GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #71

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mtnlites said:
I keep thinking about my own kids. I have a chronic illness and we've had to get the kids up early, or in the middle of the night, several times to make ER runs. Me on the backseat, or in the front, with a blanket over my head and a "ssshhhh, Mommy's sick" and the kids go right back to sleep in the vehicle. It doesn't take much to quiet them down.

This was their father driving the truck and he undoubtedly told them that everything was going to be okay, that they just needed to get mommy to the doctor. He was talking to a 3 and 4 year old here; kids are very trusting, especially when the grownups they love are telling them something. This ride wasn't necessarily filled with loud, terrified sobs. It may have just been two exhausted, confused, worried children leaning on each other and eventually falling back asleep. That doesn't make the ride less sad or scary.
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I don't believe that both girls were alive in the truck. In fact, I have many problems with this second confession, and there is some truth, but it is padded with inconsistencies and more lies. He may still be intentionally concealing something.

The girls used to become hysterical when their mother left them. Grandfather Rzucek said he once thought he'd get arrested when he was made to wait with them while she went to the bathroom because they were screaming so much for her. It was stated that when Chris picked them up from school, they would cry the whole way home. These girls couldn't talk to their mother all weekend, because Chris thought they'd have a "crying fest" if they were allowed to speak to her, and kept asking when she was going to be home.

Bella was also supposed to start school that day. The girls went to bed early and woke up early, so even though that was very early in the morning for them, I highly doubt they were falling asleep when their mother's corpse was in the truck at their feet covered in trash bags.

They would have been hysterical. They were in their nightclothes, they didn't have shoes on, and their mother was unresponsive in a trash bag. They weren't going to school, they were going to a weird field in the middle of nowhere. Bella did not say in her "soft, sweet voice" are you doing to do to me what you did to CeeCee" without Chris knowing what he told her in response. She would have been agitated, and freaked out. ANY child that age would have been.

We have to remember that we are dealing with a habitual liar who can't tell the truth to save his soul. He did not just get religion and become honest, and he has IMO not yet told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
 
Serena Angelique said:
I don't believe that both girls were alive in the truck. In fact, I have many problems with this second confession, and there is some truth, but it is padded with inconsistencies and more lies. He may still be intentionally concealing something.

The girls used to become hysterical when their mother left them. Grandfather Rzucek said he once thought he'd get arrested when he was made to wait with them while she went to the bathroom because they were screaming so much for her. It was stated that when Chris picked them up from school, they would cry the whole way home. These girls couldn't talk to their mother all weekend, because Chris thought they'd have a "crying fest" if they were allowed to speak to her, and kept asking when she was going to be home.

Bella was also supposed to start school that day. The girls went to bed early and woke up early, so even though that was very early in the morning for them, I highly doubt they were falling asleep when their mother's corpse was in the truck at their feet covered in trash bags.

They would have been hysterical. They were in their nightclothes, they didn't have shoes on, and their mother was unresponsive in a trash bag. They weren't going to school, they were going to a weird field in the middle of nowhere. Bella did not say in her "soft, sweet voice" are you doing to do to me what you did to CeeCee" without Chris knowing what he told her in response. She would have been agitated, and freaked out. ANY child that age would have been.

We have to remember that we are dealing with a habitual liar who can't tell the truth to save his soul. He did not just get religion and become honest, and he has IMO not yet told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
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I remember that he's a habitual liar. Trust me, I am not forgetting. However, I can also see this going either way. I'm not going to argue one way or the other since we don't know. Given what we know, you think it couldn't have happened that way. Given what we know, I think it could have. We may never know which one of us is "right" and, honestly, it's not an argument that I even care to win. If we all thought the exact same way then this wouldn't be a discussion. It would just be an echo chamber.
 
pocketaccent said:
Lol at 'unknown vintage'! and actually it is a good idea to check for expiration date. You want to be protected.

But would you do a complete research on the condoms to investigate when that someone used the condom last on his wife? I wonder what was NK's conclusion or plan of action based on her research. She figured one box of condoms was manufactured in late 2017 and another in early 2018. Bummer, they are not so old..I think she was obsessed with him just as much as he with her.
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Lol, no. Well, but wait. Maybe I'm missing something, but if NK had the thought that various things CW was telling her weren't adding up, I could sort of see her getting obsessed over something like the dates on those condoms.
 
Colorfuel said:
Lol, no. Well, but wait. Maybe I'm missing something, but if NK had the thought that various things CW was telling her weren't adding up, I could sort of see her getting obsessed over something like the dates on those condoms.
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Agreed. But all these flags sure didn’t stop her from wanting to have him keep sleeping over almost every night. I truly wonder what her thought process was since she is a resourceful online researcher and had clearly looked up SW on FB. Knowing she was pregnant, if we assume she did know, what was she thinking? It becomes more of an insidious game on her part to me (this relationship with CW) if she knew and didn’t tell him...strange. In no way saying she had any part in the murders...just wondering what her game was.
 
NUA did a livestream recently where she talked about choices. She mentioned that every emotion you choose to express is a choice and every relationship you are in is a choice. And she is choosing every day to try to be a better person. What a wise, strong woman. She is right. We all make choices.
 
The thing is, if you're messing around with a married man, you know in some recess of your mind that they're a cheater, and their trustworthiness is in question. I think NK was using CW for sex and in denial to one degree or another about his relationship with Shannan. People can convince themselves of all sorts of things, even in the face of facts (e.g. CW's parents and sister). Mistresses are no different. I've had friends who were told the most outlandish stories about why the guy couldn't get a divorce, and believed them, because they wanted to. Even though none of the stories made any sense at all. I put just as much blame on CW for game-playing as I do NK.

When you marry your mistress, the late Sir James Goldsmith once said, you create a job vacancy.
 
Best of What's Around said:
Agreed. But all these flags sure didn’t stop her from wanting to have him keep sleeping over almost every night. I truly wonder what her thought process was since she is a resourceful online researcher and had clearly looked up SW on FB. Knowing she was pregnant, if we assume she did know, what was she thinking? It becomes more of an insidious game on her part to me (this relationship with CW) if she knew and didn’t tell him...strange. In no way saying she had any part in the murders...just wondering what her game was.
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The psychology of wanting something you’re not sure you can have is really compelling for some people. As is winning over “the woman who has everything”, wiping that smile off her face, proving to yourself you can control what happens aroumd you, manipulating people just for sport, rescuing the poor misunderstood man ... We’ll never know her real motivation and she probably doesn’t know it herself.

I frankly wonder if NK would have been as hell-bent at having him if he wasn’t married and didn’t have kids. I don’t think she set out to break a family up, but she didn’t mind working towards it to get what (she thought) she wanted. And I do think she encouraged and manipulated him to get him to leave his family. IMO it’s all that mattered to her at the time. From what relatively little we know about her, it’s entirely possible had he left them her interest level would have waned quickly.

Of course he alone is responsible for murdering his family. But had she not placed herself in his path and refused to step aside graciously IMO they would still be alive. I am not an NK fan and frankly hope she is ashamed of herself. MOO of course.
 
Colorado303 said:
The psychology of wanting something you’re not sure you can have is really compelling for some people. As is winning over “the woman who has everything”, wiping that smile off her face, proving to yourself you can control what happens aroumd you, manipulating people just for sport, rescuing the poor misunderstood man ... We’ll never know her real motivation and she probably doesn’t know it herself.

I frankly wonder if NK would have been as hell-bent at having him if he wasn’t married and didn’t have kids. I don’t think she set out to break a family up, but she didn’t mind working towards it to get what (she thought) she wanted. And I do think she encouraged and manipulated him to get him to leave his family. IMO it’s all that mattered to her at the time. From what relatively little we know about her, it’s entirely possible had he left them her interest level would have waned quickly.

Of course he alone is responsible for murdering his family. But had she not placed herself in his path and refused to step aside graciously IMO they would still be alive. I am not an NK fan and frankly hope she is ashamed of herself. MOO of course.
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All excellent points!! I guess we don’t know enough about her dating background to know whether she would have lost interest quickly, but I suspect so. I suspect she is someone who needs a challenge to feel excited in a relationship...and CW offered zero excitement with his milk toast persona apart from his situation. The speed with which she deleted her searches, texts, and allegedly told CW to do the same leads me to believe she had a savvy for knowing when s*** might hit the fan that someone a little more ethical and innocent of game playing in the past would not have engaged in, at least that quickly. She sure got out of dodge quickly...think about it, she distanced herself completely from CW before the Thayers...and this is the great, nice guy she supposedly loved. Even (if we are to believe CW) testing him to make sure his phone wasn’t in the hands of police that Tuesday. She has a very suspicious mind me thinks.

CW, ever the sick fool. SW was by all accounts a genuine person who actually cared about people. That just does not seem to be the case when we take a closer look at NK. I guess little did NK know she was duping not just a family man but also a dangerous sociopath into believing she was the only answer to his problems.
 
Gardenista said:
These are some notes I took from NK's interviews

CW brings condoms to my house. One box is full and unopened, the second are condoms from a partially used box.

I asked CW he has a box of partially used condoms CW informs me that the condoms he has are from back when he was still having sex with his wife. He told me they have been sitting in a closet collecting dust and that SW probably didn't even know they were still there asked him why SW used to use condoms CW informed me that SW didn't like to get messy I was curious so I looked up the expiration date on the condoms and noticed that the unopened set expired in late 2022 in the open set expired in early 2023 based on my research I assume these condoms were manufactured in late 2017 in early 2018
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I just have to chime in - but how absolutely gross to bring an opened box of unused condoms over to NK's. Seriously? And she goes and plays detective regarding the expiration date to figure out if he is lying to her, but it apparently doesn't occur to her that this is just gross?

All JMO. Sorry!
 
Best of What's Around said:
Even (if we are to believe CW) testing him to make sure his phone wasn’t in the hands of police that Tuesday. She has a very suspicious mind me thinks.
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RSBBM
IIRC on Tuesday Shannan and the girls were still considered missing. NK may have thought it was Shannan texting her in the guise of CW.
 
Best of What's Around said:
Agreed. But all these flags sure didn’t stop her from wanting to have him keep sleeping over almost every night. I truly wonder what her thought process was since she is a resourceful online researcher and had clearly looked up SW on FB. Knowing she was pregnant, if we assume she did know, what was she thinking? It becomes more of an insidious game on her part to me (this relationship with CW) if she knew and didn’t tell him...strange. In no way saying she had any part in the murders...just wondering what her game was.
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Good points and I've also wondered what NK's game was. JMO, it appears in early June they were engaging in flirting at the office. In an email, she rebuffs him and tells him she wants to keep their friendship in the office.

And then there is some other communication, and another email, or perhaps it was a text, in which she is she is thanking him for his honesty and promises confidentiality.

There is no way, IMO, NK didn't view Shanann's FB. Shanann had already announced her pregnancy with Niko and was painting a picture of family bliss on FB.

IMO, either NK fell under his spell and bought into a lie that somehow explained his "situation", or she simply didn't care.
 
I kind of think that NK thought that CW was good looking. Since she was not really attractive maybe she fell into lust because a guy better looking then her was interested in her. NK was not ugly but not attractive either. For 30 years old, I thought she looked rough. She did not have the softness that Shanann had.

To me, NK was too masculine looking.
 
molly1255 said:
Good points and I've also wondered what NK's game was. JMO, it appears in early June they were engaging in flirting at the office. In an email, she rebuffs him and tells him she wants to keep their friendship in the office.

And then there is some other communication, and another email, or perhaps it was a text, in which she is she is thanking him for his honesty and promises confidentiality.

There is no way, IMO, NK didn't view Shanann's FB. Shanann had already announced her pregnancy with Niko and was painting a picture of family bliss on FB.

IMO, either NK fell under his spell and bought into a lie that somehow explained his "situation", or she simply didn't care.
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In reading the email exchange between them there is definitely NOT a rebuffing of CW at any point in that exchange. She is feeling him out and letting him know anything they say or do together will be kept secret. That is done only to encourage it to continue.

Reading between the lines, if anything it sounds like she is thanking him for being "honest" about letting her know that he's a married man and his wife got pregnant. That exchange is shortly after the facebook video announcement. The email exchange implies that they have been in contact and flirting together long before the email exchange. "Thanks Nikki, Have a great rest of your day!" Even though we never met or talked before? Ha, ha, yeah right.
 
La Louve said:
RSBBM
IIRC on Tuesday Shannan and the girls were still considered missing. NK may have thought it was Shannan texting her in the guise of CW.
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Possibly, but as LE pointed out to CW, the questions she was asking him were ones in which his wife would know the answer...like the name of his dog and what yoga studio he attended.
 
Best of What's Around said:
All excellent points!! I guess we don’t know enough about her dating background to know whether she would have lost interest quickly, but I suspect so. I suspect she is someone who needs a challenge to feel excited in a relationship...and CW offered zero excitement with his milk toast persona apart from his situation. The speed with which she deleted her searches, texts, and allegedly told CW to do the same leads me to believe she had a savvy for knowing when s*** might hit the fan that someone a little more ethical and innocent of game playing in the past would not have engaged in, at least that quickly. She sure got out of dodge quickly...think about it, she distanced herself completely from CW before the Thayers...and this is the great, nice guy she supposedly loved. Even (if we are to believe CW) testing him to make sure his phone wasn’t in the hands of police that Tuesday. She has a very suspicious mind me thinks.

CW, ever the sick fool. SW was by all accounts a genuine person who actually cared about people. That just does not seem to be the case when we take a closer look at NK. I guess little did NK know she was duping not just a family man but also a dangerous sociopath into believing she was the only answer to his problems.
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your post really hit a nerve for me.

shanann loved chris blindly. truly madly deeply.
she gave him a beautiful life filled with a magnificent home, a full family of sweet little girls and boys, holidays, family and friends on tap, uprooted her life so he could follow job security .

all she was guilty of was being amazing to him.
I hope he realises this one day.
what he destroyed and what he destroyed it for.
that is my only wish for him. to see this picture. and then live with that ...forever.
 
Best of What's Around said:
Possibly, but as LE pointed out to CW, the questions she was asking him were ones in which his wife would know the answer...like the name of his dog and what yoga studio he attended.
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I've read here that NK asked the name of her dog and what yoga studio she attended.

ETA has it ever been verified that CW went to yoga classes? He doesn't strike me as the type.
 
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