VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #12

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Not true. And not that I personally believe that Hannah fell victim of trafficking, it does indeed happen and is not just about "lower class" women being abducted. Young and not clear-thinking have fallen victim as well, and personally, I am bothered that posters here seemingly can't consider this to be a possibility. This is just one link on a 17 year old girl apparently abducted and it was all over the media. I won't post her name since she's a juvenile, but her name can be searched and many, many articles come up.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/Cama...nto-human-trafficking-underway-266534641.html

Should also be noted there is an ad on the Virginia State Police's web site for the VA Coordinated Response Against Human Trafficking, so why suggestions Hannah may have fallen victim to such "because it NEVER happens" are summarily dismissing that it could be possible are IMO incorrect.

http://www.vsp.state.va.us

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...loating-oregon-river-police-article-1.1863494

Not to burst your bubble, but this girl made up the human trafficking story as cover to run away for a couple days to go rafting. I don't mean to discount what is a horrible crime in human trafficking, but the fact remains that human traffickers will NOT snatch people who will be missed by anyone (as Hannah clearly is). They will snatch "throw away" kids who already ran away and no one cared and are now living on the streets.
 
from the bar that she was at with JM? DO you have link to this?


No-from the first party she left around midnight--before she walked to mcgradys. It's in thread 1 or 2--also in the early news stories.
 
Not bashing... and I think you are right about some things... I think they know where he is and are trying to avoid some sort of incident... they are trying to fog him out at this point...

I think the fact that they have not described him as dangerous or told the public to not attempt to apprehend, etc. (that I have heard, must watch the press conference first, correct me if wrong)... backs this up somewhat, in theory

I don't think that this man will get bail , though... I think that was sealed when he lost his FBI tail and never showed up again... days ago

The new Wanted Poster does contain the warning - Do not try to apprehend this fugitive- etc.
 
I've been doing some reading on "abduction with intent to defile" so I'm way behind on the discussion. Hopefully, I am not bringing up something that has been mulled over already. My thinking right now is that LE must have a witness or witnesses to something that took place the night Hannah went missing. I came across this statement from Virginia Law and Criminal Procedure in relation to the charge: "The intent to defile must be established as a matter of fact; surmise and speculation 'are not sufficient'." To me, somebody had to have seen something & can testify to it. Was it something as basic as his blocking her from leaving and then telling her somewhat forcefully to get in his car after he was overheard making sexual advancements toward her? Very well could be IMO. I think anything more physical would have immediately been reported by others. Then, it would have been much more severe charges. So, what I'm trying to say is that I'm trying to figure out just what it is that would constitute such a charge.

Ok, I am thinking on this...you know how you have heard the charge for drug dealers like 'possession with the intent to distribute" meaning possession is a small charge if you have a little bit on you, but if you get intent to distribute, you have so much, they were able to classify you as big time...with a heavy charge. So, the way I link that to this is...could they have found materials such as bindings, chains, locks, rope, duct tape, fasteners, sex toys, etc...lots of things in the car along with her DNA that made them know he had intent to do these acts to her????
 
The account of Grandma telling a reporter to get off her property, then walking out on the porch and telling him again, doesn't sound like someone very terrified or confused to me.

I wonder if theyre using the same excuses given by others in this thread to justify JLM's reprehensible and heinous actions?
They were not excuses, they were possibilities based on the facts to which we were privy at the time. Possibilities that are fading with every second that he does not turn himself in.
 
Found this 'ABDUCTION WITH INTENT TO DEFILE" charge in Virginia. This article dealt with a man from Fairfax...in MCLEAN, Va. (WUSA9) -- Fairfax County police have arrested a man after they say he victimized and exploited a teenage girl he met on Facebook. He is now charged with abduction with intent to defile and contributing to the delinquency of a minor after a tip led police to the girl, who had been missing for three months. Police say they charged Contreras in an "alleged sex trafficking case."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/201...ficking-charge-missing-teen-girl-va/15884667/
 
Ok, I am thinking on this...you know how you have heard the charge for drug dealers like 'possession with the intent to distribute" meaning possession is a small charge if you have a little bit on you, but if you get intent to distribute, you have so much, they were able to classify you as big time...with a heavy charge. So, the way I link that to this is...could they have found materials such as bindings, chains, locks, rope, duct tape, fasteners, sex toys, etc...lots of things in the car along with her DNA that made them know he had intent to do these acts to her????

