MO - Off-duty officer (Katlyn Alix) shot dead by on-duty officer (Nathaniel Hendren), Jan 2019

[Psychofcrime]

BBM: @Falcon500 could speak directly to this question as a VE/LEO, I believe. Falcon, did they follow standard protocol/procedure by driving her to the hospital themselves, or no? TIA for your help w/ this question!

Yes, and if there was nothing to hide in tox tests, why wouldn't they do a blood draw? At the least, it gives it the appearance of a cover up.

None of their story sounds believable.

 

[Betty P]

BBM: @Falcon500 could speak directly to this question as a VE/LEO, I believe. Falcon, did they follow standard protocol/procedure by driving her to the hospital themselves, or no? TIA for your help w/ this question!

I noticed in the linked article above about another officer (Thomas Zeigler) shooting a fellow officer. He also first attempted to take her to the hospital himself. Removed her from the bedroom where the shooting took place and put her in his car, but someone ended up calling EMS.

 

[Angela_Beckett]

Usually during RR people use to point at their head. IMO in this case they both were using their police vest, and were stupid enough to play and point to their covered chests. I know Officer Alix was off duty at the time, and yet I don’t see any other motive why she would be playing like that.

 

[GordianKnot]

I noticed in the linked article above about another officer (Thomas Zeigler) shooting a fellow officer. He also first attempted to take her to the hospital himself. Removed her from the bedroom where the shooting took place and put her in his car, but someone ended up calling EMS.

Thanks, Betty P! Given the info in that article you referenced, IMO, it would be really helpful to get Falcon's input on LE protocol.

As a firm believer in law & order, LE almost always gets the benefit of the doubt with me when it comes to judgment calls made in life-threatening situations requiring instantaneous, reflexive decision-making.

However, in this specific case, since @Falcon500 himself has stated the RRR story is implausible, NH should not be afforded any such benefit of the doubt. Every action NH took that night should be subjected to heavy scrutiny and a thorough review by an outside agency.

IMOHO.

 

[luvhockey]

That letter is political CYA, just to make clear that she will not get any backblow from this mess.

The whole thing is a cluster, because the entire protocol regarding officer involved shooting was not followed. It would be interesting to review the administrative policy regarding officer involved shootings for St. Louis. Of note, this is the link to the documents for SLPD policies, and apparently, there is no protocol for drug and alcohol test results by officer who shoots someone.
PowerDMS

Reading the various policies above is interesting reading.

I wanted to point out that I did not read any of the documents posted above. I opened the first document and stopped there. This link does not go to "SLPD" which is officially known at SLMPD (St Louis Metropolitan Police Dept.) The above link is for the StLCountyPD. They are 2 entirely separate entities. The shooting took place in St Louis City which is the jurisdiction of SLMPD.

<modsnip no rumors please>

ETA: The husband, being an officer may be keeping quiet in the media but I'm guessing he's had a lot to say to the state highway patrol investigators

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

$
[QUOTE="HerculeHolmes, post:
Would be interested in the text/call history between all parties involved.[/QUOTE]

RSBM

Ya, and when was this ‘game night’ meet up scheduled?

 

[buttonbaby]

Does anyone know which man in the funeral photos is her husband? <modsnipped rumor is not allowed here>Didn't they marry just this past October 2018?

 

[Betty P]

Thanks, Betty P! Given the info in that article you referenced, IMO, it would be really helpful to get Falcon's input on LE protocol.

As a firm believer in law & order, LE almost always gets the benefit of the doubt with me when it comes to judgment calls made in life-threatening situations requiring instantaneous, reflexive decision-making.

However, in this specific case, since @Falcon500 himself has stated the RRR story is implausible, NH should not be given any such benefit of the doubt. Every action NH took that night should be subjected to heavy scrutiny and a thorough review.

IMOHO.

Yes, it should be questioned, especially with today's med technology for EMS services.

That said, LE has done this in the past for innocent reasons. One famous case I can recall is John Lennon being taken to the hospital in a patrol car. I recall questioning that at the time, but in his case, it probably wouldn't have made much difference? IDK, JMO

EMS training, equipment, etc. is so much more advanced today, though.

 

[MassGuy]

Yes, it should be questioned, especially with today's med technology for EMS services.

That said, LE has done this in the past for innocent reasons. One famous case I can recall is John Lennon being taken to the hospital in a patrol car. I recall questioning that at the time, but in his case, it probably wouldn't have made much difference? IDK, JMO

EMS training, equipment, etc. is so much more advanced today, though.

Yeah, we’d need to know the specifics as to why they claim they decided to transport the victim themselves.

One thing is for sure though, removing her from the scene only muddied the waters.

There is now no independent verification of what the crime scene looked like immediately after the shooting, and her body placement.

That’s the last thing that investigators need.

 

[Betty P]

I wanted to point out that I did not read any of the documents posted above. I opened the first document and stopped there. This link does not go to "SLPD" which is officially known at SLMPD (St Louis Metropolitan Police Dept.) The above link is for the StLCountyPD. They are 2 entirely separate entities. The shooting took place in St Louis City which is the jurisdiction of SLMPD.

Another interesting tidbit. KA's parents have hired a very well known law firm. Not one word from the husband. Not one word on who the other PO was that was there and gave the statement about what happened. Rumor is KA was separated which would make sense on why parents hired the lawyer and nothing from the husband.

There are a few locals commenting here, but many probably aren't aware that St. Louis City is an exception to most regional governments. The city is a government entity unto itself and not part of St. Louis County or any county for that matter. Courts, law enforcement, everything is separate, right? Haven't lived there in many years.

