropriately. We just don't know at this time, but everyone seems to have made up their minds on just exactly what happened, when I am sure there are quite a few more interesting tidbits to challenge our perceptions on the incident no matter how one may feel at the moment.

Hey hey! Leave Chris Christie outta this...


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[TheDuchess]

http://heroesbehindthebadge.com/PDFs/YOU_ARE_OFFICER_DARREN_WILSON.pdf

https://www.facebook.com/heroesbehi...66756.269650873097849/743156959080569/?type=1

I am not sure if I am posting this correctly, but this was posted by a friend of mine who is a retired LEO. My friend was shot in the line of duty and is permanently disabled as a result and retired from the force.

While the prose is just a bit off (hey, not everyone pays as close attention as us websleuthers to details) but the message is so powerful....and sad...and frustrating....and maddening...but so very true. It goes to the heart of it. Some may take great pride is saying "they are Michael Brown" but I choose to take greater pride in saying "I am Officer Darren Wilson."

 

[Linda7NJ]

So are you saying that MB is so amazingly *fast* that the bullet left OW's gun while MB was fleeing (facing backward) but BEFORE the bullet(s) reached him - he turned around facing OW? I'm going to consult my physics book.....

Boomerang bullets...
(it's all the rage) ...
And so is running away with arms on backwards...
And bringing up the rear...he was running away backwards....

IMO
Lmao


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[katydid23]

It is the way it works. (Not how it is worded in your post, however. Lol)

I don't know how many times this has been posted in response to some of your opinions. The law disagrees with what you think or feel.
Tennessee vs. Garner. (again)

and
http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/c500-599/5630000046.htm

:deadhorse: