NJ - Erik Sturgis, 5, home alone, dies in fire, Sayreville, 4 March 2006

[Mellen]

The guy wasn't even working his own shift. He was FILLING in for a friend. I think any mitigating circumstances that he might have tried using are erased by that fact. He didn't even have to be at work during those hours. If you don't have a babysitter, you tell your friend NO.

Yes, this is what bothered me the most. It wasn't even his own shift. He definitely should have told the friend no. I can't see any way to simply exonerate this man.

Where I can sympathize is with the horrendous difficulties with finding and affording daycare. I'm in a two-income family, and we still couldn't afford to put our daughter in regular daycare. Luckily, we have a family friend that only charges $5 an hour, and even so, I am lucky enough to be able to work from home 2 days a week or it would still probably be too much. I agree that this man should put his son over his job, but I also think it is insane that people are saying that it would be in the better interest of the child for him to be on welfare and staying home rather than working. It seems to me that there is something really out of whack in our society if parents are better off living off of the tax dollars of others than trying to pull their own weight through working simply because child care is so insanely expensive and hard to find.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Yes, this is what bothered me the most. It wasn't even his own shift. He definitely should have told the friend no. I can't see any way to simply exonerate this man.

Where I can sympathize is with the horrendous difficulties with finding and affording daycare. I'm in a two-income family, and we still couldn't afford to put our daughter in regular daycare. Luckily, we have a family friend that only charges $5 an hour, and even so, I am lucky enough to be able to work from home 2 days a week or it would still probably be too much. I agree that this man should put his son over his job, but I also think it is insane that people are saying that it would be in the better interest of the child for him to be on welfare and staying home rather than working. It seems to me that there is something really out of whack in our society if parents are better off living off of the tax dollars of others than trying to pull their own weight through working simply because child care is so insanely expensive and hard to find.

I agree with your post. I was a single parent, trying to go to school, working, etc., and its very difficult. I can't make the leap between this guy being on welfare and turning down a friend's shift though. I understand the father had been struggling for years trying to do what he thought was right for his boy and it makes me very sad to come to the realization that this little boy probably was alone more than we want to believe. There's no way this was the first time. Dad won't have to worry about this now, though, right? Maybe instead of prison time, he can do some sort of community service and BABYSITTING for other dads??? (kidding. I wouldn't trust him with my dog).

 

[michelle]

My heart just breaks for this little guy. My son will be 5 in may and I cant imagine the horror this little one suffered.

 

[MistyM]

Everyone is talking about childcare. I live in Canada, Saskatchewan to be exact, and they have a thing called a 'daycare subsidy' that pays a large portion of your childcare costs. For instance, my daycare charges 350.00 a month for a school age child and I could get subsidized and pay only 120.00 as my portion. Don't they have that in the USA? I believe you could make up to 2500.00 a month and still be subsidized here. It makes it much easier to work and not just stay home on government assistance.

I feel so bad that poor boy died. The father must feel horrible, but he must be punished somehow. I hope when all is said and done, perhaps he could become an advocate for proper childcare and use his experience to help others to learn from his lessons. I'm sure he isn't the only person who has done this. I think people need help and he could really help to change things.

 

[j2mirish]

He made a fatal judgement call. Nobody is perfect, I may turn my head and my son may fall and bust his head, thats an accident. This father made a stupid choice, and I think he should suffer the consequences for it. JMO

at least if you turn your head, and he falls- you can call 911 or put a rag to his bleeding head- your are right about the difference between and accident and....i'm not even sure what to call this-- poor judgement?? come on-- the little guy was 5 years old----------------------I dont profess to be the award winning parent, and I have a few things I would be embarressed to tell- but they were things that happened while i was present..........I am trying very hard to give from my heart and give him some type of break... but damn...he left him for what would be 8 hours!! its not like there was a 8 year old there, to help, if that makes any sense..
I better stay off this thread-- I do feel sorry for the guy-- but the little boy was 5 years old--- think about your own children at 5.......can you imagine?

 

[j2mirish]

At the time of his "fatal judgement call" he never in a million years thought this would happen. Obviously if he did he never would have done it. At times we do things out of despiration or by doing what we think is the right thing at the time never knowing the outcome. Think of parents that allow their kids to spend the night away at friends and something happens that results in death (whatever that my be) was that a fatal judgement call to allow that child to be away at the friends house. This dad will kick himself forever, yet as I have stated before, something will have to be done or HORRIBLE parents will use this to their benefit.

