PA PA - Lower Providence, BlkFem 60-75, 402UFPA, Crocheted Slippers, dress, smock, Feb'74

New Posts

Okay, I will chime in here....first, does anyone know when Marvel Enriched Bread sold last? I am not familiar with that brand...at all! I googled it and came up with ads FROM THE 1940s! So, was it still sold in late 1960s/early 1970s?

Having said that, I know that her generation did NOT waste anything or throw it away so she could have had all of her bread wrappers stored from wayyyy back. It does make sense that she would have put the wrapper(s) over her slippers to go outside. Again, different generation. I too think it is possible she had Dementia and got lost. I am pretty sure that back 40 or so years ago, that area was probably pretty unpopulated (please correct me if I am wrong). My own mom has dementia and if a couple of us kids weren't here, nobody would have kept track of her and she could easily have wandered and never been missed. My mom has over 25 decedents but none in the area that are involved. So, I can see how this Unidentified lady could be local to where she was found. Maybe not but I believe it is possible.
 
Wow, I live in the area where this woman was found. I've lived here for years and have never heard of this case. It makes me so sad to think it's been over 40 years and we still don't know who she is!
 
It looks like only the detached foot was in a bread bag or am I reading it wrong?

There was one winter in the 70s when my family saved bread bags because they couldn't afford to buy us new snow boots that year, and the boots from the year before were too small, so we would slip the bread bags on over our regular shoes when going to and from the car. It's estimated this lady died in the winter so she could have saved them for that purpose, but it still doesn't explain why she had a detached foot in a bread bag.

The sketch makes her look older than the estimated age.
 
This woman kind of reminds me of my grandmom and her sisters. They were very Italian. They would also save bread bags and wore Smocks. They were set in their ways!
 
Aha! Google and I have been able to determine that Marvel Bread was one of the house brands for A&P stores nationwide. I haven't found yet when it was last sold, but my guess is that it probably doesn't lead much of anywhere.

Also found that her Porchlight entry includes an article from 2004, when she had been unidentified for 30 years.
 
I found this which might give a bit more about how she died but it still does not give you any idea on who she may be.

Woman a ‘Jane Doe’ for 30 years

MATT COUGHLIN
10/15/2004

EDITOR’S NOTE: The Cold Case series was conceived by Matt Coughlin‚ former police reporter at The Reporter‚ who wrote this story before he left.

Two brothers and a sister were sledding near Old Baptist Road in Lower Providence on Feb. 9‚ 1974‚ when they came upon a gruesome discovery.

William Wood‚ then 11‚ climbed down an embankment by the Skippack Creek at about 1 p.m. and there under a fallen tree he saw a human skull.

William’s brother Joe‚ 12‚ and sister‚ Joanne‚ 14‚ climbed down and helped William retrieve the skull and the three then ran home and showed their father‚ who called police.

“I saw the skull under the log‚” William later told police. “My brother and sister helped me get it out and we carried it home.”

Police eventually found the body of an elderly white female whose foot was detached.

More than 30 years later‚ police are still investigating who that skull belonged to and how the woman died.

When police investigated the scene in 1974‚ they found the skeletal remains of a white woman who was between 65 and 75 years old.

Since the discovery‚ Pennsylvania State Police and Lower Providence Police have had multiple experts examine the remains to give them further clues about the skeletal remains.

Investigators placed “Jane Doe’s” time of death in mid-December 1973.

Forensic anthropologists and the coroner have estimated she was between 5 feet 5 inches and 5 feet 10 inches tall. Examiners also told police the woman was overweight and had severe arthritis in her back and knees.

Jane Doe’s left foot was found in a Marvel Bread plastic bag‚ detached from the leg‚ still wearing a purple slipper that appeared to have been handmade.

The victim was wearing a light-colored knit dress‚ and an orange smock or housecoat with small light-colored floral designs on it.



©Reporter online.com 2005


monkalup - January 5, 2007 03:12 AM (GMT)


http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/...opic=8150&st=0&
 
I found this which might give a bit more about how she died but it still does not give you any idea on who she may be. Her remains were found in the creek bed. maybe she went walking at the creek and that is why she had the plastic bags on her feet. and then a tree fell on her??
As for the girdle and stockings and housecoat it was totally normal for that generation to wear the girdle and stockings under their housecoats. My mother did until she was about 85 every single day.. when she stopped she complained it did not feel right but it had become too much for her.

Woman a ‘Jane Doe’ for 30 years

MATT COUGHLIN
10/15/2004

EDITOR’S NOTE: The Cold Case series was conceived by Matt Coughlin‚ former police reporter at The Reporter‚ who wrote this story before he left.

Two brothers and a sister were sledding near Old Baptist Road in Lower Providence on Feb. 9‚ 1974‚ when they came upon a gruesome discovery.

William Wood‚ then 11‚ climbed down an embankment by the Skippack Creek at about 1 p.m. and there under a fallen tree he saw a human skull.

