Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #121

[tresir2012]

Sugarcane18 posted the Sgt Riley August interview in thread #111. A little after the 10 minute mark Sgt Riley states that there were close to a 1000 searchers and the crime scene was contaminated. I believe it is in the "Down the Hill" podcast where someone in LE (DA Ives or Superintendent Carter) is asked about the number of searchers and they state it wasn't anything like a 1000 and the crime scene wasn't that contaminated.
The interview:

I don't think they really know how many came out to search that first night as they didn't record anyone's details IMO. People came from miles away, from Flora and Lafayette and Delphi itself. It was certainly hundreds and could have been 1,000 easily.

 

[tresir2012]

I've been following this case since the week they were found, I'm not aware of any clothing found in that creek being linked to the crimes.

Take a look at the scanner thread around page 6. Also, it was mentioned in the recent podcast.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I don’t think think BG is a SK and I don’t think this was intelligently planned. If I’m wrong and BG is a serial killer then I’d say it was his first time and he’s been really lucky to have gotten away with it for so long. I just don’t think BG is a criminal mastermind with superior intellect.

My ideas are strongly influenced by a certain "poi", which might also be the wrong "poi". I would like to find contradicting facts re him, but have so far been unsuccessful in looking for them.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I think Ives confirmed they were killed where they were found and we have also heard previously they were killed within minutes of the BG picture being taken, so by 3.30 p.m. IMO.

I remember very well, BUT: is it still true?

 

[tresir2012]

I've been following this case since the week they were found, I'm not aware of any clothing found in that creek being linked to the crimes.

Take a look at the scanner thread around page 6. Also, it was mentioned in the recent podcast.

You know, that (as we all culturally are more moved by the cases we can identify with; human nature), and plus, it was a poorer neighborhood.

(However, at least one white man, a policeman, obviously, felt different. He tried to save the girls, he was injured. Why doesn’t anyone pay attention to it?)

In the beginning, Delphi case was destined to go the same way, drugs, meth, but the video, the audio, and finally, the incompetence of LE somewhat sensationalized it.

There were two LE and Gaylin herself who tried to help and one of the cops saved the life of the others yet were unable to get to the girls sadly. Smoke detectors weren't working either.

 

[tresir2012]

I remember very well, BUT: is it still true?

Well they said it so yes I guess? Also, the next couple on the bridge saw and heard nothing, also took pictures.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Snipped by me.

And this is interesting. Either DC wants to solve the case himself, or does not trust other investigators to pick up on the right tip, or simply, there might be difference of opinions between him and other investigators about the course of action, and maybe, even about the POIs?

When you give your personal email address, to me, it means that you want to control everything about the case, that you think your employees are not as good as you are, that for some reason, you are unwilling to delegate the responsibilities.

However, he is one, and a very busy, man. He can not oversee everything in that case. He might be simply tired. And then, it is always a team effort.

His own email means, that there is no team effort, or he is desperate.

I think, the information, DC is searching for, is so special/explosive (and DC knows!), that perhaps quite a few people wouldn't tell that corresponding name to an anonyme person on the general hotline. MOO
I for my part would be trusting only in DC.

 

[tresir2012]

Could the tenant of the other half, by any sheer coincidence, be Daniel Hite, the father of Logansport victims of 2018? Who died 3 hours after the fire?

I only have a rough idea but wasn't the other tenant related to the landlord ?
Sorry if getting too OT, so mods please delete if so. Perhaps someone could start a thread for these Flora girls? There is a lot to discuss on that IMO.

 

[tresir2012]

I think, the information, DC is searching for, is so special/explosive (and DC knows!), that perhaps quite a few people wouldn't tell that corresponding name to an anonyme person on the general hotline. MOO
I for my part would be trusting only in DC.

I think the tips are not coming because of fear of retaliation perhaps. Someone knows something. MOO.

 

[tresir2012]

In the rumor debunking video Kelsi stated that the girls were not all over town and the pings on multiple cell towers was due to the phone jumping between towers or cell tower strength issues. My question is if this was happening wouldn’t this strengthening/weakening of signal signal effect Snapchat’s post time? It does on my 2020 Snapchat.

The 2:07 time has always bugged me. Promise I’m not going on a Snapchat post time rant.

The girls' phones. Did Abby have a phone too? I thought it had been said she only had an iPad but I have heard mention of the girls phones plural quite often. Has this ever been confirmed that Abby had a phone too?

