Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #24

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We really can follow individual posters. Just click on their avatar and the option of "follow" is presented. I do it with some of the lawyers, physicians and VIs. Then you can see their posts all at once each day, ie if you are in a hurry or want to see what the VIs say, by clicking on "your news feed". It's a cool feature.
Oh, ok, so we have to click on " news feed" first? I'll have to look for that. I'm following a few posters but don't have any idea how to find their posts! Thank you.
 
Yes. The same applies for victims who are submerged in water. Science can determine if they were dead or not before they entered the water, based on fluid in the lungs.
Is that true even after being submerged for days? Is it the same in salt water and fresh water? (not saying it isn't, I really don't know)
 
Oh you're probably right, but is that true with bodies that are down on the bottom for days? In that tank they couldn't have floated down and out of the oil. At first we were talking about oil going down into the stomach and tainting stomach contents. And I was just musing and wondering if the oil itself would have enough pressure to push into the stomach or lungs.
I think this is possible. But even if you find oil in those places, there will likely be an observable cause of death if they were strangled.

If we are to believe that Shanann was strangled, then it’s likely the kids died the same way. That’s why I’m so confident in strangulation being the cause.
 
That’s possible, and they are certainly doing that testing.

If this was premeditated, and he had killed the kids prior to Shanann’s arrival, then I wouldn’t be shocked by that finding.



For Caylee Anthony case we had Vaas for her death, who would be expert in decomp for oil murders?
 
Well, if she had a heart attack because she was being strangled, then it is a moot point. That would still be murder, by him.
CW could argue at trial it wasn't his intent for SW to die and he was only trying to stop the strangulation of his child. My post was about why he hid the bodies and I think he hid them because he thought he caused SW's death and he panicked. JMO
 
Is that true even after being submerged for days? Is it the same in salt water and fresh water? (not saying it isn't, I really don't know)
Drowning is a tough cause of death to prove. Usually it is determined to be the cause of death after all other methods of death are excluded (for a body found in or near water).
From my quick research, fluids can enter the body after death. This is especially true during decomposition.

I’ve said it a couple times, but evidence of strangulation would likely overrule any fluids found internally.
 
CW could argue at trial it wasn't his intent for SW to die and he was only trying to stop the strangulation of his child. My post was about why he hid the bodies and I think he hid them because he thought he caused SW's death and he panicked. JMO
Its probable that he killed all three as well as his unborn son and hid them because he was scared.
 
I had proposed that as a possibility a ways back, but the affidavit says the murders occurred in the house. So, how do they know all three? That's another question I have.
@NuttMegg that is a great point. Based on the affidavit, it states 3 counts of tampering with a deceased human body. So if that was the charges then the girls were dead when put into the vats. I am assuming that is the tampering with a deceased human body aspect. And further to that, it said in affidavit the crime/s occurred at the home.
https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...18CR2003/001/Warrantless Arrest Affidavit.pdf
 
Would there be a possibility if they were in bags that their bodies would float? I am thinking that didn't happen because I thought it was posted that the tanks had to have the oil removed before retrieving the girls.
I'd think they would float for awhile if they were truly sealed in plastic, but I don't know. I also don't even know if they would sink within 4 days if not in bags at all. And yes it sounds like they were taken out of the bottom of the tanks after they were drained. A lot we don't know!
 
@NuttMegg that is a great point. Based on the affidavit, it states 3 counts of tampering with a deceased human body. So if that was the charges then the girls were dead when put into the vats. I am assuming that is the tampering with a deceased human body aspect. And further to that, it said in affidavit the crime/s occurred at the home.
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/001/Warrantless Arrest Affidavit.pdf
That makes sense based on the affidavit, and common sense.
 
Drowning is a tough cause of death to prove. Usually it is determined to be the cause of death after all other methods of death are excluded (for a body found in or near water).
From my quick research, fluids can enter the body after death. This is especially true during decomposition.

I’ve said it a couple times, but evidence of strangulation would likely overrule any fluids found internally.
Fluids can enter the body during decomposition, but the crucial question is if it reached the lungs and stomach. As the girls were found not TOO long after being submerged in crude oil it stands to reason that the decomp was still in early stages so that other fluids could not enter the lungs/stomach??
 
I feel the need to say something here. I have never had the pleasure in my entire life of being amongst a group of people with the level of intelligence I see here. Differing opinions aside you all are the best of the best... all the way to impeccable grammar! I have been reading since the beginning of this case. I've seen differences of opinion & imo only a few cases of insincerity. I hope everyone continues to post their views/opinions as it would be pretty dull without different,respectful, sincere thoughts!
 
