CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #2

[slowpoke]

Been following this story from UK for several days now. Saw some on here have commented/queried on her health state. I was just looking again at the KTNV report on YouTube, and the host in giving description details of Barbara adds she was "in good health".

I don't know what to think. We have all seen supposed 'crocodile tears' from killers who give TV interviews, and appear to break down as they speak, knowing full well what has happened. The husband here may well be the type who is not given to showing emotion, but looking at these interviews he appears both times to well up and rub his eyes, yet there appears no tears or even watery eyes look, so it is like it is faked. JMO. Not saying he is lying because that could of course be his usual demeanour. But it is sure odd all round.

It’s hard to know for sure if a cry is real or fake, just by the presence or lack of tears, as you said.

One reason for absence of tears flowing is dry eye syndrome. I’m fortunate not to have a severe case, but I do notice my eyes don’t tear up and run down my cheeks like they used to when I get emotional about something.

I’ll still have the same internal emotion as before, and my eyes sort of feel like they’re welling up—that feeling of pressure is there, but then there is very little tears that actually flow out now, sadly.

We don’t know if RT suffers from this or not, but just wanted to point this out as a real occurrence for many, especially as one gets older.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

I recall reading it took LE two hours to show up after being called. Maybe that was mistaken for him searching for two before calling.

Right, there are a lot of different versions of the times different things occurred that day, but I recall the same thing being said early on, IMO.

IIRC RT also said he did look for BT for about an hour before calling 911.

So if the 911 call was made at 3:26 pm according to dispatch records posted upthread, then she disappeared at around 2:30 pm.

And it took LE 2 hours to get there after he made the call to 911 (time needed to find RT in the middle of the unpopulated desert where he was pulled off to the side of a road, and not at a main intersection town, or attraction they could easily find mobilizing from the nearest station), so LE arrived on the scene of BT's disappearance at around 5:30 pm.

So by the time LE arrived, she had been missing already for 3 hours. Giving LE a couple hours of daylight before it got dark to interview RT and start to search.

JMO

 

[1&2&3]

Don’t know if this has been said. As we age, our tolerance to heat lowers. What BT could endure three months ago, may be too hot for her now and that is why she went a head of hubby. If that story is true.

Have the police indicated what they think happened to BT if they don’t believe she was abducted? That is a BIG statement! Sure to put a lot of pressure on RT.

 

[GordianKnot]

I'm nearby. Took the 40 and got to the kelbaker exit about 2pm today.
drove 35 miles up to past kelso depot and turned back.
There were no search vehicles parked, or any type of vehicle.
On the way back I saw two portapotties way back in a turnout I had missed.
I think this was the staging area. Lots of ATV tracks.
I took two photos, 1 looking east at the potties and 1 west at the rocks.
I think the reported search area was incorrect. There's nothing east.
My odometer read 6 miles from potty to freeway.
I walked to those rocks. The highway is lower than the terrain so walk in a hundred feet and it's gone. The photo towards the rocks, the road is there the other side of the brush.
It's easy to get disoriented. From the rocks a vehicle passing by sounds like the whoosh of the wind.

Thank you so much for taking these pictures! It's hugely helpful!

What jumps out at me is the the red port-a-potty or whatever it is in the distance.

Again, red really stands out against the monochromatic backdrop of that brown landscape.

I really believe that red hat she was reportedly wearing would be spotted if it was out there.

I don't think she's in their search location.

I wish we knew whether or not LE has any ping/gps/electronic tracking data or not.

JMO.

 

[10ofRods]

Have you ever done the old Route 66? That is a lot of fun. We love that area, but usually in January.

Yes. Love it. Much prefer Kingman, Seligman and Flagstaff (and Albuquerque) to the Mojave.

 

[castilloisno1]

Husband's daughter talked to MSM.

She basically parroted what RT said; namely, that abduction is the only scenario that makes sense.

To her and RT, at least.

LE clearly disagrees with their assessment.

JMO.

Thanks..so basically just the husband's side of the family have talked....not hers? Correct?

 

[Joe Friday]

I'm nearby. Took the 40 and got to the kelbaker exit about 2pm today.
drove 35 miles up to past kelso depot and turned back.
There were no search vehicles parked, or any type of vehicle.
On the way back I saw two portapotties way back in a turnout I had missed.
I think this was the staging area. Lots of ATV tracks.

SBM

Did you notice if there was cell phone reception where RT & BT were likely hiking and their camper would have been parked?

 

[GordianKnot]

Thanks..so basically just the husband's side of the family have talked....not hers? Correct?

Our VI here, @dbdb11, is a member of BT's family.

