musings on Hailey- have any?

[sreshowtime]

oh boy here I go again...yep there is something hinky hinky hinky a bout the disappearance of Miss Hailey Dunn

Could CD have not called...to buy a little more time...for...departures

 

[Tugela]

Don't forget the GM's account of what happened the day HD dissappeared, and the following day. Just some of more than a few red flags IMO.

The apparent non-comittal attitude towards SA when everyone else was pointing fingers at SA.

Then there was the "deer in headlights" thing in the affidavit, all of which attributed back to him. We have never heard DD's version of what happened, the affidavit is silent on what DD told investigators (which IMO clearly indicates that whatever it was was not incriminating). We only have what CD said happened via the affidavits, and what BD said (first version in the affidavit saying what CD told her, and then later in interviews where she related what DD told her - an apparently quite different version).

And at the same time he was on TV (when BD was lamenting her poly results) saying that no one had asked him to take a poly, even though he claimed he wanted to take one. Given all the facts as we know them and the absence of anything else, it seems incredibly bizarre that LE would not have given him one as well.

All that wierdness is what makes me think that when we consider possibilities there is a 50:50 chance that the "event" happened on either side of the road. I think a stranger is unlikely and the answer to what happened to HD can probably be found within a hundred yards of where she lived. There is an outside chance that it was neither side of the road, but perhaps someone else she knew (still in CC though). The possibility that she did do something with friends appears to have been dismissed by LE on the simple say so of those friends (or their parents).

That is not the way to do an investigation.

 

[sreshowtime]

Tugela- my deepest feeling , yes- something within the length of a football field...and there are those that know darn well what happened

yeah that deer in the headlights thing...just weird, and too, that DD has never publicly spoken about any of this...

I keep thinking if I were CD , I would have strangled SA with my bare hands, if I thouhgt he was responsible kwim

 

[sreshowtime]

Does anyone know if was it ever mentioned if Hailey ( or Billie rather) had a social security card and a certified birth certificate , and if so, were they still in the house after Hailey disappeared?

 

[StrayKat]

I heard... "deer in the headlights" did not come fron DD. Just what I heard. I am sure they both had a ss card, as well as, a birth certificate. Aren't those required nowadays... unless you are an illegal, with an ITIN or two.

 

[sreshowtime]

yeah I read that too SK, about 'deer in headlights' not being a direct quote..
I was just wondering if her BC and SS were missing...of course it isn't THAT hard to get fake ones..or fake 'real' ones( at least it used to be easy- find a deceased person the age you need, do the family research, etc...)

hmm...wonder if certain person(s) could get their hands on a BC for a girl around Hailey's age...I mean it's not like it is a photo ID

Can you tell I really wish Hailey were alive some where...

 

[ljczec]

This is a musing I have had on Hailey for several months now. I REALLY do not want to be disrespectful in any way to Hailey. I have followed this case from Day 1 and it has struck a chord with me more than any case before. I read these forums every day, I have a google alert set up in Hailey's name in case anything new comes out. I really feel for this girl and her family who loved her. I have been a critic of BJD and SA for a while, but there is a part of me that wonders.....

<modsnip>

<modsnip>

Maybe I am just hopeful that Hailey is still alive somewhere. <modsnip>

This is all JMO. Please do not take this the wrong way, I have no solid evidence, just a suspicion and hope.

<modsnip>

 

[sreshowtime]

ljc- well said IMHO- thank you for taking time to give your thoughts....trust me that avenue of thought has been considered..at least by me...and others. And if that were the case, it really would not surprise me. Any thing is possible in my mind. <modsnip>,
I kept hoping she would reappear by late summer, if that were the case, but alas she is still gone.Thanks for the links, I will look at them.
I wanted to ad that if she were in a place like that, I really don't know how she could fly under the radar so to speak...it would take quite some doing to keep her anonymous maybe.

 

[BritsKate]

SA calling Hailey promiscuous is one of my biggest and brightest red flags. Too often we witness perpetrators demeaning and denigrating their victims.

Unfortunately I still believe what I have since shortly after Hailey went missing. I believe SA murdered her and BJD is complicit in the cover up. I wish I could believe in another outcome. I still pray she will be found.

 

[cluciano63]

Poor, poor Hailey. I am not very religious these days, but Hailey is one person I cannot stop thinking of and even praying for, in my way. Something about her just seemed special...maybe the way she welcomed her new baby sister, or the photos we've seen of her with her teacher, etc...she just really stays with me.

 

[ThoughtFox]

I posted some articles on the SAR thread for Hailey. They've arrested a guy named Guthrie who was heavily involved in the searches, and even worked for the local radio station. He's the one who made the video about Hailey's angels.