William’s brother Joe‚ 12‚ and sister‚ Joanne‚ 14‚ climbed down and helped William retrieve the skull and the three then ran home and showed their father‚ who called police.

“I saw the skull under the log‚” William later told police. “My brother and sister helped me get it out and we carried it home.”

Police eventually found the body of an elderly white female whose foot was detached.

More than 30 years later‚ police are still investigating who that skull belonged to and how the woman died.

When police investigated the scene in 1974‚ they found the skeletal remains of a white woman who was between 65 and 75 years old.

Since the discovery‚ Pennsylvania State Police and Lower Providence Police have had multiple experts examine the remains to give them further clues about the skeletal remains.

Investigators placed “Jane Doe’s” time of death in mid-December 1973.

Forensic anthropologists and the coroner have estimated she was between 5 feet 5 inches and 5 feet 10 inches tall. Examiners also told police the woman was overweight and had severe arthritis in her back and knees.

Jane Doe’s left foot was found in a Marvel Bread plastic bag‚ detached from the leg‚ still wearing a purple slipper that appeared to have been handmade.

The victim was wearing a light-colored knit dress‚ and an orange smock or housecoat with small light-colored floral designs on it.



©Reporter online.com 2005
monkalup - January 5, 2007 03:12 AM (GMT)
http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/...opic=8150&st=0&


Title: PAF740209 February 9, 1974
Description: Montgomery Co.



oldies4mari2004 - July 24, 2006 05:24 AM (GMT)


http://doenetwork.org/cases/402ufpa.html

Unidentified White Female
The victim was discovered on February 9, 1974 Near Old Baptist Road in Lower Providence Twp, Montgomery County, Pennsylvania
Estimated Date of Death: Mid-December 1973
Skeletal Remains
Vital Statistics
Estimated age: 65 - 75 years old
Approximate Height and Weight: 5'5" - 5'10"
Distinguishing Characteristics: An anthropometric study of the remains revealed that the victim had a short neck and bowed back due to an arthritic condition.
Clothing: Remains were clothed in a corset, bra, girdle, light-colored knit dress, smock (orange in color with light-colored flower designs), stockings and hand-crocheted purple slippers.
Fingerprints: Not available

Case History
On February 9, 1974 the Pennsylvania State Police recovered the skeletal remains of a white female from the Skippack Creek bed near Old Baptist Road, Lower Providence Township, PA.
The victims foot, which was detached from the leg, was found in a Marvel Enriched Bread plastic bag.

Investigators
If you have any information about this case please contact:
Lower Providence Township Police Department
Detective Terrence Kennedy
610-539-5900
Or
Pennsylvania State Police
Skippack Station
Corporal David J Milligan 610-584-1250
You may remain anonymous when submitting information.
NCIC Number: U-581176774
Please refer to this number when contacting any agency with information regarding this case.
Source Information:
The Reporter
Pennsylvania State Police Skippack Station
Lower Providence Police Department
 
I wonder if there is a way to find out if she lived in the area and nobody ever checked on her.. like if there was a house that was abandoned some time after she had gone missing. Or if she lived in a house that looked abandoned and people thought was abandoned but she lived there. Or if she lived with a husband that was old and just never reported her. I wonder if there is any way to find out about who lived in the area at that time. does not look like there are many homes there.. and I found one house off of Baptist road (where she was found) that is called the Murder house because people Claim a family got murdered.. BUT I have not seen any newspaper articles or anything .. just folk stories online.. makes me wonder if this house is where the lady came from and since it became abandoned people started making up ghost stories... again just another thought http://forgottenusa.com/haunts/PA/10551/Worcester- Old Baptist Road Murder House/
 
LotsaLatte said:
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1727767,-75.4254174,17z/data=!3m1!1e3

Hopefully the map link works ^ :)

It should go to Old Baptist Road and shows Skippack Creek. And how wooded that area is even now!
Click to expand...

What strikes me is that if this woman walked to more or less where she was found, then with her health problems and footwear I can't see her walking much over a mile or so, so that might narrow down where she might have come from. On the other hand, if she was so local I would have expected someone local to recognise her or at least to voice something along the lines of, "I wonder if it could be Old Mother X. She hasn't been in for her weekly packet of tea for ages."

Alternatively, she might have floated to where she was found, in which case she must have gone in somewhere upstream. If so, where? Could she have been killed or rendered unconscious and tossed off a bridge somewhere? Which way does the creek flow? NE to SW or vice versa? How far might she have been able to float downstream in winter when river levels tend to be higher?
 
To answer my own question of some weeks ago, I noticed that the creek does in fact run from NE to SW. Moreover, upstream of where the body was found the creek runs for some 20 to 30 miles further NE, with only 5 or 6 road bridges from which she might have been thrown if she didn't go into the creek from a waterside property. The roads do seem to be the sort that would carry local traffic only, so I'm guessing it would not have been very risky for a driver to stop at night to throw her over the railings of a bridge. This probably delineates the most likely area for her to have come from.