I don't know if any of her blood relatives have spoken to MSM, but he may know.

JMO.

 

[10ofRods]

I'm nearby. Took the 40 and got to the kelbaker exit about 2pm today.
drove 35 miles up to past kelso depot and turned back.
There were no search vehicles parked, or any type of vehicle.
On the way back I saw two portapotties way back in a turnout I had missed.
I think this was the staging area. Lots of ATV tracks.
I took two photos, 1 looking east at the potties and 1 west at the rocks.
I think the reported search area was incorrect. There's nothing east.
My odometer read 6 miles from potty to freeway.
I walked to those rocks. The highway is lower than the terrain so walk in a hundred feet and it's gone. The photo towards the rocks, the road is there the other side of the brush.
It's easy to get disoriented. From the rocks a vehicle passing by sounds like the whoosh of the wind.

Thank you so much for this.

I've been flying over the trail on google maps (the one I think they were on) and while the trail is kind of like a road at first, and pretty straight, on the way back, there is a small trail that comes into the main one - it would appear to be an intersection, I think, when walking back.

If she got lost, she may have taken a southward, smaller trail and then gone way too far in thinking she'd still come to the RV.

Not far from where you were, it looks like this from the sky:



I'm sure they've searched it but there's always that question raised here early on: how far can a person go (especially when a bit scared?) Someone posted the German family story from DV...I'm reading it again. It's a great read.

You can see the dry creek bed in your photo in the very upper left hand corner of my cut and paste. I'll try and post another one tomorrow.

 

[Sillybilly]

can possibities be discussed without accusing anyone of anything? last person to have seen her, whether victim or suspect, is a person of interest to the investigation. what are the rules for tiptoeing around this while still allowing the conversation to be useful relative to facts presented?

Hi dbdb11

The only persons Websleuths considers a POI / suspect is someone who has been officially named by LE to be either POI or suspect (or in the very odd case, where Tricia has approved discussion of someone who has not been so named .. a very infrequent exception).

Family and loved ones are certainly considered victims under this rule. Nothing could be worse than re-victimizing a victim who is genuinely grieving over the loss of a loved one.

Here's an excerpt from The Rules (linked in my signature) that hopefully will explain:

VICTIM FRIENDLY

Websleuths is a victim friendly forum. Attacking or bashing a victim is not allowed. Discussing victim behavior, good or bad is fine, but do so in a civil and constructive way, and only when such behavior is relevant to the case.

The "victim friendly" rule extends to the family members of victims and suspects. Sleuthing family members, friends, and others who have not been designated as suspects is not allowed. Don't make random accusations, suggest their involvement, nor bash and attack them. Posting their personal information, including names, addresses, and background data -- even if it is public -- is not allowed. That does not mean, however, that statements made by family members and other third parties cannot come into discussion as the facts of the case are reported in the media.

By WS standards, RT is considered a victim at this time. In other words, members may discuss what is said by him or about him in MSM, but direct accusations or insinuations that he is responsible for BT's disappearance are not allowed. That changes IF law enforcement officially says otherwise.

As a VI, you can provide information and you may make statements that do not have to be supported by links to MSM. It is up to members whether they agree with your statements or not.

Any more questions, let's take it off thread via private conversation.

Hope that helps.

 

[Sillybilly]

...
BTW they consider him the prime suspect according to Robert himself.

<rsbm>

By Websleuths standards RT is a victim.

We don't know that LE told him that he is a suspect or that he, like a lot of people, assume he is a suspect because he is the husband and as far as we know, the last person to see her.

By WS standards, he remains a victim until such time as LE officially indicates otherwise OR Websleuths owner, Tricia, makes an exception.

 

[PommyMommy]

SBCSD Colorado River Station on Twitter
July 22nd - The investigation continues into the whereabouts of missing person Barbara Thomas http://nixle.us/B74XA
8:41 PM - 22 Jul 2019

July 22nd - The investigation continues into the whereabouts of missing person Barbara Thomas from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle
UPDATE - Monday, July 22, 2019

The ongoing daily searches for Barbara Thomas in the Mohave National Preserve have been suspended. Additional searches will be conducted as any additional information is developed in the investigation.

Detectives from the Specialized Investigations Division have assumed the investigation as is standard department policy when a missing person has not been located.

The investigation is ongoing and anyone with information is asked to contact Detective Nicholas Clark, Specialized Investigations Division (909) 387-3589. Callers wishing to remain anonymous are urged to contact the We-Tip Hotline at 1-800-78-CRIME (27463) or www.wetip.com.

