Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #17

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mck16 said:
I also remember in one of her statements she said he told her that he could not remember what he had said that he had lied so much. He didn't know the truth from the lies.
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Yes, you are right. That is in the article also. Darn, I wish I could post the whole article. It is really very very sad. The American media chooses and picks the most flammable stuff and it is so out of context.

I have two problems. WS rules and how to translate a Dutch email into an English robotic translator( manual would take some time, pretty lengthy). That family has had a big cross to bear for the last 5 years and probably even before that.
 
In regards to the tide tables info. IIRC it was reported he was in possession of a tide table chart. If it is like it is here ..you can pick one of those up almost anywhere in a coastal community and they are always in the newspaper.
 
panthera said:
I can't imagine what his brothers have to go through with his notoriety; I'm sure it isn't easy for them. MOO
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Yes, and Mother will need to find something left over each and every day to see both of them through to young adulthood. Siblings often forgotten (unintentionally) in situations where one child is consuming the parent's emotional resources and energy.
 
Beatrice said:
May 2005 Anita was gone from Aruba...Business or pleasure.

Joran told her, "Mom, if you had been here, none of this would have happened."
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Beatrice thanks for sharing that I hadn't seen that before. IMHO that statement gives us an enormous insight into that relationship. IMHO he strums her like a banjo. He knows where her buttons are and when to push them or dance on them to ellicit the response he wants.

Of course that is all MHO and not supported by known fact or links. JMHO.
 
GetSmart said:
In regards to the tide tables info. IIRC it was reported he was in possession of a tide table chart. If it is like it is here ..you can pick one of those up almost anywhere in a coastal community and they are always in the newspaper.
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Does he surf, snorkel, dive or like to boat? Just curious if anyone knows?
 
mck16 said:
Very early on a statement came out that Joran was checking the tides and the water currents implying that he was going to dump the body in the water. My question: where was he searching, on his laptop is the assumption I had. But, they said for many days they could not look at his computer because they were waiting for a court order or some such reason.

How do they know he was checking the tides and currents? Is this just another case of poor reporting? And if it is, how can we believe anything that has been reported? tia
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We don't know for sure but according to the link that TwiceIrish posted (page before) they will be checking this during the pretrial investigation which could take up to a year. Up to now, my guess is that reporters have been paying off investigators etc., for info.

"There are still many things to finish in the pre-trial investigation. One of the primary things is the reading of the contents of Joran van der Sloot's laptop. We do not know yet what information it contains....."

http://www.rnw.nl/international-justice/article/joran-van-der-sloot-open-jail
 
epiphany said:
Yes, and Mother will need to find something left over each and every day to see both of them through to young adulthood. Siblings often forgotten (unintentionally) in situations where one child is consuming the parent's emotional resources and energy.
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That is so true. IIRC, isn't one of the boys in college now?
 
rotterdam said:
Yes, you are right. That is in the article also. Darn, I wish I could post the whole article. It is really very very sad. The American media chooses and pick the most flammable stuff and it is so out of context.

I have two problems. WS rules and how to translate a Dutch email into English. That family has had a big cross to bear for the last 5 years and probably even before that.
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I will say this (and then duck) when NH went missing Joran was 17. Apparently he was someone NH was attracted to as she went with him. I in no way blame her. We all need to remember when we were 18. I personally think Joran was a cute guy at that time and in any other scenario he would be an attractive man. (I don't see any frontal lobe damage that some have pointed out). Having said that I don't have any idea what happened in Aruba. I honestly think something did happen with NH and he panicked. What 17 year old wouldn't. But, the way it was handled by dad, authorities, whatever, it escalated way out of control. It made him think he was invinsible and cheapened the life of another person.

He never went to prison, not a conventional prison. But, he was sent away by his parents. He was 17 or 18 on his own in another country. And when he returned to his home country he was ridiculed he had no friends anymore, and according to his friend RL 5 years later he was still having insults hurled at him from his own people. He was almost a man without a country. We think he got away with murder and yet he was a total outcast. He was estranged from his family and home land and left to his own devices for survival.

To an already fragile psychic this can be devastating. Is that an excuse for murder, absolutely not, but it could explain it a little. All the persecution he had felt for 5 years, all the lies, memories of that night with NH came to the surface in that little hotel room. I don't think he was murdering SF, I think he was killing mom, dad, and himself. He had to know this was the end of the road.

There is no good reason for him doing what he did, but there are reasons that led to it. He is a tormented person and I am sure he is glad this game has ended. I don't believe that he does not need to be punished but I do understand how this has come to this conclusin. I don' know how it could have ended any other way. I believe if he had been treated 5 years ago this never would have happened. And I hope it does not end tragically in that prison. I am a firm believer in forgiveness and second chances.JMO
 
Kat said:
Beatrice thanks for sharing that I hadn't seen that before. IMHO that statement gives us an enormous insight into that relationship. IMHO he strums her like a banjo. He knows where her buttons are and when to push them or dance on them to ellicit the response he wants.