He was arrested for solicitation with a teenage girl, and they seized all his electronics. LE says there are probably more victims.

http://www.cbs7kosa.com/news/details.asp?ID=32373

 

[Tugela]

It doesnt say there probably are, it say there possibly are. It isn't clear exactly what he is supposed to have done either, or if it is just an allegation. The girl is less than a year from majority btw.

Seems wierd that the department of homeland security would get involved in something relatively minor like that though.

 

[sreshowtime]

just wanted to pop in and say, Hailey- you aren't forgotten- throwing stuff at walls and hoping something will stick, you ARE being looked for lil lady.

 

[ozazure]

Hailey sticks with me as well.

A lot of scrutiny is given to Shawn's whereabouts on the 27th. However, from what I understand at this stage, when Billie and Shawn wake up on the 28th, Billie is meant to assume her daughter is at MB's and Shawn has a job. In her timeline, it states they leave the house the next morning at 630am.

Where is Shawn on the 28th? Somewhere as vague and non-compelling as where he was meant to be the day before?

Not only is there the odd circumstance of his job - reportedly failing to tell Billie he quit, then lying about being fired and a fight, then the supervisor reporting his odd behaviour. IMO Billie downplays the job issue but she knows it looks bad, but it also works in their favour as we forget that the next day, between 630am and the call to David around noon, Shawn has lots of time up his sleeve. Where is he this day? Back at moms or grandmas, is my brief recollection but is there an alibi, cell phone pings or computer records? Shawn didn't need much time on the 27th to deal with any covering up, he had many hours the next day.

I don't have time to go back and research now - but I recall a report that Shawn told someone (grandmother?) Hailey was missing before he supposedly had contact with Billie. Billie comes from her job after speaking with David and Clint, to CCity with her SIL, visiting homes and then going to the police - with or without a cellphone? Is the home cellphone the only cellphone Billie has?

The cellphone records of the phones involved tell a lot I imagine.

I hate a theory where the job confusion is because Billie and Shawn stumble over this element of their story, forgetting if they were going with quit or fired, where Billie rings her son knowing full well he is going to hear the news from MB that Hailey is not there. Where Shawn forgets that he shouldn't yet know Hailey is missing yet and says something.

But then I am also not that fond of the theory whereby a mother is indifferent to where her daughter is, willing to overlook and downplays Shawn's odd behaviour and lies and continues her relationship with him, assisting in his defence. I rarely heard her speak with emotion until the time of BTHN when she fired up over Shawn's infidelity. The difference was stark in my eyes. And when she does summons up emotion for Hailey she sounds angry and speaks with possessiveness. That is one aspect of motherhood, but it's all I hear from Billie with emotion and I fear it's all she feels.

 

[sreshowtime]

ozazure- thanks for that- hmm yeah , the 28th needs revisited...you brought up some interesting thoughts

 

[For The Kids]

If SA told BD that first evening that Hailey was staying with a friend, I am guessing she was not upset, as she later said, but happy to have a night alone with SA, and figured she would deal with Hailey the next day (this is assuming BD did not know anything about H being missing.) The bit about Hailey not being allowed to go without calling, etc...I believe was all part of her showing what a "good" mother she was.

I honestly don't know what to believe about SA. He seems the obvious suspect, but it is possible, at least, that Hailey went out and was abducted by a stranger, or got into the wrong car. I can't completely rule out the alleged sightings by neighbors, although we all know how wrong these can be. And my confidence in this LE is pretty close to zero.

But I can't understand BD's attitude toward her daughter vanishing; she seems very casual about it all and seems as though she has just gone on with her life.

We now know that allegedly DD went to Billie that night and told her that he didnt like Hailey being there due to MBG boyfriend being there so maybe from that..bearing in mind she had never stayed there before..would have been a reason to call Hailey.

 

[For The Kids]

JMO and MHO at that. BD did not know who MGB's mother was... or she would not have let her stay the night there. I think it was explained that she worked 12 hour shifts at the hospital and pretty much relied on the father to share in the parenting. Since she was gone at least 13 hours a day and he did not work. He also had mentioned that she did go to his home everyday.

Local LE from the beginning said evidence pointed to runaway. I think they know what they are talking about although others have been able to influence my way of thinking at times.

Billie said on NancyG, "she is ours... not yours" ???
Who else would have thought she is theirs?

Umm..it was a small town..considering the girls were friends..i think its logical that Billie would know who MB mother was.

Regarding the comment on NG..i assume she meant that Hailey was theres as in hers and Clints..and not the kidnappers. As for her being classed a runaway isnt she classed as kidnapped? or was at one point anyhow? as for local LE..im not sure they even remotely know what there talking about in this case

 

[For The Kids]

Don't forget the GM's account of what happened the day HD dissappeared, and the following day. Just some of more than a few red flags IMO.

