Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #45

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I have to go pick up my husbands medications and decided tomorrow is the day. It's been really hot here, but tomorrow is much cooler so I can wear a sweatshirt, my "mask" and long pants. So, have a list since the pharmacy is in the grocery store. I don't sleep well at all now..and even worse when I know I have to go out the next day. I'm hoping the store has what I need. It's a smaller store.
 
So I "went to the doctor" yesterday. I have been putting off calling to see if I could treat myself at home--no COVID symptoms, just seasonal allergies, sinus. But my nose and eyes have been itching off my face and I'm having nosebleeds the sinus pressure has built up so much. After doing weeks of salt water rinses, Neti Pot, Zyrtec, Tylenol Sinus, hot compresses, humidifier, you-name-it, I gave in and called. Turns out I did not have to go in. Nurse had me calculate my temp, weight, BP, and pulse right here in my own home. The Doc called me within 3 mins of finishing my vitals/questions. The questions were interesting:
  • Of course, have you had any virus symptoms (fever, cough, etc.).
  • Have you been out of the state recently?
  • Have you been to church?
  • Have you been to any social gatherings?
  • Have you been exposed to anyone who's tested positive?
All in all, it was the best and easiest Dr's appt. I've ever had! And now am on antibiotic, Prednisone, and Flonase. Feeling a little better already and looking forward to not scratching my eyes out the next few weeks.

That is awesome-- i had a tele-conference with a physician yesterday thru
Ascensiononlinecare.org--paid 59.00-- i think this will be a very popular way
to communicate with docs, especially in light of how this pandemic is changing
our lives
 
There's now study going on to see if California already had episodes of CoVid as early as November, maybe even October. University hospital labs often keep reference swabs on a random basis, when things like strep were tested for back then, but now they can run them to see if the CoVid sequence is there.

It's interesting because it would be really weird if California's ability to "flatten the curve" had at least one new component (some people with immunity).

My daughter and family were SO sick in January. We all thought it was odd that it first seemed to be bad respiratory virus, then also GI symptoms, then they got a little better, then they got really sick again and very healthy SiL had to be treated for pneumonia. The 5 year old, who we had at our house while parents recuperated, had sniffles, a low fever and then was fine. Daughter's temp was 103-104 and then would go down to 100, making her optimistic, then back up again. It was awful.

We await the antibody test eagerly.
 
I thought it was 72 hours on surfaces but only from my memory? Only 1 day on some surfaces. Will have to gen up on it again.

ETA remembering that some posters leave shopping outside for a few days.

It depends on the surface. “Hard surfaces”, such as stainless steel, are more of a concern and can retain the virus longer, as opposed to cardboard, fabric, etc., iirc from Dr. Birx speech and other sources. Moo

There are some reports and articles out there about this to google. Imo I’ve noticed that some of these reports vary.

ETA:
Michigan doctor says leave groceries outside for 3 days if possible, shows how to disinfect

ETA2: @Reasonable & Just , the above is actually the “glitter” article. You may want to review it in context as we discussed earlier:

“VanWingen’s approach lands on the side of using an abundance of caution when it comes to bringing items inside your home.

“Imagine that your groceries are covered in glitter, and your goal at the end of this is to not have any glitter in your house, on your hands or, especially, on your face,” VanWingen said. “Imagine that disinfectants and soap have the power to dissolve that glitter.”

The National Institute of Health reports that coronavirus can live in air for three hours, on cardboard for one day, and on plastic and metal surfaces for three days.

The best way to keep the “glitter” out of your home is to leave groceries outside (on the back porch or in the garage) for three days if possible, VanWingen said. If that’s not possible, he adapted a surgical sterilization technique for use on groceries.“

Yuk
 
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Today's video from dr. Campbell. He speaks to his opinions on many things we have been discussing the last 24 hours on the thread.

He talks about his opinion on how World Health Organization got it wrong and understands why Trump said what he did about who being China Centric, he talks about his opinions on why Africans Americans are more susceptible and why, he talks about vitamin D, he talks about Boris being on oxygen, and the difference between ECMO vs. Ventilation vs. CPAP, he talks about an entire Village in Italy that is doing testing on every single person near Rome and has closed down their border to the village completely to do these tests, he talks about a randomized antibody test project that is being done in the United Kingdom, which is like test that they do random for elections, to figure out how many people have been infected. And so much more that we have been discussing daily. He always tries each day to discuss what has been in the news the previous day. For those that don't know about dr. Campbell, and are new to the thread , many of us have been following him since thread number 2.


i really like listening to his broacasts. Thank you so much for making them available to see here.
 
There's now study going on to see if California already had episodes of CoVid as early as November, maybe even October. University hospital labs often keep reference swabs on a random basis, when things like strep were tested for back then, but now they can run them to see if the CoVid sequence is there.

