Who Has Heard Burke's Voice on The 911 Tape?

[redheadedgal]

police DID hear the voices -- detective melissa hickman and detective steve thomas:

http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682511/The%20911%20Call#EvidenceinFavorofBurkesVoiceBeingontheTape

[ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3744"]Listen To Patsy Ramsey's 911 Call. Hear the Truth. Lin Wood Lied. - Forums For Justice[/ame]

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

police DID hear the voices -- detective melissa hickman and detective steve thomas:

http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682511/The%20911%20Call#EvidenceinFavorofBurkesVoiceBeingontheTape

Listen To Patsy Ramsey's 911 Call. Hear the Truth. Lin Wood Lied. - Forums For Justice

I know they said they did but when the FBI rechecked they said it was not there. I have to go and look where I got that information so for now it is JMO. But I will go back and find where I found the info.

It reminds me of the Police saying the Aisenbergs talked about Drugs and killing the baby on tapes but then when analyzed it was total garbage. It was not there. It bothers me. I feel like if it was really there, It would not be something we had to ferret out. It would be out there and easy to hear. I think they wanted to hear that and so they did. JMO


ETA: FOUND IT..

In his book, “JonBenet: Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation,” Thomas claimed that by enhancing the tape you can hear John and Patsy talking to their son Burke. He claims that’s important because the Ramseys reportedly told police their son was asleep at the time of the call. If true, Thomas claims it suggests the family was altering their story right from the start.
But both the FBI and Secret Service — who examined the tapes — said such a conversation could not be heard.
http://www.today.com/id/3079093#.UfmZyNLVCDk

 

[Chrishope]

I know they said they did but when the FBI rechecked they said it was not there. I have to go and look where I got that information so for now it is JMO. But I will go back and find where I found the info.

It reminds me of the Police saying the Aisenbergs talked about Drugs and killing the baby on tapes but then when analyzed it was total garbage. It was not there. It bothers me. I feel like if it was really there, It would not be something we had to ferret out. It would be out there and easy to hear. I think they wanted to hear that and so they did. JMO


ETA: FOUND IT..

In his book, “JonBenet: Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation,” Thomas claimed that by enhancing the tape you can hear John and Patsy talking to their son Burke. He claims that’s important because the Ramseys reportedly told police their son was asleep at the time of the call. If true, Thomas claims it suggests the family was altering their story right from the start.
But both the FBI and Secret Service — who examined the tapes — said such a conversation could not be heard.
http://www.today.com/id/3079093#.UfmZyNLVCDk

But apparently Aerospace Corp was able to hear it. So what to make of it? Is ST lying? I don't think he'd go that far. Did police, including Thomas cook up some false evidence to see how it might throw the suspects? Maybe.

Someone with a better memory for details might chime in - but what I can recall is that police and Aerospace employees all wrote down what they heard. When notes were compared they found they all heard the same thing. If this can be verified then I'd have to go with BR being heard on the tape.

I've never heard anything but PR saying "Help me Jesus" after she thought she hung up.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

But apparently Aerospace Corp was able to hear it. So what to make of it? Is ST lying? I don't think he'd go that far. Did police, including Thomas cook up some false evidence to see how it might throw the suspects? Maybe.

Someone with a better memory for details might chime in - but what I can recall is that police and Aerospace employees all wrote down what they heard. When notes were compared they found they all heard the same thing. If this can be verified then I'd have to go with BR being heard on the tape.

I've never heard anything but PR saying "Help me Jesus" after she thought she hung up.

It the FBI and Secret Service say it is not there, I believe them.
I don't know if someone put it in the minds of the others that it was there first and then they agreed? I don't know if Aero was paid for their opinion??
I am good with the FBI and SS opinion on this.

 

[otg]

But apparently Aerospace Corp was able to hear it. So what to make of it? Is ST lying? I don't think he'd go that far. Did police, including Thomas cook up some false evidence to see how it might throw the suspects? Maybe.

Someone with a better memory for details might chime in - but what I can recall is that police and Aerospace employees all wrote down what they heard. When notes were compared they found they all heard the same thing. If this can be verified then I'd have to go with BR being heard on the tape.

I've never heard anything but PR saying "Help me Jesus" after she thought she hung up.