The apparent non-comittal attitude towards SA when everyone else was pointing fingers at SA.

Then there was the "deer in headlights" thing in the affidavit, all of which attributed back to him. We have never heard DD's version of what happened, the affidavit is silent on what DD told investigators (which IMO clearly indicates that whatever it was was not incriminating). We only have what CD said happened via the affidavits, and what BD said (first version in the affidavit saying what CD told her, and then later in interviews where she related what DD told her - an apparently quite different version).

And at the same time he was on TV (when BD was lamenting her poly results) saying that no one had asked him to take a poly, even though he claimed he wanted to take one. Given all the facts as we know them and the absence of anything else, it seems incredibly bizarre that LE would not have given him one as well.

All that wierdness is what makes me think that when we consider possibilities there is a 50:50 chance that the "event" happened on either side of the road. I think a stranger is unlikely and the answer to what happened to HD can probably be found within a hundred yards of where she lived. There is an outside chance that it was neither side of the road, but perhaps someone else she knew (still in CC though). The possibility that she did do something with friends appears to have been dismissed by LE on the simple say so of those friends (or their parents).

That is not the way to do an investigation.

The only thing is...Clint and Naomi have been cleared by LE of knowing anything of what happened to Hailey. I THINK they did have polygraphs..or according to Naomis grandmother at least. Im not discounting the fact someone CLOSE to Clint could be involved..i just dont think he was and for sure i dont think his mother is involved

 

[ozazure]

Her working those long days (12 hr shift- 20 miles away)... daddy across the street. He may have, more than likely, parented more in a physical/social/emotional type dynamic. And mom probably parented more in a financial/enforcer type. It has been mentioned her being a daddys's girl and that she wanted to go live with him. Billie probably did get comfortable with him being a dad... "going to dads then to MB's to stay the night". When she found out, she told him to call the police.

HE DIDN'T CALL! Remember daddies girl!
Earring?

If my memory serves me right, according to Billie's latest statement on webslueths radio, Clint did not have a phone. After David told Billie she was not at MB's, he was sent to Clints to ask after her, then back again with the phone for Billie to talk to him. This sequence of events has been reported differently. In the first Nancy Grace she just said she called him, in the next show Clint says he found out Hailey was missing from David.

All this back and forth, added and dropped details, are very confusing.

 

[katydid23]

The only thing is...Clint and Naomi have been cleared by LE of knowing anything of what happened to Hailey. I THINK they did have polygraphs..or according to Naomis grandmother at least. Im not discounting the fact someone CLOSE to Clint could be involved..i just dont think he was and for sure i dont think his mother is involved

If I compare the two POI's, Clint and Shawn, I see some big differences.

Clint was home with his infant and his 5 yr old stepson and his girlfriend. He also had a very bad back and could barely walk. He was a very loving father who Hailey ADORED.

Shawn was home alone with Hailey, after a shady morning of clandestine activities, and unexplained behavior. [ Like quitting a much needed job for no apparent reason and lying about it.]

Shawn had leather serial killer masks designed to fit his own face so he could pretend to be a sexual sadist. He spent a lot of time online discussing this kind of sick hobby, even to the point of 'fantasizing' about snapping and killing someone.

Hailey had even told her grandmother that she was afraid of Shawn. And we have the 911 calls where Billie admits that Shawn threatened violence against them.

So if I have to compare the two POI's, it is not even close, imo. Shawn has the past behavior indicators, the perfect opportunity, and the strange circumstantial evidence, that makes him seem highly suspicious. He admits being the last one to see her, and they were alone at the time.

Clint was with an entire family and had no motive and no past behavior that indicates he might harm his daughter. Sure, he smoked his weed. But Shawn was using harder drugs than that, IIRC.

It is possible that someone else nabbed her on the way to her dad's, but it seems pretty unlikely, statistically. Besides, I have a hard time believing that she was going to a sleepover and did not take anything with her that would indicate so. She would have taken some of her $ and her hoodie and her i-pod, imo, if she was walking to her friends for a sleepover.

And, imo, she would never have walked over to MB's if she had not received a reply to her text. I know 13 yr old girls. They would keep texting or calling or would call another friend and double check. It is very 'uncool' to text a friend, get no reply,and then go on over to their house. I don't think she would have done that. And another HUGE red flag is the lack of cell usage that afternoon. Has anyone ever known a 13 yr old on school vacation that could make ONE TEXT and that is it, for the entire afternoon? I don't believe it. If she was making her plans for the sleepover she would have done more than one measly text, imo.