Good points.
 
No, terrified that LE must have evidence to back up these charges, when I am sure they felt he was innocent and just afraid to talk to police, imo.

They should get on the right side of the fence fast, because they're not helping him from the wrong side of the fence.
 
Forgive me yall, im about a billion pages behind..

Just listened to the press conference from earlier today and... Longo seemed so... sad, compared to the previous PC's where he is fired up and energetic with emotion. He seems truly disheartened by some kind of information he now has.

Also... Why was there *zero* mention of Hannah all throughout the entire PC, until a reporter prompts him at the very end??? It's as if they already know where she is and it's not good and now the only thing left is to find him.. JMO. Also, when he says there are state & federal resources that have been "released" to help accomplish the task of finding him, is he referring to the FBI now? If they are now stepping in also it does not seem like a good sign either.. And the mention of the timeline "from now until Mr. Matthew goes to trial".

I apologize if this has already all been covered earlier, it was a long day working overtime today and just now catching up on the latest news here.. And I do not like the way any of it sounds :(
 
is it me or did his grandma speak of him like a child. Perhaps that is where people are getting the thought that he may be emotionally stunted?

In all seriousness, don't most grandmothers speak about their grandchildren this way? They're convinced their grandchildren hung the moon, saved the world and yet still wants cookies and milk at 3pm even if they're 40.
 
Ok, I am thinking on this...you know how you have heard the charge for drug dealers like 'possession with the intent to distribute" meaning possession is a small charge if you have a little bit on you, but if you get intent to distribute, you have so much, they were able to classify you as big time...with a heavy charge. So, the way I link that to this is...could they have found materials such as bindings, chains, locks, rope, duct tape, fasteners, sex toys, etc...lots of things in the car along with her DNA that made them know he had intent to do these acts to her????

Here is an article listing the charge abduction with the intent to defile in Fairfax. MCLEAN, Va. (WUSA9) -- Fairfax County police have arrested a man after they say he victimized and exploited a teenage girl he met on Facebook. He is now charged with abduction with intent to defile and contributing to the delinquency of a minor after a tip led police to the girl, who had been missing for three months. Police say they charged Contreras in an "alleged sex trafficking case."
 
Anyone else wondering where Grandma is now? I am a little shocked that no one from his family has released a "turn yourself in" statement or a "he's not with me" one.

No doubt they know where he is and likely will lead LE right to him (with hope).

One more thing I want to speak to was the comment that no one could understand what he was doing out alone. It needs to be pointed out that Hannah was out alone also with seemingly no purpose.

The one thing I would like to know is why she left the party? Where did she say she was headed? Did she know or intend to meet up with someone? Even if it wasn't POI, who was she looking for. If she has lived in VA for most of her life, how was she lost in the downtown area that she decided to go to. None of this , imo is what caused this to happen to her but I am curious of the little details that seem to be missing.

When I look at the Noelle Paquette case in Canada, my home town, she left a party after a fight with her boyfriend and decided to walk home. Everyone knew that she was going to do this but could not stop her. This information was released immediately when people started looking for her... why are her intentions for the night protected? Again, I repeat, she is innocent... I think I could do a better job, though if I knew more of the basics of the night.

Hopefully , JM's friends and family have him in touch with an attorney, and that arrangement for him to go into custody are worked out and it goes, safely and smoothly. He is not with immediate family, and they may not know exactly where he is, and may want a lawyer or other advocate to facilitate this.

JM apparently was a fixture at the mall and people at Tempo knew him. He had been there earlier in the evening, and returned with Hannah after he left the first time. He hung out there.

Hannah left the party to meet up with some others. LE has not given details, but I am sure they have spoken to her friends, and they know who she was supposed to meet wheree. It was a sad mistake that she left on her own, and it seems to be the consensus that she had had too much to drink or had taken recreational drugs, The reports seem to be pretty sure that she got turned around in terms of direction and was on the opposite side of where she wanted to be. Her movements fit that of someone confused and lost, and also she moved like someone who was intoxicated.