As I recall it, the 911 operator (Archuletta) heard the conversation live when Patsy thought she had hung up the phone. It was she who told BPD to see if they could hear what was being said on the recording. They asked their audio technician and then the FBI and SS to see if they could clean it up enough to understand what was being said. They couldn't. They didn't say there were no additional voices -- just that they couldn't clean it up enough to understand what might have been said. It was several months later that one of the BPD heard about the company (Aerospace Corp.) in CA who had specialized equipment that they used pro bono for LE agencies. After they enhanced the audiotape, a group of individuals listened to it and wrote down what they heard at the end. They all heard almost word for word the same thing -- from three different voices.

ETA: This enhanced version has never been released to the public. The only two versions that have been released have been edited at the end to remove at least a portion of the extraneous conversation.

Also, before Burke testified to the GJ, his lawyer was provided with a copy of the 911 call. Most people know the only reason this would be done.

 

[bettybaby00]

As I recall it, the 911 operator (Archuletta) heard the conversation live when Patsy thought she had hung up the phone. It was she who told BPD to see if they could hear what was being said on the recording. They asked their audio technician and then the FBI and SS to see if they could clean it up enough to understand what was being said. They couldn't. They didn't say there were no additional voices -- just that they couldn't clean it up enough to understand what might have been said. It was several months later that one of the BPD heard about the company (Aerospace Corp.) in CA who had specialized equipment that they used pro bono for LE agencies. After they enhanced the audiotape, a group of individuals listened to it and wrote down what they heard at the end. They all heard almost word for word the same thing -- from three different voices.

ETA: This enhanced version has never been released to the public. The only two versions that have been released have been edited at the end to remove at least a portion of the extraneous conversation.

Also, before Burke testified to the GJ, his lawyer was provided with a copy of the 911 call. Most people know the only reason this would be done.

Clearly wood being provided with a copy of the call raises suspicion for me. Say what you will about whether or not you believe one or more Rs did it, the actions of their attorneys can't be viewed as anything other than duplicitous, underhanded, fraudulent, and corrupt...IMO of course, but that's the only way I think they can be viewed. Their accusations that the Rs were "railroaded," is a complete falsehood. I'm not sure about some of the other books that have been written, but Kolar emphasizes in great detail the leads, witnesses, and various other actions by the BPD in their investigation regarding the idea that a intruder murdered JonBenet.

He also covers, and again in great detail, the work that Areospace did to enhance the tape, and reiterates how the analysts listened to the tape and independently wrote down what they heard. When they compared their findings, they were ALL the same. They not only all heard JR and BR on at the end, but they all heard the same content as well.

The "case encyclopedic" linked up thread details all the info regarding the varying conflicts regarding these tapes, and some very compelling evidence is presented about why the FBI and Secret Service conclusions may well be faulty.

One of the most critical things to remember is that the enhanced tape has never been released to the public, and therefore we can't really judge what we believe we hear or don't hear.

 

[Chrishope]

It the FBI and Secret Service say it is not there, I believe them.
I don't know if someone put it in the minds of the others that it was there first and then they agreed? I don't know if Aero was paid for their opinion??
I am good with the FBI and SS opinion on this.

The FBI/SS didn't say the voices are not on the tape. They said they couldn't recover (if that's the right term) the voices. IOWs, there equipment wasn't capable.

 

[Chrishope]

As I recall it, the 911 operator (Archuletta) heard the conversation live when Patsy thought she had hung up the phone. It was she who told BPD to see if they could hear what was being said on the recording. They asked their audio technician and then the FBI and SS to see if they could clean it up enough to understand what was being said. They couldn't. They didn't say there were no additional voices -- just that they couldn't clean it up enough to understand what might have been said. It was several months later that one of the BPD heard about the company (Aerospace Corp.) in CA who had specialized equipment that they used pro bono for LE agencies. After they enhanced the audiotape, a group of individuals listened to it and wrote down what they heard at the end. They all heard almost word for word the same thing -- from three different voices.

ETA: This enhanced version has never been released to the public. The only two versions that have been released have been edited at the end to remove at least a portion of the extraneous conversation.

Also, before Burke testified to the GJ, his lawyer was provided with a copy of the 911 call. Most people know the only reason this would be done.