 

[iscaremyself]

SBM

Did you notice if there was cell phone reception where RT & BT were likely hiking and their camper would have been parked?

didn't try the phone but online maps was spotty

 

[dbdb11]

I'm nearby. Took the 40 and got to the kelbaker exit about 2pm today.
drove 35 miles up to past kelso depot and turned back.
There were no search vehicles parked, or any type of vehicle.
On the way back I saw two portapotties way back in a turnout I had missed.
I think this was the staging area. Lots of ATV tracks.
I took two photos, 1 looking east at the potties and 1 west at the rocks.
I think the reported search area was incorrect. There's nothing east.
My odometer read 6 miles from potty to freeway.
I walked to those rocks. The highway is lower than the terrain so walk in a hundred feet and it's gone. The photo towards the rocks, the road is there the other side of the brush.
It's easy to get disoriented. From the rocks a vehicle passing by sounds like the whoosh of the wind.

greatly appreciate you going there. imo this may be one of the most helpful posts yet in either thread.

whatd your instincts say being there? please please share

 

[PommyMommy]

JUL 22, 2019
Crews Suspend Daily Searches for 69-Year-Old Woman Who Vanished on Mojave Desert Hike
[...]

Although rescue crews have ceased daily searches, additional operations will be conducted when new information is learned in the investigation, authorities said.

On Sunday, rescuers ended their daily search early because of “extreme temperatures,” the Sheriff’s Department said.

No evidence of Barbara was located Sunday.

Rescuers have been using off-road vehicles, K-9 and aerial units and hikers to comb through the desert area, with temperatures routinely in the triple digits.

[...]

The investigation into her whereabouts is ongoing.

[...]

 

[slowpoke]

SBM

Did you notice if there was cell phone reception where RT & BT were likely hiking and their camper would have been parked?

There’s a site that Knox directed us to, Campendium, that has reviews of camping sites and includes ones in the Mojave National Preserve. I notice reviewers frequently speak of the cell phone coverage, and there’s even a graphic showing the signal bars for the different carriers.

I’m still unsure of the precise location iscaremyself and 10ofRods are looking at, so here’s the general link to all of the Preserve:

Mojave National Preserve Camping: 14 Campgrounds in Mojave National Preserve - Campendium

 

[iscaremyself]

Thank you so much for this.

I've been flying over the trail on google maps (the one I think they were on) and while the trail is kind of like a road at first, and pretty straight, on the way back, there is a small trail that comes into the main one - it would appear to be an intersection, I think, when walking back.

If she got lost, she may have taken a southward, smaller trail and then gone way too far in thinking she'd still come to the RV.

Not far from where you were, it looks like this from the sky:

View attachment 194493

I'm sure they've searched it but there's always that question raised here early on: how far can a 33

Thank you so much for this.

I've been flying over the trail on google maps (the one I think they were on) and while the trail is kind of like a road at first, and pretty straight, on the way back, there is a small trail that comes into the main one - it would appear to be an intersection, I think, when walking back.

If she got lost, she may have taken a southward, smaller trail and then gone way too far in thinking she'd still come to the RV.

Not far from where you were, it looks like this from the sky:

View attachment 194493

I'm sure they've searched it but there's always that question raised here early on: how far can a person go (especially when a bit scared?) Someone posted the German family story from DV...I'm reading it again. It's a great read.

You can see the dry creek bed in your photo in the very upper left hand corner of my cut and paste. I'll try and post another one tomorrow.

person go (especially when a bit scared?) Someone posted the German family story from DV...I'm reading it again. It's a great read.

You can see the dry creek bed in your photo in the very upper left hand corner of my cut and paste. I'll try and post another one tomorrow.

right..if your scared you can cover some distance but if you're disoriented you might think to climb up those rocks to maybe see the camper. Then the heat.. climb, get hot, duck in a shady crevasse and hope help comes to you.

 

[Micheline]

Family has said that she routinely wore bikini tops when walking in the desert. according to VI

Family or Robert?
I suppose she was not hiking in her bikini with her cousin or niece, so it must have been Robert telling them she would routinely do this.

 

[Dion]

If RT was busy taking pictures, I can understand him not noticing BT's whereabouts for a few minutes, but Barbara would know that she was all of a sudden alone, and surely would go back for him.

If she wanted to get back to the camper in a hurry for some reason, wouldn't she tell him, so that he wouldn't be worried?

Why didn't they yell out to each other if they were momentarily separated?

 

[wary]

Family or Robert?
I suppose she was not hiking in her bikini with her cousin or niece, so it must have been Robert telling them she would routinely do this.

Why would you suppose that?