It's interesting because it would be really weird if California's ability to "flatten the curve" had at least one new component (some people with immunity).

My daughter and family were SO sick in January. We all thought it was odd that it first seemed to be bad respiratory virus, then also GI symptoms, then they got a little better, then they got really sick again and very healthy SiL had to be treated for pneumonia. The 5 year old, who we had at our house while parents recuperated, had sniffles, a low fever and then was fine. Daughter's temp was 103-104 and then would go down to 100, making her optimistic, then back up again. It was awful.

We await the antibody test eagerly.
That does raise an interesting situation, doesn't it? I would guess that the greatest international travel would be between China and CA. Do you know? So they never got tested back then, right? Are you saying that they have talked to their healthcare providers, about being tested for antibodies?
How hard is that anyway?
 
In these dark scary times my hubby and I do have plenty of needed every day items. Plus my large pantry stays stocked, and this was way before the pandemic.

As an aside:

Before my hubby, and I married over 36 years ago I explained to him the one chore I really hated to do, and that was grocery shopping. He quickly told me he would do the grocery shopping, and he's kept that commitment/promise since the day we married. :)

He is a fantastic grocery shopper too. He often gets me new items to try which I really enjoy.

So we have three large freezers stocked with all types of meats, seafood, and frozen veggies, etc.

The only thing he's ever bought in large quantities is TP, PTs, cleaning supplies, and paper plates since we had many family get togethers before socially distancing which we have been doing for almost a month now. Thank goodness having all of these items already on hand has helped immensely, so much so we have been able to share many of the items with our family, and next door neighbors.

So we could make it for a long time on just what we have on hand now.

Of course he still has to go get milk, bread or something else that expires in a short period of time. Also go to the pharmacy drive thru. They have been great in our area. You can ask them for other shelf items when picking up a prescription, and they will go get it for you, and bring it to the drive thru.

Jmho
 
It depends on the surface. “Hard surfaces”, such as stainless steel, are more of a concern and can retain the virus longer, as opposed to cardboard, fabric, etc., iirc from Dr. Birx speech and other sources. Moo

There are some reports and articles out there about this to google. Imo I’ve noticed that some of these reports vary.

and we had those reports of 7 days on surgical masks.
 
My daughter and family were SO sick in January
Same. Mine hit me on New Year's Eve Day. I had Christmas with my husband's side of the family the Saturday after Christmas. Two people that came in from Florida were sick. They were not as sick as I was while I was there. I don't know if they were just getting over it, or they got worse later or they just didn't get bad.

I had:
The worst ongoing headache I've ever had. At least 14 days.
Same for sore throat. I even spit in a cup at times so that I didn't have to swallow.
Horrible pink eye in both eyes for 48 hours. Mucus and a more runny substance (not tears but thicker).
Heavy heavy chest. Had to "sleep" sitting straight up downstairs on the couch. Any bit of reclining caused breathing problems big time.
Lost all sense of taste and smell (that wasn't at the beginning, that was about 3-4 days in).
Low fever. 99.8.

I still have a small sore throat --4 months later. Like a 2 or 3 on a scale to 10. And a cough. And my left ear is still popping and clicking and fills up once in a while.

So, some symptoms fit, but others don't like having such a low fever.
 
Same. Mine hit me on New Year's Eve Day. I had Christmas with my husband's side of the family the Saturday after Christmas. Two people that came in from Florida were sick. They were not as sick as I was while I was there. I don't know if they were just getting over it, or they got worse later or they just didn't get bad.

I had:
The worst ongoing headache I've ever had. At least 14 days.
Same for sore throat. I even spit in a cup at times so that I didn't have to swallow.
Horrible pink eye in both eyes for 48 hours. Mucus and a more runny substance (not tears but thicker).
Heavy heavy chest. Had to "sleep" sitting straight up downstairs on the couch. Any bit of reclining caused breathing problems big time.
Lost all sense of taste and smell (that wasn't at the beginning, that was about 3-4 days in).
Low fever. 99.8.

I still have a small sore throat --4 months later. Like a 2 or 3 on a scale to 10. And a cough. And my left ear is still popping and clicking and fills up once in a while.

So, some symptoms fit, but others don't like having such a low fever.

A lot of matching symptoms, moo

Not saying it’s CV of course, but some things really stand out - pink eye, loss of taste and smell, as well as the other things you mentioned, headache, cough, heavy chest and trouble breathing, runny tears (I posted about this yesterday actually, runny tears).

Does influenza ever cause conjunctivitis, etc?

I hope you get to feeling better.

Again the first case was traced back to November 17th in China. This tells me it’s likely been circulating a while.