I strongly disagree about you saying letting child stay at a friends, and comparing it to leaving a 5 year old, home alone.
those are apples and oranges in my opinion. I dont disagree this man will have to live with this forever.....but damn..........

should have read ahead- michelle........:blowkiss:

 

[j2mirish]

Let's think about five year olds. They LOVE being the center of attention. They don't like being alone. Can we try and not only imagine how lonely and scared he might have been just being by himself, but can you try and imagine the SHEER TERROR he must have experienced when the house caught on fire??? Anyone ever been in a house that's on fire? His final minutes must have been a nightmare. I frankly don't care what the father's motives were. I also frankly don't care what he's going to put himself through for the rest of his life mentally. It can't compare with what that poor little baby must have been going through on the day that "dad" decided to do his friend a favor and leave the little guy alone.

I'm right there with ya Jeanna-
thanks for making me not feel so bad about the anger I have for the guy-

 

[j2mirish]

Michelle, you make excellent points. Common sense didn't play a part in this or did it. I am sure the father knew this wasn't the best he could do but at times when we are desparate we do stupid things without thinking it through. I don't let my kids go somewhere I feel uncomfortable with either. However, I can't be naive as a parent and pretend they are not going to try things - even with an adult present somewhere in the house.

This five year didn't deserve to die, however, jail for the Dad isn't what I feel needs to happen here.

what do you think would be appropriate?

 

[Mellen]

Everyone is talking about childcare. I live in Canada, Saskatchewan to be exact, and they have a thing called a 'daycare subsidy' that pays a large portion of your childcare costs. For instance, my daycare charges 350.00 a month for a school age child and I could get subsidized and pay only 120.00 as my portion. Don't they have that in the USA? I believe you could make up to 2500.00 a month and still be subsidized here. It makes it much easier to work and not just stay home on government assistance.

I feel so bad that poor boy died. The father must feel horrible, but he must be punished somehow. I hope when all is said and done, perhaps he could become an advocate for proper childcare and use his experience to help others to learn from his lessons. I'm sure he isn't the only person who has done this. I think people need help and he could really help to change things.

No, we really don't have a program like that in the U.S. There are subsidy programs, but it is difficult to qualify, and their funding generally can't even come close to solving the problem. Basically, the only way to be guaranteed a subsidy is to be on welfare. Some states do better than others, but this is a big problem. Here's a quote from an article on the subject written by researchers at Rutgers University in NJ:

"Without a subsidy, the cost of preschool care is prohibitive to many low- and moderate-income families. The public subsidies available through Work First New Jersey (the state’s welfare
program) and New Jersey Cares for Kids (a program for low-income workers) help some families afford childcare, but the available funding is too scarce to subsidize all eligible families. The welfare-based subsidy is guaranteed, but the working poor subsidy maintains a waiting list currently between 400 and 500 families, and the actual gap is
probably much larger."
http://www.heldrich.rutgers.edu/Resources/Publication/164/Middlesex%20Childcare.pdf#search='childcare%20subsidy'

Without a doubt, the father in this case must be punished. The choices he made are not acceptable. But I do agree with you that it would be nice to see him become a spokesperson for this issue. It would be nice to see some good come out of this tragedy.

 

[bugs]

I strongly disagree about you saying letting child stay at a friends, and comparing it to leaving a 5 year old, home alone.
those are apples and oranges in my opinion. I dont disagree this man will have to live with this forever.....but damn..........

should have read ahead- michelle........:blowkiss:

Where is the difference. At the age of 5 most kids are in school. A judgement call is a judgement call at any age.

 

[bugs]

what do you think would be appropriate?

Absolutely there should be some sort of punishement. I don't feel though that this Dad intentionally did this. It was a bad call on his part, yes. I feel appropriate punishment should be probation, community service, etc. Jail time no.

Look at Elizabeth Smart, did her parents make an "almost fatal judgement" by helping folks out and bringing them in to their home to work. Elizabeth was kidnapped right up under her parents noses and did we ever judge them? No we felt sorry for them. We felt they were doing the right thing by helping out the needy only to have their child sacrifice their decision. I know I may be stretching here, but there are so many worse people in this world that needs harsher punishment.

 

[j2mirish]

Where is the difference. At the age of 5 most kids are in school. A judgement call is a judgement call at any age.

again- leaving a child home at 5 years old by themselves to go to work is no where close to your comparison of sending a child to a friends to stay all night, and there is a tradgic ending, I am not sure what you mean about kids at 5 being in school

 

[j2mirish]

Absolutely there should be some sort of punishement. I don't feel though that this Dad intentionally did this. It was a bad call on his part, yes. I feel appropriate punishment should be probation, community service, etc. Jail time no.