Thank you, I think you've essentially described the events wrt to why the tape was analyzed.

I would like to point out that BR's lawyer would have a copy of the 911 call regardless of whether BR's voice was on it or not. I think you are suggesting a conclusion based on possession of a transcript. It's not that I don't think BR's voice is on the tape, just that the conclusion you seem to suggest is, imo, not valid.

 

[Chrishope]

Clearly wood being provided with a copy of the call raises suspicion for me. Say what you will about whether or not you believe one or more Rs did it, the actions of their attorneys can't be viewed as anything other than duplicitous, underhanded, fraudulent, and corrupt...IMO of course, but that's the only way I think they can be viewed. Their accusations that the Rs were "railroaded," is a complete falsehood. I'm not sure about some of the other books that have been written, but Kolar emphasizes in great detail the leads, witnesses, and various other actions by the BPD in their investigation regarding the idea that a intruder murdered JonBenet.

He also covers, and again in great detail, the work that Areospace did to enhance the tape, and reiterates how the analysts listened to the tape and independently wrote down what they heard. When they compared their findings, they were ALL the same. They not only all heard JR and BR on at the end, but they all heard the same content as well.

The "case encyclopedic" linked up thread details all the info regarding the varying conflicts regarding these tapes, and some very compelling evidence is presented about why the FBI and Secret Service conclusions may well be faulty.

One of the most critical things to remember is that the enhanced tape has never been released to the public, and therefore we can't really judge what we believe we hear or don't hear.

The Rs lawyers did a great job. If I were facing the possibility of being charged with murder I'd like to be able to afford these guys.

 

[bettybaby00]

Thank you, I think you've essentially described the events wrt to why the tape was analyzed.

I would like to point out that BR's lawyer would have a copy of the 911 call regardless of whether BR's voice was on it or not. I think you are suggesting a conclusion based on possession of a transcript. It's not that I don't think BR's voice is on the tape, just that the conclusion you seem to suggest is, imo, not valid.

:lol: yea probably, but I got caught in rant mode! :rockon:

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

The FBI/SS didn't say the voices are not on the tape. They said they couldn't recover (if that's the right term) the voices. IOWs, there equipment wasn't capable.

Yeah I don't believe it. From what I see they said they could not hear them after examining. I feel pretty confident the SS and FBI have the tools needed or access to them to examine audio tapes well. It's okay that I'm the odd man out on this. I have to work off how it works for me and not what others believe.

 

[UKGuy]

Thank you, I think you've essentially described the events wrt to why the tape was analyzed.

I would like to point out that BR's lawyer would have a copy of the 911 call regardless of whether BR's voice was on it or not. I think you are suggesting a conclusion based on possession of a transcript. It's not that I don't think BR's voice is on the tape, just that the conclusion you seem to suggest is, imo, not valid.

Chrishope,
Ah but which tape, the enhanced version, the unenhanced verbatim copy, or a redacted version released for public consumption?


The R's later admitted that BR was awake early that morning and that the R's version of events was fabricated.

I reckon BR at the GJ hearing agreed he was awake that morning, probably after listening to a playing of the enhanced tape.

This led to the R's revising their version of events.

JR, PR and BR are all complicit in the death and staging of JonBenet.


.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Chrishope,
Ah but which tape, the enhanced version, the unenhanced verbatim copy, or a redacted version released for public consumption?


The R's later admitted that BR was awake early that morning and that the R's version of events was fabricated.

I reckon BR at the GJ hearing agreed he was awake that morning, probably after listening to a playing of the enhanced tape.

This led to the R's revising their version of events.

JR, PR and BR are all complicit in the death and staging of JonBenet.


.

In your opinion...

So much is stated as fact in this case that is just opinion and it is hard to separate the fact from opinion.

 

[UKGuy]

In your opinion...

So much is stated as fact in this case that is just opinion and it is hard to separate the fact from opinion.

ScarlettScarpetta,
Please do not attempt to characterise what I wrote as opinion it is fact.

The R's did postmortem agree that BR was awake and that they had fabricated their version of events.

This makes the R's complicit in the staging of JonBenet. Can I prove an R killed JonBenet no more than you can, or the BPD.

So that might be judged opinion since the infamous intruder is still at large. I reckon there is enough evidence to suggest an R killed JonBenet, which one, why and when is open to debate.