In Harley Dilly’s thread on Dec. 20, @Bravo said she had pneumonia, and I said “wow, you are the fifth person I know that has pneumonia right now”.

Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

But if China had it in November, then chances are good IMO it was in the States circulating by December and January. JMO.

Of course, again, not saying it’s CV Shelby1, the only way to know would be to get tested of course.
 
Same. Mine hit me on New Year's Eve Day. I had Christmas with my husband's side of the family the Saturday after Christmas. Two people that came in from Florida were sick. They were not as sick as I was while I was there. I don't know if they were just getting over it, or they got worse later or they just didn't get bad.

I had:
The worst ongoing headache I've ever had. At least 14 days.
Same for sore throat. I even spit in a cup at times so that I didn't have to swallow.
Horrible pink eye in both eyes for 48 hours. Mucus and a more runny substance (not tears but thicker).
Heavy heavy chest. Had to "sleep" sitting straight up downstairs on the couch. Any bit of reclining caused breathing problems big time.
Lost all sense of taste and smell (that wasn't at the beginning, that was about 3-4 days in).
Low fever. 99.8.

I still have a small sore throat --4 months later. Like a 2 or 3 on a scale to 10. And a cough. And my left ear is still popping and clicking and fills up once in a while.

So, some symptoms fit, but others don't like having such a low fever.

I know several people that were extremely sick in January here (southern indiana). Never got a diagnosis. But if it was covid 19 something has to have changed. It wasnt like wildfire then. Jmo
 
There's now study going on to see if California already had episodes of CoVid as early as November, maybe even October. University hospital labs often keep reference swabs on a random basis, when things like strep were tested for back then, but now they can run them to see if the CoVid sequence is there.

It's interesting because it would be really weird if California's ability to "flatten the curve" had at least one new component (some people with immunity).

My daughter and family were SO sick in January. We all thought it was odd that it first seemed to be bad respiratory virus, then also GI symptoms, then they got a little better, then they got really sick again and very healthy SiL had to be treated for pneumonia. The 5 year old, who we had at our house while parents recuperated, had sniffles, a low fever and then was fine. Daughter's temp was 103-104 and then would go down to 100, making her optimistic, then back up again. It was awful.

We await the antibody test eagerly.

We had a similar experience in late December/early January with my college-aged daughter. We traveled to our vacation home in Montana in mid-December and within hours of our arrival, she became very ill (nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, slight fever, loss of sense of smell and taste). It hit her like a hammer. At first we thought she'd experienced food poisoning from something she ate on the road trip, but she had the fever which likely indicated something else. She was very sick like that for almost two weeks, surviving on Gatorade over ice the first few days (because she could not keep anything else down) and then chicken broth and dry toast the rest of the time until she started feeling better after a couple weeks.

She lost 13 lbs in the first four days and I took her to an urgent clinic the fifth. They tested blood and major organs and concluded she had a very bad virus that the doc said many had been experiencing in the area. I thought that odd since she became ill immediately upon our arrival and the last stop we had made on our trip was two and a half hours before arriving to the area. The doc prescribed anti-nausea medication which helped to substantially reduce the vomiting, although she still had no appetite for over a week after that.

Neither my husband nor I became ill, although we did experience frequent headaches at the time, which I attributed to stress over my daughter's condition. In addition to the frequent doses of Excedrin we were both taking, I did insist that we take a gram of Vitamin C each day to help our bodies fend off getting whatever infection she had. And, I was heavily disinfecting bathrooms, the kitchen, doorknobs, and light switches while my daughter was sick.

My daughter finally started feeling better on New Year's Eve and we traveled back home to Washington the next day. Although she still felt a little fragile after having been so sick, she returned to the university here in Seattle on January 6.

The end of that first week back at school, she started experiencing extreme fatigue, inability to concentrate - she described it as sometimes feeling "delirious," and what she described as "an elephant sitting on my chest" whenever she exerted herself (walking to/from classes from her nearby apt - a 15-20 minute walk). She had no cough and no sore throat. When my daughter reported her symptoms to me, I was concerned about pneumonia as a secondary infection after her having been sick in December. I picked her up and took her to an urgent care clinic again to check for pneumonia. They checked vitals (no fever, her oxygen level was fine), took blood for tests, did a finger prick blood test for anemia, and listened to her breathe, front and back, but did not do x-rays. Oddly, the nurse practitioner concluded that she may have suffered muscle tension by her study position upon returning to school and recommended that she do yoga exercises and continue to monitor her symptoms and to return for a chest x-ray if her symptoms did not improve. Over the next couple of weeks, she did the exercises and began to feel better and is fine now.

While at school, my daughter lives in a small studio apartment nearby campus that is almost exclusively occupied by international students from China, most of whom returned from winter break wearing masks whenever outside.