Of course that is all MHO and not supported by known fact or links. JMHO.
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Well I support your HO. When I read that - my mouth dropped open. Manipulation at it's peak!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mck16 [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5314429#post5314429"]
viewpost.gif
[/ame]
Very early on a statement came out that Joran was checking the tides and the water currents implying that he was going to dump the body in the water. My question: where was he searching, on his laptop is the assumption I had. But, they said for many days they could not look at his computer because they were waiting for a court order or some such reason.

How do they know he was checking the tides and currents? Is this just another case of poor reporting? And if it is, how can we believe anything that has been reported? tia
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jilly
We don't know for sure but according to the link that TwiceIrish posted (page before) they will be checking this during the pretrial investigation which could take up to a year. Up to now, my guess is that reporters have been paying off investigators etc., for info.

"There are still many things to finish in the pre-trial investigation. One of the primary things is the reading of the contents of Joran van der Sloot's laptop. We do not know yet what information it contains....."




He was arrested in Chile one day after Flores' body was found. Authorities there found him in possession of his laptop and a chart indicating the tides in the Pacific off Lima's coast, which led them to suspect he wanted to dump Flores' body in the ocean.
http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/dpps/ne...nacked-near-corpse-dpgonc-20100610-fc_8015056
 
mck16 said:
I will say this (and then duck) when NH went missing Joran was 17. Apparently he was someone NH was attracted to as she went with him. I in no way blame her. We all need to remember when we were 18. I personally think Joran was a cute guy at that time and in any other scenario he would be an attractive man. (I don't see any frontal lobe damage that some have pointed out). Having said that I don't have any idea what happened in Aruba. I honestly think something did happen with NH and he panicked. What 17 year old wouldn't. But, the way it was handled by dad, authorities, whatever, it escalated way out of control. It made him think he was invinsible and cheapened the life of another person.

He never went to prison, not a conventional prison. But, he was sent away by his parents. He was 17 or 18 on his own in another country. And when he returned to his home country he was ridiculed he had no friends anymore, and according to his friend RL 5 years later he was still having insults hurled at him from his own people. He was almost a man without a country. We think he got away with murder and yet he was a total outcast. He was estranged from his family and home land and left to his own devices for survival.

To an already fragile psychic this can be devastating. Is that an excuse for murder, absolutely not, but it could explain it a little. All the persecution he had felt for 5 years, all the lies, memories of that night with NH came to the surface in that little hotel room. I don't think he was murdering SF, I think he was killing mom, dad, and himself. He had to know this was the end of the road.

There is no good reason for him doing what he did, but there are reasons that led to it. He is a tormented person and I am sure he is glad this game has ended. I don't believe that he does not need to be punished but I do understand how this has come to this conclusin. I don' know how it could have ended any other way. I believe if he had been treated 5 years ago this never would have happened. And I hope it does not end tragically in that prison. I am a firm believer in forgiveness and second chances.JMO
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I can understand a lot of what you're saying...what doesn't reconcile is the way he's been seemingly taunting everyone about NH for years and even now little things like "catch me if you can" if that was correctly reported...I can see him being a tortured individual but this taunting is not exactly what I would expect from a fragile psyche because these are more grandiose actions than angry actions...imo...
 
mck16 said:
I will say this (and then duck) when NH went missing Joran was 17. Apparently he was someone NH was attracted to as she went with him. I in no way blame her. We all need to remember when we were 18. I personally think Joran was a cute guy at that time and in any other scenario he would be an attractive man. (I don't see any frontal lobe damage that some have pointed out). Having said that I don't have any idea what happened in Aruba. I honestly think something did happen with NH and he panicked. What 17 year old wouldn't. But, the way it was handled by dad, authorities, whatever, it escalated way out of control. It made him think he was invinsible and cheapened the life of another person.

He never went to prison, not a conventional prison. But, he was sent away by his parents. He was 17 or 18 on his own in another country. And when he returned to his home country he was ridiculed he had no friends anymore, and according to his friend RL 5 years later he was still having insults hurled at him from his own people. He was almost a man without a country. We think he got away with murder and yet he was a total outcast. He was estranged from his family and home land and left to his own devices for survival.

To an already fragile psychic this can be devastating. Is that an excuse for murder, absolutely not, but it could explain it a little. All the persecution he had felt for 5 years, all the lies, memories of that night with NH came to the surface in that little hotel room. I don't think he was murdering SF, I think he was killing mom, dad, and himself. He had to know this was the end of the road.

There is no good reason for him doing what he did, but there are reasons that led to it. He is a tormented person and I am sure he is glad this game has ended. I don't believe that he does not need to be punished but I do understand how this has come to this conclusin. I don' know how it could have ended any other way. I believe if he had been treated 5 years ago this never would have happened. And I hope it does not end tragically in that prison. I am a firm believer in forgiveness and second chances.JMO
Click to expand...

Oh please. Something happened to Natalee? She was a young healthy 18 years old girl, what is that something that happened to her? As for Joran, as far as I am concerned, he should have been thanking his lucky star that he was out free to roam about, and not sitting in a cell, and what does he do with it? If you ask me, this guy deserves everything that is coming his way.
 
kaRN said:
Are you professionally qualified to diagnose Anita and her ability to cope?
She's actually doing exactly what a mentally healthy person and good Mother should at this point. She is a victim too and we should back off IMO.
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Excellent post.
 
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