Old Dog kicked out of Condo by HOA!

[waltzingmatilda]

"Apparently, HOA's are not required to cough up a copy of amended covenants to agents or potential homebuyers. It sounds like the agents receive the original covenants that were written by the bank and the developer. If later changed, the HOA is not held accountable to provide the amended copies to their new neighbors."

(Note-- had to cut and paste above quote by myself-- quote feature not working!"

The fact that the HOAs are not required to gived out amended covenents to agents and potential homebuyers is OUTRAGEOUS! Sounds like FRAUD to me. The terms of sale are not being specified in a truthful manner -- very deceptive. I believe if this went in front of a judge, he would say that the woman was sold the property under false pretenses. I hope she gets a lawyer and goes after the HOA!

Penelope, Thanks for your input and expertise on the subject. My above quote is based on personal experience from when I bought a house in '96. I received the covenants at signing only to learn after moving in that those covenants had been amended. Fortunately, I had no issues with the new amendments.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I am not penelope but I can explain why it happens where I live. I looked at over 200 apartments (mat with slumlords) before I found one that would let me keep my mut, who is just over 50 lbs. Mostly, it is because of the more aggressive varieties, if you ever notice pit bulls are a no way jose everywhere! Landlords don't want to deal with dog fights, dog fighting owners, or anyone being bit by a large dog. Most people are intimidated by them. Some landlords are afraid of more damages being done to their properties. Fleas, dogs chewing baseboards, or even those that do not take the dog outside to relieve itself and allow them to do so inside (horrible but it happens) as examples. Then there is the issue of repairmen, mailmen, delivery, knocking neighbors, etc...

merc, There is also the matter of insurance. There are certain breeds that are termed 'dangerous' in NC, Rottweilers, Chows, Pit Bulls, and Homeowners Insurance companies will deny coverage if these breeds live on the premises. When my son was in college, my landlord nixed me keeping his lab/chow mix for this reason. Poor boy had to go live in the country with grandma and grandpa for a couple years and chase cows. He is now back safe and sound and happy with his 'daddy'.

If nothing else, maybe this thread will bring awareness to this issue and the rights of residents against the almighty HOA's!:clap:

 

[21merc7]

Oh thanks waltzingmatilda! I did not think of that. The above reasons were all reasons I and a few others have been told in our area. Insurance would be another.

 

[SuziQ]

-------------
I have two boxers who are my family. One of the boxers, Oscar was my husband's help dog and companion until my husband died. The other boxer is Maggie, I got her two weeks after my husband died to help us through our grief. Oscar is nine years old now and Maggie is four. Due to a disability and losing my job of 21 years I may end up losing my house. I have decided that before I give up my dogs for a place to live, we will live in an old motor home I bought just prior to my disability. Although some campgrounds and RV resorts now have restrictions on dog size usually not over 20 lbs. Ridiculous. Does anyone know why there is discrimination on larger dogs. Many times the larger dogs are much quieter and gentler than the smaller dogs. If you clean up after your pet when you walk them it should not matter the size of the waste?????????

So many people are finding themselves in your shoes. Who knows, in a few years it might be me. We never know what life will throw at us. More than ever I think of the old saying "Home is where the heart is". I wish you and your four legged kids all the best. :blowkiss:

ETA: because of all my critters, I would make the same decision you have.

 

[panthera]

From my experience as President of a Co-op Corporation, I would think that if the woman purchased the property on the basis of the HOA agreement that she was given as part of the purchase, and that agreement was not the updated one, then she would only have to abide by the agreement she was supplied at purchase. Whoever gave her the wrong information is at fault. I don't believe the HOA has a leg to stand on. The next time, they have to make sure that the proper covenants are supplied to potential purchasers.