 

[tresir2012]

Id like to know when she said that. I didn’t hear it in any of the podcasts. I didn’t watch all the other news and other TV shows though. If she said and meant it, then they think it’s someone dead or in jail or otherwise incapacitated, right? I can’t think of another reason not to be worried.

It was in one of her James Renner interviews. She said something like if he is who he is he's not coming after me.

So good to see this thread still busy and welcome to new posters.

 

[Ozoner]

It was in one of her James Renner interviews. She said something like if he is who he is he's not coming after me.

So good to see this thread still busy and welcome to new posters.

I don't think BG has the balls to go after an adult woman, so I agree that she doesn't have to worry.
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I don't think that LE would share very much information about suspects with the victims' family members. Even if Kelsey has a particular suspect in mind, she may not be correct.

 

[Cutiekitty]

The girls' phones. Did Abby have a phone too? I thought it had been said she only had an iPad but I have heard mention of the girls phones plural quite often. Has this ever been confirmed that Abby had a phone too?

I didn’t say Abby had a phone. It is my understanding that she did not. Libby had a phone and they were together so pings of her phone to determine location would apply to Abby as well.

 

[Falling Down]

I think Ives confirmed they were killed where they were found and we have also heard previously they were killed within minutes of the BG picture being taken, so by 3.30 p.m. IMO.

Same here, I'd say 3:30-3:40.

JMO

 

[Falling Down]

Take a look at the scanner thread around page 6. Also, it was mentioned in the recent podcast.

I've heard the chatter, and listened to a few podcasts.

I've yet to read or hear anything definitive about clothing along the creek being linked to the crimes, maybe the shoe could be considered as such, but that's it.

 

[tresir2012]

I've heard the chatter, and listened to a few podcasts.

I've yet to read or hear anything definitive about clothing along the creek being linked to the crimes, maybe the shoe could be considered as such, but that's it.

Did you read the scanner? Check out pages 11 and 19. (My previous post mentioned page 6 incorrectly sorry). Also take a look at skibaboo's case map on page 1 of each thread.

ETA if you click on the map and enlarge it and look at the creek near the crime scene, keep enlarging it and you will see two icons in the creek. A pair of binoculars to indicate the searchers crossing the creek and a clothes hanger to indicate the exact location of the clothes found.

 

[tresir2012]

I didn’t say Abby had a phone. It is my understanding that she did not. Libby had a phone and they were together so pings of her phone to determine location would apply to Abby as well.

My understanding too. Sorry I didn't mean to infer you said but that I had heard it said. "but I have heard mention of the girls phones plural quite often" is what I said so I would like to see it confirmed really.

 

[JnRyan]

Same here, I'd say 3:30-3:40.

JMO

With Liberty's dad trying to call them by 3:11 and not getting an answer, I'm thinking it might have been even earlier. I know there is some discussion about the 2:07 snapchat photo, but I wonder if the encounter took place at possibly 2:30 or even a little before. If that is the case and the murders committed within 15-20 minutes, or less, the killer could have been on his way to his vehicle by 3:11. Using that timeline, the killer could have been driving by 3:30 and on his way out of the area.

Have we ever heard of a definitive time frame that Liberty started the video?

 

[Charlot123]

I think, the information, DC is searching for, is so special/explosive (and DC knows!), that perhaps quite a few people wouldn't tell that corresponding name to an anonyme person on the general hotline. MOO
I for my part would be trusting only in DC.

Maybe they trust in no one, that is the issue.
And the main thing is, people have own families/kids. They may be scared to get out on the street, but they have seen what had been done to others’ kids, and they want their own to grow into adults.

The best that can be done if the information is “explosive” would be moving people into witness protection program. But not everyone is ready to relocate, change the names, uproot their families. I think it is that simple. They are angry with the murderer, but fear overweights.

 

[Charlot123]

I always thought from the photo that it looked like a hat that had flaps on the side of it

Me too, but think of this. The person probably did not shave his head like JP did. If so, he needed something sitting deep enough to cover the hair. The color, the shape, or bald pate would have been remembered by the witnesses. I have seen overseas hats with flaps on the sides and the back, but the main thing, I think the top part is wedged. This is why I thought about a pilot hat to start with.

My theory still is, either a military brat or the collector of old army stuff. Maybe including knives or whatever he used. I remember when they were looking for DN, they spoke about a machete. I have no clue about machetes, but I’d look at collectors’ cold weapons.