BBM

Per SW's FB, there's at least one day (Monday, May 7 2018) that SW confirms CW got up at 4am to go to work.

Someone’s thrivin’...Up for work at 4am. Just got home and now mowing the grass. #likeaboss #helovesme

This was over 4 months ago. In my opinion, I'd take the neighbor's word for it regarding CW/SW's most recent morning patterns. However, it is still, FWIW, interesting to see there was at least one occurrence in which CW getting up at 4am wasn't unusual.

JMO.
Agreed - and if he generally parked his truck in the street, the neighbor may not notice him leaving early - maybe they just noticed on this day because he was in the driveway.

I go to the gym at 4:45a and I wait until the last possible minute to get out of bed and out the door... so it’s a really small window of opportunity for me to see any of my neighbors. If they leave 60 seconds before or after me, I won’t see them or notice anything. I’m still half asleep, anyway... :)
 
Oh you're probably right, but is that true with bodies that are down on the bottom for days? In that tank they couldn't have floated down and out of the oil. At first we were talking about oil going down into the stomach and tainting stomach contents. And I was just musing and wondering if the oil itself would have enough pressure to push into the stomach or lungs.


Not looking forward to Frye hearings, may be new territory for the courts as to oil questions.
 
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@NuttMegg that is a great point. Based on the affidavit, it states 3 counts of tampering with a deceased human body. So if that was the charges then the girls were dead when put into the vats. I am assuming that is the tampering with a deceased human body aspect. And further to that, it said in affidavit the crime/s occurred at the home.
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/001/Warrantless Arrest Affidavit.pdf
Oh, I'm such a contrarian, I would just like to know how they know all 3 died in the house. IF a cadaver dog gave the right signs, how would they know the dog was indicating 3 different bodies? But maybe they have a bunch of other evidence. Like the hair and other stuff.
 
What did CW say to her in their baby announcement video? Paraphrased — when she really wants it, she gets it.

ETA: SW was pretty inspiring. She had a lot of talents and if she could have found a partnership in a husband that was able to rise to her level of abilities and ambitions all of her dreams would have come true. ),;
I love your last paragraph about SW.
 
Ohhh, you bring up an interesting point. Why the heck was CW up and about at 4 am? His neighbor said she never saw him leaving at 5:30 am before. She said that was earlier than usual.

Why was he up so early, if he didn't know he was going to need to make that dump run before work?
Oh you're probably right, but is that true with bodies that are down on the bottom for days? In that tank they couldn't have floated down and out of the oil. At first we were talking about oil going down into the stomach and tainting stomach contents. And I was just musing and wondering if the oil itself would have enough pressure to push into the stomach or lungs.
Shanann Watts
There are several mentions of 4am being normal time for him to wake up
 
Oh, ok, so we have to click on " news feed" first? I'll have to look for that. I'm following a few posters but don't have any idea how to find their posts! Thank you.
Go up to the top right corner on this page, and click "alerts". Then go to the left at the top but not exactly at the top and see where there is a tab that says "my news feed". Click on that, and if you have followed someone their posts will show up there. Also there is a column down the left side of the page with "my news feed", under alerts. Try it out!! I don't know how far back in time they save the posts you follow, though.
 
I think this is possible. But even if you find oil in those places, there will likely be an observable cause of death if they were strangled.

If we are to believe that Shanann was strangled, then it’s likely the kids died the same way. That’s why I’m so confident in strangulation being the cause.
Agree @MassGuy, that likely strangulation cause of death for all 3 because in any and all photos I located on line of LE removing 2 bags from the home that night when CW was arrested, they were not wearing any protective covers or booties. Then when the defense team went in to collect items, they were also not wearing any protective covers or booties. My thinking is there was no blood involved.
 
If the neighbors had heard or seen a ruckus, and called 911, and the police came and found 2 dead girls, and 2 parents, pummeling each other. it would have been a 'he said/she said' battle.

And if that had happened, and they both pointed fingers at the other, then I would be 50/50 on which one was the killer. I know that both mothers and fathers kill their kids, tragically enough.

So I would be open to looking at the videos and the SM posts and hearing from friends/family, to try and figure out which one did this horrible deed.

But in this case, he is pointing his finger at a pregnant dead woman, who was likely killed in the same way as his daughters were. And his explanation of events just seems very sketchy and unreal. JMO
 
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