GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #62

[AnyaB]

I think the mother mentally abused him, thus the inability to talk as one of his teacher said. Then her criticism of Shanann planted seeds in his mind that she was as his mother said "shady". This all played into this. You think this would have happened if his mother had loved Shanann especially since she gave them 2 beautiful grandchildren and they all respected one another like most families do? I don't think it would have, he would have been happy in his marriage. Mothers have great influence over their adult sons.

I don’t believe his eyes were suddenly open re Shannan, he knew that it wouldn’t disappoint his family if she were missing from his life.

Yes! His intelligence is off the charts...

It was one of three or four control questions, he was asked to lie about them purposefully. But I thought the same thing until I watched the entire process.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

But can you imagine? This is a man who took care of those kids. Knew them super well. I mean how you act that for years is beyond me. The narcissists and sociopaths I've seen in my work can put on an act but the moment no one is looking or as soon as they feel comfortable they're no longer putting their child first or adequately caring for their needs.

Not this guy. For four years he changed diapers, fed, bathed and dressed them, did medicine, played games snuggled, packed their supplies, wiped noses, consoled them, all the stuff a normal and bonded parent does.

Then he not only killed them but could calmly look at videos of them, knowing he will never see them alive again, and showed no remorse or grief of any kind.

None of us are ever going to understand this. Or be able to figure it out. Yet we will keep trying.

And when asked what was he thinking he responded how he let everyone down, not that his precious girls were gone, his mind was not even on them. His focus was where it has always been, on himself and how others view him.

 

[Jessthinkin]

It’s because so much time passed between that first search and the next one. If she was that interested in CW, you’d think there would be more. At least, I do.

I wonder if she had a different phone or computer in the interim that she used.. the next search for SW was Jan 2018 on the ‘disclosed’ phone...

 

[x_files]

This is so absolutely TRUE about Narcissists. Mimics my own experience with a very high-functioning Malignant Narcissist

This personality disorder is often ascribed to childhood manipulation by a Narcissistic parent, which is most often a mother for a male child.

This certainly seems to follow the influences that CW's mother exerted on him.

yes, the MNPD man I dated was forced to have a Psych Eval after stalking and attempted to kill me.
He was diagnosed with MNPD and a psychopath.
He admitted to the psychologist it stemmed from childhood sexual abuse by the hands of his adopted mother. I met his mother she was sexually inappropriate and emotionally incestuous. She gropes him at holiday dinner, feels up his package and slaps his bum, stroke his muscles. She was all over him in front of the guests and her husband/his adoptive father. Everyone in the family said," she was always so in love with him and said it's normal, don't over analyze it!"
So, back to CW's I wonder if his hatred of women stems from a Norma/Norman Bates sexual abuse? His mother seemed extremely jealous of SW, to the point of not being natural but that of a jealous spurned lover. I wish former friends and gf's of CW's would speak up but I understand why they would not.

 

[Deleted member 182072]

This is a truly heartbreaking case. I’ve read a lot of the posts and may have missed it but do we know what NK job role was/is? I’m assuming she is still employed by them but that has got to be a difficult thing to go back to!

Welcome to Websleuths, TootsieBell.

 

[x_files]

I wonder if she had a different phone or computer in the interim that she used.. the next search for SW was Jan 2018 on the ‘disclosed’ phone...

Work computers? friends or parents or library computers?

 

[MsBetsy]

I'm sure this was discussed around the time of sentencing but I missed it. Was Jayme Watts, the sister, in the court room? Was she the bleach blonde heavy woman in the shiny green jacket and the chunky gold necklace sitting next to the lawyer?

Does anyone know if CW'S sister was in the court room during the sentencing? For some reason I have wondered what she looks like and thought she was the woman sitting next to the Watts lawyer who was sitting next to the parents. She also walked out with them. She was wearing a shiny green jacket and a gawdy necklace and had a bleached blonde eighties style hair cut. She is how I would imagine her looking and just wondered if anybody knew.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

Oil? Like salad oil, or oil from the oil tank?

Oil from the tanks, I assume from decomposition, there was no oil in her lungs.

 

[Layla123]

Because most likely their paths have crossed since they worked in the same industry. She knew what he looked like, what his job was, she wanted to check out the wife.

I guess I’m projecting here, but if it were me, I’d check out the one I was interested in, first.