.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Still opinion on the outcome. It may be that you have followed the evidence and it fits in a way for you that supports your theory in what happened in that home that caused the death of jbr but it is still your opinion on the summary.

I'm not trying to argue with you. Really. I just find it confusion when people state their conclusions as fact.

 

[Chelly]

In your opinion...

So much is stated as fact in this case that is just opinion and it is hard to separate the fact from opinion.

With respect: Review of your posts on the JBR forum shows that you consistently disagree with knowledgeable and esteemed forum members who do put forth evidence and actual events.

Yes, there is speculation based on fact and that is open for discussion. But, actual evidence and events should not be flamed. if you are a serious contributor, you are doing yourself and these forums a disservice by continuing to degrade factual posts.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I think that it is hard to post in this forum if you do not support majority opinion. In am respectful of people that support the RDI theory, I just don't agree.

I'm not ignoring facts I just think it is hard to separate the facts from opinion when people state their personal conclusions as fact.

Every where else we need to make sure that we post things are our opinion when not supported by links.

I know there is massive amounts of evidence in this case and I figured it may take me months to get through it. But I think that the feeling is that unless you walk with the pack you have no right to post here or expect the same level of opinion noted as opinion that other forums here have. It makes it confusing for us taking this step by step from the beginning.

I'm not trying at all to ruffle feathers. If the RDI theory is correct than it should withstand incredible scrutiny and that should be welcomed. Some times the best way to prove a theory is to keep throwing other theories at it until only one remains.

It would be nice if we could all be afforded a little latitude in finding our own way here. To judge the evidence and work it all out on our own.

I am not a fly by nighter. I am seriously taking each point of the case and looking into it. I'm sorry if I seem like a Johnny come lately but this case has always bothered me and it is just now that I have time in my life to really get to the facts and look at it all anew.

I appreciate the opportunity to go through this case with all of you.

 

[UKGuy]

Still opinion on the outcome. It may be that you have followed the evidence and it fits in a way for you that supports your theory in what happened in that home that caused the death of jbr but it is still your opinion on the summary.

I'm not trying to argue with you. Really. I just find it confusion when people state their conclusions as fact.

ScarlettScarpetta,
My conclusion is fact!

It is the R's own admission that they fabricated events on the morning of 12/26/1996. They stated that BR was awake that morning and they decided to write him out of the script.

Again for your delectation all three R's are complicit in the staging of JonBenet!

.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

ScarlettScarpetta,
My conclusion is fact!

It is the R's own admission that they fabricated events on the morning of 12/26/1996. They stated that BR was awake that morning and they decided to write him out of the script.

Again for your delectation all three R's are complicit in the staging of JonBenet!

.

Can you link me to actual evidence that that the Ramseys said Burke was awake ?
TIA.

 

[Chelly]

I think that it is hard to post in this forum if you do not support majority opinion. In am respectful of people that support the RDI theory, I just don't agree.

I'm not ignoring facts I just think it is hard to separate the facts from opinion when people state their personal conclusions as fact.

Every where else we need to make sure that we post things are our opinion when not supported by links.

I know there is massive amounts of evidence in this case and I figured it may take me months to get through it. But I think that the feeling is that unless you walk with the pack you have no right to post here or expect the same level of opinion noted as opinion that other forums here have. It makes it confusing for us taking this step by step from the beginning.

I'm not trying at all to ruffle feathers. If the RDI theory is correct than it should withstand incredible scrutiny and that should be welcomed. Some times the best way to prove a theory is to keep throwing other theories at it until only one remains.

It would be nice if we could all be afforded a little latitude in finding our own way here. To judge the evidence and work it all out on our own.

I am not a fly by nighter. I am seriously taking each point of the case and looking into it. I'm sorry if I seem like a Johnny come lately but this case has always bothered me and it is just now that I have time in my life to really get to the facts and look at it all anew.

I appreciate the opportunity to go through this case with all of you.

SS: Again, with respect. Instead of taking issue with logical findings in this case, please give us your rational theory, listing evidence and known behaviors, excluding what you wish to believe in your heart.

If you can't provide a theory based on evidence and real events, would you at least consider not consistently tearing down the evidence provided by those who know it and are trying to help?