Look at Elizabeth Smart, did her parents make an "almost fatal judgement" by helping folks out and bringing them in to their home to work. Elizabeth was kidnapped right up under her parents noses and did we ever judge them? No we felt sorry for them. We felt they were doing the right thing by helping out the needy only to have their child sacrifice their decision. I know I may be stretching here, but there are so many worse people in this world that needs harsher punishment.

at least she was under there noses....................this guy was at work- 5 year old.....home alone

 

[michelle]

Absolutely there should be some sort of punishement. I don't feel though that this Dad intentionally did this. It was a bad call on his part, yes. I feel appropriate punishment should be probation, community service, etc. Jail time no.

Look at Elizabeth Smart, did her parents make an "almost fatal judgement" by helping folks out and bringing them in to their home to work. Elizabeth was kidnapped right up under her parents noses and did we ever judge them? No we felt sorry for them. We felt they were doing the right thing by helping out the needy only to have their child sacrifice their decision. I know I may be stretching here, but there are so many worse people in this world that needs harsher punishment.

Bugs, I mean no disrespect, but i have to disagree. I mean come on, elizabeth smarts parents didnt leave her locked in a room with a known offender. They let somebody come help out to pay them and be kind. Its totally different then leaving her alone with that creep.With this little boy, you dont leave a 5 year old for 8 hours or any amount of hours by themselves they cannot help themselves. Its awful sad what happened but this in unacceptable and its no comparisant to the smarts and their situation. Would it be Ok if tomorrow my work needed me and I left my son home and God Forbid he hurt himself in a bad way, but would that just be a bad judgement call?

 

[Opie]

Somewhere earlier someone mentioned kids at 5 being in school. That is the age for kindergarten, which is all day in some places, half-days in other places. That said, it is a whole different situation from being alone at age 5. This case is really sad.

 

[j2mirish]

Bugs- I have to tell you also- I mean no offense towards you and your thoughts- I just dont agree with perhaps how your heart is trying to make it ok for the dad- and I dont mean that the way it sounds- I know you feel he needs punishment, but you sound like you feel he was doing his best, and in my mind, that is just not acceptable- :blowkiss:

 

[michelle]

Bugs- I have to tell you also- I mean no offense towards you and your thoughts- I just dont agree with perhaps how your heart is trying to make it ok for the dad- and I dont mean that the way it sounds- I know you feel he needs punishment, but you sound like you feel he was doing his best, and in my mind, that is just not acceptable- :blowkiss:

I agree with you as well j2mirish. And Bugs Even though this father will suffer, I cant help but think of how that little one must have suffered.

 

[bugs]

j2mirish and michelle, Like I have said before ya'll make excellent points. That is why I love it here so much, we can agree, disagree and keep the respect. I feel this Dad may get worse puishment than any intentional child abuser, molester, murderer and so on. He, I think, was trying to do the right thing and raise his son. His judgement he made that day was off and he got caught. Just think of the millions out there in the same situation.

Okay, you know how some of us feel we always know what our kids are doing in our care - well my 13 year old son just unplugged my computer and this is the third, yes, third time I have tried to post this reply. :blushing:

Love you all.

 

[michelle]

j2mirish and michelle, Like I have said before ya'll make excellent points. That is why I love it here so much, we can agree, disagree and keep the respect. I feel this Dad may get worse puishment than any intentional child abuser, molester, murderer and so on. He, I think, was trying to do the right thing and raise his son. His judgement he made that day was off and he got caught. Just think of the millions out there in the same situation.

Okay, you know how some of us feel we always know what our kids are doing in our care - well my 13 year old son just unplugged my computer and this is the third, yes, third time I have tried to post this reply. :blushing:

Love you all.

It is nice to agree to disagree. I love it here too....I respect your opinions.....:blowkiss:

 

[j2mirish]

j2mirish and michelle, Like I have said before ya'll make excellent points. That is why I love it here so much, we can agree, disagree and keep the respect. I feel this Dad may get worse puishment than any intentional child abuser, molester, murderer and so on. He, I think, was trying to do the right thing and raise his son. His judgement he made that day was off and he got caught. Just think of the millions out there in the same situation.

Okay, you know how some of us feel we always know what our kids are doing in our care - well my 13 year old son just unplugged my computer and this is the third, yes, third time I have tried to post this reply. :blushing:

Love you all.

agrree to disagree :blowkiss: about dads judgement- and yes- i do agree he doesnt belong in your group above.....but ( for the last time from me...the little guys was only 5 )