I know most people get particularly upset/angry about children who are discarded or murdered, but it's older people, especially older women like this one, I feel most saddened by. I can't help thinking that maybe they have already suffered decades of abuse and then they get murdered as well - most likely by a spouse or child.
 
MelmothTheLost said:
To answer my own question of some weeks ago, I noticed that the creek does in fact run from NE to SW. Moreover, upstream of where the body was found the creek runs for some 20 to 30 miles further NE, with only 5 or 6 road bridges from which she might have been thrown if she didn't go into the creek from a waterside property. The roads do seem to be the sort that would carry local traffic only, so I'm guessing it would not have been very risky for a driver to stop at night to throw her over the railings of a bridge. This probably delineates the most likely area for her to have come from.

I know most people get particularly upset/angry about children who are discarded or murdered, but it's older people, especially older women like this one, I feel most saddened by. I can't help thinking that maybe they have already suffered decades of abuse and then they get murdered as well - most likely by a spouse or child.
Click to expand...

And then not reported missing because the spouse, child, or caretaker is still collecting their pensions. It makes me so mad I could scream.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Good point it never occurred to me she could have been dumped off a bridge and floated down.. Yes and I totally with you the little old ladies that get killed and abused and never looked for found or claimed are the ones that really get to me to...ugh.. Usually done by yes a Child Caretaker or Neighbor.. to either take their property or their income.. oh it breaks my heart.. I keep coming back to this.. hoping she would have someone remember her..

MelmothTheLost said:
To answer my own question of some weeks ago, I noticed that the creek does in fact run from NE to SW. Moreover, upstream of where the body was found the creek runs for some 20 to 30 miles further NE, with only 5 or 6 road bridges from which she might have been thrown if she didn't go into the creek from a waterside property. The roads do seem to be the sort that would carry local traffic only, so I'm guessing it would not have been very risky for a driver to stop at night to throw her over the railings of a bridge. This probably delineates the most likely area for her to have come from.

I know most people get particularly upset/angry about children who are discarded or murdered, but it's older people, especially older women like this one, I feel most saddened by. I can't help thinking that maybe they have already suffered decades of abuse and then they get murdered as well - most likely by a spouse or child.
Click to expand...
 
I know Nebraska is kind of far.. but she was last seen in a Housecoat and the weight and height kind of fit..MOliva1[1].jpg

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/o/oliva_mary.html

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2912dfne.html
Name: Mary Oliva
Case Classification: Endangered Missing
Missing Since: July 28, 1973
Location Last Seen: Wilber, Saline County, Nebraska
Physical Description
Date of Birth: Unknown
Age: 79 years old
Race: White
Gender: Female
Height: 5'5"
Weight: 120-140 lbs.
Hair Color: Dark
Eye Color: Unknown or Missing
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Reportedly depressed. She had a heart condition and high blood pressure.
Identifiers
Dentals: Available. She had had recent surgery.
Fingerprints: Not Available
DNA: Available
Clothing & Personal Items
Clothing: A housecoat.
Jewelry: Unknown
 
ok I came across this and I thought it was interesting.. there is no mention as to where his mother is though.. Ross is not to far from where the old lady was found. I just thought I put this up here.. It could be nothing.

https://www.justice.gov/usao-wdpa/p...ead-mother-s-social-security-benefit-39-years


United States District Court Judge Mark R. Hornak imposed sentence upon Chauncey Clinton, 65.
According to information presented to the court, Clinton received and used the Social Security Title II benefits that continued to be issued to his mother, Clara Clinton, after her death on May 7, 1973. From June 1, 1973 to April 3, 2012, Clinton received $304,853.00 in Social Security Administration funds to which benefits he knew he was not entitled.

http://www.post-gazette.com/local/r...rs/stories/201401230290?pgpageversion=pgevoke
"I'm 65 years old, and I'm guilty," the Ross resident told U.S. District Judge Mark Hornak Thursday. Having lived a double life for 40 years -- data clerk and proud father on one hand, moocher of benefits meant for his dead mother on the other -- he wanted to start his 18 months of penance in prison immediately.
"I find this case completely confounding," Judge Hornak said, after directing as many questions at the Social Security Administration agent as he did at Clinton.
Clinton's mother, Clara, died on May 7, 1973, and he promptly canceled the regular Social Security benefits she had been receiving. But he never stopped the survivors benefits she had been getting in relation to the earlier death of his father, allowing roughly 475 monthly payments totaling $302,803 to flow to him.
 
madamx said:
ok I came across this and I thought it was interesting.. there is no mention as to where his mother is though.. Ross is not to far from where the old lady was found. I just thought I put this up here.. It could be nothing.
Click to expand...

The Ross Twp where Mr Clinton lived is in Allegheny County, just north of Pittsburgh, about 300 miles west of Lower Providence, Montgomery County.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 160 more.
Total: 4,571 (members: 161, guests: 4,410)

Online statistics

Members online
161
Guests online
4,410
Total visitors
4,571
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
592,596
Messages
17,971,576
Members
228,838
Latest member
MiaEvans52
Back
Top