 

[KathrynL]

I hadn't seen this. I notice CW is rocking with arms wrapped around his chest like we saw in media interviews.

 

[Layla123]

I wonder if she had a different phone or computer in the interim that she used.. the next search for SW was Jan 2018 on the ‘disclosed’ phone...

That thought just came to me. May well be.

 

[Ultra Violet]

It wasn't just wedding dresses, it was 'man marries mistress' as well, or wtte.

I almost thought this but remembered another search: marrying your mistress.

If that search was done around the time of the wedding dress search, then it looks more like the search is for herself.

Great points! Thank you! That will be an interesting detail to look into. I’ll check out the narrative of searches and see if that provides any relevant timing between the marrying your mistress and wedding dress searches.

We know there would probably not be any Double Wedding searches. That would be another “first” ruined. MOO!

 

[Thepoet]

But why just her and not him?

She saw him at work and was interested. She heard the name Shanann Watts, but didn't know if it was wife, sister, mother? Given CW's tendency to be quiet and remain in the background, it's not unlikely people at work didn't know a lot about him.

Let me say, I have a bad feeling, and serious doubts, about NK. I thought her a hero at first, but I started having a bad feeling early on. I believe there was more to the NK/CW relationship and to their plans than has been revealed. I also believe that a big motivation for the plea deal was CW to be the "shining" hero (in his twisted mind) protecting NK and her reputation. He takes the plea deal and stays silent. (ugh!) The "noble gesture". (again, ugh!)

 

[gitana1]

Was it ever established or verified that she looked Shanann up on 2017? I didn't see any comments on it in the Docs and no mention of it in the interview. Why wouldnt LE have confronted her with that?

What I saw specifically in the discovery was that she looked up CW in 8/17 and SW in 1/18. I keep seeing 9/17 on here and went with that but I didn't actually see that in the discovery docs.

I think she became aware of him last year, maybe when he began to look good, found out he was married, then googled his wife after still feeling interested, and they began to flirt or communicate from the beginning of the year.

It probably progressively got more intense and noticeable such that an employee mentioned seeing them around the water cooler in April.

I don't think they had that info at the time of the interview.

ETA:

I do see they wrote about an internet search NK did of SW in 9/17. That's on DISCOVERY PAGE 2082.

But they also have text records of searches on 8/17 and 1/18. DISCOVERY PAGE 1783.

She had been interested for a while.

 

[Jessthinkin]

But why just her and not him?

I think cuz he was the known quantity... she saw him at work, etc... she wanted info on the UNknown quantity, his wife... IMO

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

I guess I’m projecting here, but if it were me, I’d check out the one I was interested in, first.

She was able to check him out in person. Edited to add why she googled her is really irrelevant. The fact that she did google them means she did know they had children. I understand her motive for being deceptive in the interviews, not wanting to be known she was willing to engage in an affair with a married man with 2 young children. However, this is a quadruple homicide investigation and the truth is paramount to any of her personal concerns, yet she choose to be deceptive both in her initial media interview and to LE- that is the issue. Being deceptive is always going to bring scrutiny especially in a quadruple homicide investigation.

 

[Jessthinkin]

Oil? Like salad oil, or oil from the oil tank?

Bkack green oil from the tank...

 

[Thepoet]

Welcome! Interested in your theories

WELCOME Riolove77!

 

[opalonyx]

August 4: topics related to marrying your mistress

August 8: hours of wedding dress searches

Heartbreaking contrast to SW's searches around the same time. On August 9, SW got an ultrasound for Niko.

"Work on your marriage", indeed.

Edit: searches are around page 1911

 

[Thepoet]

But can you imagine? This is a man who took care of those kids. Knew them super well. I mean how you act that for years is beyond me. The narcissists and sociopaths I've seen in my work can put on an act but the moment no one is looking or as soon as they feel comfortable they're no longer putting their child first or adequately caring for their needs.

Not this guy. For four years he changed diapers, fed, bathed and dressed them, gave them their medicine, played games, snuggled, packed their supplies, wiped noses, consoled them, all the stuff a normal and bonded parent does.

Then he not only killed them but could calmly look at videos of them, knowing he will never see them alive again, and showed no remorse or grief of any kind.

None of us are ever going to understand this. Or be able to figure it out. Yet we will keep trying.

That "we will keep trying (to understand)", speaks well of us and society.