I completely agree with you. It is not the fault of the buyer that she was supplied with the wrong, outdated information. I sincerely hope she seeks legal advice and files suit. A dog is more than a "pet" ~ especially one that she has become attached to over 13 yrs. Also at this age, I highly doubt the dog is viciously attacking people or destroying the outside of her condo. MOO

 

[panthera]

I am not penelope but I can explain why it happens where I live. I looked at over 200 apartments (even with slumlords) before I found one that would let me keep my mut, who is just over 50 lbs. Mostly, it is because of the more aggressive varieties, if you ever notice pit bulls are a no way jose everywhere! Landlords don't want to deal with dog fights, dog fighting owners, or anyone being bit by a large dog. Most people are intimidated by them. Some landlords are afraid of more damages being done to their properties. Fleas, dogs chewing baseboards, loud barking, or even those that do not take the dog outside to relieve itself and allow them to do so inside (horrible but it happens) as examples. Then there is the issue of repairmen, mailmen, delivery, knocking neighbors, etc... Anyway, that is what happens where I live. I think it is sad. However, I am talking about apartments, not condos, but I would think the reasons would be about the same.

I believe you're correct as to why the size of the dog is limited, especially in apartments where a lot of damage can be done to the interior of the unit. Rather than be discriminatory against certain breeds, the size (pounds) are limited so to exclude the dogs that have a tendency to fight or bite. In this case, with it being a condo that the tenant owns, the interior damage would be irrelevant so it would seem to go more to the common areas of the complex, and the possibility that other tenants could be bitten. Sad, but somewhat necessary I guess, in this age of people who train certain breeds to fight. MOO

 

[Knox]

If it's all about liability ... Couldn't they just require a deposit? Even in a self-owned setting (vs. a rental) they could stipulate that requirement. That takes care of damage to any area outside of the home.

Injury to other dogs, humans, etc. Isn't that what homeowners insurance is for? I looked at my policy (Allstate) and I don't see an exclusion. Note; Pit Bulls and a few other breeds are prob not allowed regardless of any of the above.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Knox, At the very least the HOA could require that dog owners produce documentation of the dog's vaccination records. If they ( the HOA's) monitored the common grounds for irresponsible dog owners who break the neighborhood rules as vigilantly as they monitor the personal business of the home owner, it would be more productive, IMO.
The rule breakers could receive a warning and a fine for the infraction. It seems discrimatory to single out those who are responsible pet owners because of a weight restriction. My 11 year old dog was 25 lbs. 2 years ago but is now 30lbs. Wonder how the HOA addresses issues such as this?

 

[southcitymom]

I always imagine HOA officers as the adults who couldn't get themselves elected to high school leadership positions. God save this dog and his owner from folks like that.

 

[Tricia]

PLEASE READ PLEASE READ PLEASE READ PLEASE READ ​

Please be aware that the Websleuths Terms of Service forbids the starting of any email campaign, petition, or call campaign without the permission of the owner (yours truly) or one of the administrators.

Please understand we absolutely have to enforce this rule. If we don't then all kinds of slimy people with agendas will join just to get the good people of Websleuths involved in whatever scam they have going.

Having said all of this please don't worry. I fully approve of this email campaign. I think what the HOA is doing is horrible and so wrong on many levels.

Please be sure to check with me next time before you start up with something like this OK?

Loveya,
Tricia

 

[Penelope]

I believe you're correct as to why the size of the dog is limited, especially in apartments where a lot of damage can be done to the interior of the unit. Rather than be discriminatory against certain breeds, the size (pounds) are limited so to exclude the dogs that have a tendency to fight or bite. In this case, with it being a condo that the tenant owns, the interior damage would be irrelevant so it would seem to go more to the common areas of the complex, and the possibility that other tenants could be bitten. Sad, but somewhat necessary I guess, in this age of people who train certain breeds to fight. MOO

To be perfectly honest, in the co-op where I lived the size of the dog was not limited so I don't really know the reasons why that it done. I think the other sleuthers who answered that question had some really goof replies. Also, I think some people just think a large dog is just too large in a small apartment. My sister owns a co-op apartment and the issue in her building with dogs (and even cats) is not necessarily size but noise. She is on her co-op board and people compalin about dogs barking and the noise cats and dogs make scampering or running around an apartment (especially when you live below an owner or tenant who has pets. That's why the HOAs will specify that a certain % of the apartment floor be carpeted-- to deaden the sound.