 

[Seattle1]

I wanted to point out that I did not read any of the documents posted above. I opened the first document and stopped there. This link does not go to "SLPD" which is officially known at SLMPD (St Louis Metropolitan Police Dept.) The above link is for the StLCountyPD. They are 2 entirely separate entities. The shooting took place in St Louis City which is the jurisdiction of SLMPD.

Another interesting tidbit. KA's parents have hired a very well known law firm. Not one word from the husband. Not one word on who the other PO was that was there and gave the statement about what happened. Rumor is KA was separated which would make sense on why parents hired the lawyer and nothing from the husband.

The couple was just married 3 months ago, beautiful wedding as seen during KA's mom interview. I don't believe rumor of couple separated, but more likely that another LE Officer did not want to be named as person investigating his family in blue. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Wait a sec you just sparked a thought. He was on duty so would likely have been wearing a vest, right? I realize they’re not necessarily fully bulletproof, but I wonder how that information would affect the game (or perception of it). Huh. Food for thought.. (MOO/IMO).

That’s a really good thought, and one that I didn’t consider.

That would change things a bit, especially if they had a realistic expectation that a vest would stop the bullet.

It’s useless for some firearms, but is effective for others. It would depend on the specific weapon.

I just can’t believe that such a game, would involve two willing participants. But if you were to throw in drugs, a vest, and a reasonable expectation that a vest would be effective, then I would be more open minded.

This whole thing stinks.

 

[GordianKnot]

Yeah, we’d need to know the specifics as to why they claim they decided to transport the victim themselves.

One thing is for sure though, removing her from the scene only muddied the waters.

There is now no independent verification of what the crime scene looked like immediately after the shooting, and her body placement.

That’s the last thing that investigators need.

I understand what you are saying and I share many of your concerns.

However, I don't know about you, but I'm not a LEO.

@Falcon500 IS a VE/LEO and he has stated emphatically that it does not seem to be a difficult case to him.

So, the good news here is that perhaps you and I are worrying needlessly. All I'm (cautiously) suggesting.

I defer to the expertise of an experienced detective to know what investigators do and/or do not need as the last thing. JMO.

 

[Timekeeper65]

I am just guessing, but I assume that they believed that since they had a police car, they could have her to Emergency Room faster than an ambulance could arrive. Who knows.

Let me preface this and state I have much respect for LE.

Here’s another possible answer. No EMS witnesses. Extra time to get the “story” straight.

 

[Seattle1]

Here is some bare bones info to help get the fact sheet started, Em.
Facts listed may or may not be relevant to the crime:

KA and NH were both LEOs.
KA was 24 yoa.
NH is 29 yoa.
KA was married to another LEO.
NH is single.
The shooting took place at NH's place.
NH was on shift but out of district at the time of the shooting.
KA was off duty at the time of the shooting.
KA was shot in the chest.
NH has a black eye in his mugshot.
KA and NH knew each other prior to the shooting.
Both KA and NH served in the military. NH as a marine.
NH served a tour in Afghanistan.

NH partner, also 29, was present at the house at time of incident. (Allegedly heard shot, but did not see).

 

[muggles63]

I am not usually one for posting, but , I was looking on KA's obit and there is a condolence from NH. Surely he would not post on there

View Katlyn Alix's Obituary on stltoday.com and share memories

 

[MassGuy]

Let me preface this and state I have much respect for LE.

Here’s another possible answer. No EMS witnesses. Extra time to get the “story” straight.

Yeah, that’s what concerns me.

That third officer was conveniently outside the room when this happened, which in and of itself, doesn’t ring true.

If two people are playing Russian Roulette, you just walk away and let it happen?!

I don’t think so.

I am taking nothing at face value here, and if there is a more nefarious reason for something, that’s the way I’m leaning.

At best, you are looking at people who have no business being police officers.

At worst, you are looking at criminals.

 

[Psychofcrime]

There are a few locals commenting here, but many probably aren't aware that St. Louis City is an exception to most regional governments. The city is a government entity unto itself and not part of St. Louis County or any county for that matter. Courts, law enforcement, everything is separate, right? Haven't lived there in many years.

Completely separate. I live in the county, suburbs. I personally know some STL City policemen and they truly are upstanding valuable people and professional policemen. Thank God for their service because it is challenging job! But most in the area are aware of the problems with the police department. This event stinks to high heaven. I only wish the department would step up, do this investigation completely, thoroughly, and with transparency, no matter how ugly the true story is. Otherwise, they will continue to damage their own reputation. That is sad for their "good" cops. If it were me, I would want to get the he** out of there and head to another department.

 

[buttonbaby]

I am not usually one for posting, but , I was looking on KA's obit and there is a condolence from NH. Surely he would not post on there

View Katlyn Alix's Obituary on stltoday.com and share memories

WTH??? Truly, could that be him posting a condolence that reads, "Sorry Katlyn. I wish things didn't have to be this way."?

WHAT??????????

 

[GordianKnot]

Yeah, that’s what concerns me.

That third officer was conveniently outside the room when this happened, which in and of itself, doesn’t ring true.

If two people are playing Russian Roulette, you just walk away and let it happen?!

I don’t think so.

I am taking nothing at face value here, and if there is a more nefarious reason for something, that’s the way I’m leaning.

At best, you are looking at people who have no business being police officers.

At worst, you are looking at criminals.

BBM:

I am not going to jump straight to worst-case scenarios without knowing all the facts. JMO.

Again, we have time to let the investigation run its course.

I do not doubt that the detectives will be thorough. JMO.