She is a sophomore (second year) at the school, and usually freshmen live on campus and stay pretty much there, so it makes sense that she was not that familiar with the area outside of the campus, especially at night, especially drunk. In all fairness, I did the same thing last week in turning my self around and finding myself confused and not where I planned to be. I was distacted and on auto pilot and it took me a while before I realized I was going the wrong way. So one doesn't have to be "under the influence" or completely unfamiliar with an area to do as she did. Also Hannah lived most of her life in the state of VA, but not in the Charlotteville area. She simply headed the wrong way, wasn't paying attention as she rushed along and then when she did look around, she wasn't where she thought she was headed at all.

Sadly, what happened next is not uncommon. Attractive, vulnerable young woman looking lost, confused, and yes, intoxicated. She was approached by JM, and though the consensu seems to be that they did not know each other, he was able to make her comfortable with him, probably a smilie, and a "lost, honey? let me help you". To Tempo, the went, and it seems JM was known there and he probably offered her a ride to where she wanted to go. Confused, tired and someone who seemed to be friendly and known to others there, I can see where she would feel comfortable accepting the offer. What I find hard to believe is that JM was foolish enough to do as he likely did when he had to know that those who knew him saw him with her at Tempo. It's not like he ran into her somewhere that there was a chance no one saw them together. It was not video footage but eye witnesses that placed JM as the last person to be with Hannah when her trail ended at that mall from Tempo. He and Hannah were seen leaving there together.

What happened next? Don't know, But Hannah has disappeared, and enough evidence has been found to accuse JM of wrong doing, something LE could not do at first even whent they had him has the last person traceable to Hannah, and wanted to question him--he refused to let them. Whatever was found in JM's car, clothing, phone, apt or maybe some other evidence altogether make it a go to accuse him of ill doing.

I don't think there is an attempt to hide where Hannah was going that night or who she was meeting. It just isn't important. The focus has been on where did she go? How did she disappear? Through surveillance, LE knew where she was right up to when she went off camera. I'm sure they spoke to whoever she was texting--they were on the other side of where she started, which is why it is thought she got her direction backward. They were not at the mall or within a couple of miles of where Hannah ended up. So those friends are just not in the picture as they were not there, not really near where Hannah was.

Why do you think it's important to id those she was going to meet? She was at the mall because she went the wrong direction, was confused.
 
Found this 'ABDUCTION WITH INTENT TO DEFILE" charge in Virginia. This article dealt with a man from Fairfax...in MCLEAN, Va. (WUSA9) -- Fairfax County police have arrested a man after they say he victimized and exploited a teenage girl he met on Facebook. He is now charged with abduction with intent to defile and contributing to the delinquency of a minor after a tip led police to the girl, who had been missing for three months. Police say they charged Contreras in an "alleged sex trafficking case."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/201...ficking-charge-missing-teen-girl-va/15884667/

I saw that too. it gives hope. and it can be sex trafficking even if it isn't part of a big ring with well paid pimps and international organization. if you allow anyone to come use the person for sex it's trafficking.
 
Perhaps JM is waiting to surrender himself until any "defensive" wounds that he may have received in a struggle heal?
 
Agreed...I was only researching where the charge "abduction with intent to defile" had been used in cases in VA. I googled it and this came up. I'm definitely not making a connection between this guy and the kidnapping of Hannah.
 
In all seriousness, don't most grandmothers speak about their grandchildren this way? They're convinced their grandchildren hung the moon, saved the world and yet still wants cookies and milk at 3pm even if they're 40.

And beyond. IIRC from the prior articles, she's in her 80s. I hope people leave her alone. I know that's not going to happen, but she isn't responsible for what JLM did.
 
Trafficking is one of those things that comes up in literally every case, but I have never ever seen it be true except for one time. Amy Bradley, who was on a cruise ship in a different country when taken. It is one of those things that I almost never consider now just because of that, but who knows? This has been a strange case and I have also never seen an intent to defile charge before.

There is no substantiated evidence that Amy Bradley was abducted.
 
the charge specifically says abduction and attempt to defile Hannah Graham.

No, the charges specifically state abduction with the intent to defile, not attempt to defile. People seem to be consistently getting this wrong. Big difference.
 
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