 

[akashana]

I have been in this situation. I once lived for 5 years in a trailer park that was sold to a new owner who intended to make it into a retirement community. He sought to oust tenants with young children, pets, almost everybody that wasn't age 60 and up. He shut down and filled in the swimming pool and made it a violation for kids to ride bikes in the park. then he started in on the pets. I had two dogs, a 9 y/o mixed breed and an old rescue basset hound. He made new rules stating "No large dogs," and said my basset was large. I got two vets to give written statements that bassets were considered medium sized dogs. So then he made a false report saying that she lunged at him on her chain and bared her teeth. This dog was so lazy and unthreatening that the police officer responding to the call put in his police report that the dog fell asleep on his shoes as he was writing the report. So they then cut off my water and sewage. It was blatant harassment, but I had to work every day and was afraid he would poison their water or even set fire to my trailer with them in there. I moved, with my dogs.

I admit that I always take the dog's side of things (except in cases of vicious attacks), but exceptions can be made, especially when she was only given documents reflecting the policy they later changed. Obviously these are "dog people" who would never have agreed to buy the condo had they known about the weight restriction on dogs. I think they have legal recourse in this case, and I hope they fight back.

 

[Knox]

I always imagine HOA officers as the adults who couldn't get themselves elected to high school leadership positions. God save this dog and his owner from folks like that.

:rolling:

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Tricia,
Thank you, Thank you! My apologies for any inconvenience I caused by not checking with you first about starting this thread! Rest assured I'll check with with you in the future if I ever feel led to begin another thread such as this! You and JBean and all the WS mods are the best! WS Rocks!
Respectfully,

WM

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Everytime I read about these control freaks, I can't help but think of Dennis Rader.

I know what you mean SuziQ. Our HOA president actually looks like the Father vampire on Twilight and even shares the same last name of that family of vampires, LOL!

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Hi Everyone, I finally located Paige Cole, Haley's Mum, online and told her that we were discussing her story here. She was grateful as they were unaware of this. She said they felt blessed to have so much support and that they are not giving up on Haley! I invited her to join in the discussion if she felt so led but that will be her decision so I don't know if she will or not. Just wanted to give you all an update and relay her message.

Thanks for all you super sleuths do to help others! You all are the best!

wm

 

[21merc7]

Hi Everyone, I finally located Paige Cole, Haley's Mum, online and told her that we were discussing her story here. She was grateful as they were unaware of this. She said they felt blessed to have so much support and that they are not giving up on Haley! I invited her to join in the discussion if she felt so led but that will be her decision so I don't know if she will or not. Just wanted to give you all an update and relay her message.

Thanks for all you super sleuths do to help others! You all are the best!

wm

That is WONDERFUL wm! I hope she decides to join, and maybe some of the lawyers here could even point her in the appropriate direction. Just anything could help at this point!

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I hope so too, merc! WE have an awful lot of talent here on WS, don't we? Paige's comment that they aren't giving up on Haley makes me hopeful that the public outcry is opening up lines of communications or that perhaps they've consulted and atty. I just don't know. Hopefully we'll get updates from her on WS or if she's too shy she can contact me and I'll relay to you all! Hugs, wm

 

[panthera]

To be perfectly honest, in the co-op where I lived the size of the dog was not limited so I don't really know the reasons why that it done. I think the other sleuthers who answered that question had some really goof replies. Also, I think some people just think a large dog is just too large in a small apartment. My sister owns a co-op apartment and the issue in her building with dogs (and even cats) is not necessarily size but noise. She is on her co-op board and people compalin about dogs barking and the noise cats and dogs make scampering or running around an apartment (especially when you live below an owner or tenant who has pets. That's why the HOAs will specify that a certain % of the apartment floor be carpeted-- to deaden the sound.

Thanks ~ that does make a lot of sense. I agree that a large dog needs room and a yard (or a lot of long walks) and also has a loud bark. What is so wrong in this case is the negligence of whoever provided the condo owner with the old copy of the rules & regulations and now the owner has to find a new home for her beloved pet. MOO

 

[panthera]

Hi Everyone, I finally located Paige Cole, Haley's Mum, online and told her that we were discussing her story here. She was grateful as they were unaware of this. She said they felt blessed to have so much support and that they are not giving up on Haley! I invited her to join in the discussion if she felt so led but that will be her decision so I don't know if she will or not. Just wanted to give you all an update and relay her message.

Thanks for all you super sleuths do to help others! You all are the best!

wm

Thank YOU!! :blowkiss: Tell her to fight this!!