We also eagerly await the antibody test.
 
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That does raise an interesting situation, doesn't it? I would guess that the greatest international travel would be between China and CA. Do you know? So they never got tested back then, right? Are you saying that they have talked to their healthcare providers, about being tested for antibodies?
How hard is that anyway?

Right - they were never tested. She is a nurse and although she works in a private practice, she saw lots of people with "colds" who had been traveling. Wait - now that I think about it, I KNOW who went to China - her brother in law and nephew! He got sick too, but not as bad as my daughter and husband. His wife also got it.

We have no viable antibody test available. Stanford has gotten one going, but not in mass production yet. I think they say 3-4 weeks as it's not the top priority right now.

So, if true, my granddaughter and nephew were in school right up until popping low temps. Yikes.

I'll see if my daughter can get Public Health to test her, if she gives them the travel connection. But does the regular test pick up antibodies? Or just live virus? I don't even know, since it wasn't personally relevant - yet.
 
I know several people that were extremely sick in January here (southern indiana). Never got a diagnosis. But if it was covid 19 something has to have changed. It wasnt like wildfire then. Jmo

That’s one thing that I really ponder.

If it was around earlier, then how come we haven’t heard of hospitals getting overwhelmed back then...unless they assumed it was Influenza—Dr.LW was experienced with SARS so it was hinky for him, in fact his first words in the chat with his colleagues were “SARS is back”.

Imo it’s possible that perhaps postmortem examinations may infact reveal that CV was present in some patients earlier, IDK. I wonder what Dr. Mike and Dr. Maria would say about this post. They might totally discount that theory, idk.

Whatever the case we KNOW how highly contagious this, and see how quickly it moved around the world, so if it was around in November in China...

Idk I think about this a lot.

I’m sure scientists are going back and reviewing previous pneumonia and influenza reports.

Due to its level of contagiousness, why would it be isolated in November only to suddenly blow up later.

My bottom dollar says it was here in December. Again, no proof as to that but logically looking at the facts I don’t know how it wouldn’t have spread by that time considering how infectious it is.

Maybe there was a rapid mutation in severity, idk...

I’d really like to learn more about the November 17th case. So far I’ve come across this, but maybe there’s more.
Or not, as we know China tried to suppress information about the virus initially.

China’s first confirmed Covid-19 case traced back to November 17

—-

Here’s another thing. I’m not even sure the Wuhan market is the only and original source, and early on Dr. Mike said the same thing. We know surfaces at the market tested positive. There are other markets, including one which another man visited, and was then diagnosed in Japan. He had not visited that other market.

Dr. Sylvie said they were tracing the animals at the market, etc but I haven’t much more about the “source” lately.
 
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Same. Mine hit me on New Year's Eve Day. I had Christmas with my husband's side of the family the Saturday after Christmas. Two people that came in from Florida were sick. They were not as sick as I was while I was there. I don't know if they were just getting over it, or they got worse later or they just didn't get bad.

I had:
The worst ongoing headache I've ever had. At least 14 days.
Same for sore throat. I even spit in a cup at times so that I didn't have to swallow.
Horrible pink eye in both eyes for 48 hours. Mucus and a more runny substance (not tears but thicker).
Heavy heavy chest. Had to "sleep" sitting straight up downstairs on the couch. Any bit of reclining caused breathing problems big time.
Lost all sense of taste and smell (that wasn't at the beginning, that was about 3-4 days in).
Low fever. 99.8.

I still have a small sore throat --4 months later. Like a 2 or 3 on a scale to 10. And a cough. And my left ear is still popping and clicking and fills up once in a while.

So, some symptoms fit, but others don't like having such a low fever.

I had pink eye in one eye in late March. Never had it before, unless I had it as a child and don't remember. I thought maybe pollen was irritating my eyes and rinsed with distilled water for a while, then thought I might have a stye. The whites of my eyes didn't ever get very pink. I sent a message and photos to my doctor, and she faxed a prescription for erythromycin eye gel to my pharmacy. I used it every 6 hours for 5 days and my eye cleared up. So...I guess that means it was bacterial.

I have had loss of taste and smell with flu and other bad respiratory viruses in the past. And I often get some asthma with such infections--this started when I was a child and manifested as nighttime coughing. I'm old so there were no medicines I could take in those days. Now I have an inhaler I use when that happens. Have never had a serious bout with asthma, thankfully.
 
I know several people that were extremely sick in January here (southern indiana). Never got a diagnosis. But if it was covid 19 something has to have changed. It wasnt like wildfire then. Jmo

Yes - my thought too. The thing my daughter had did hit her sister (more mild) and husband (barely sick). All of these people I'm describing are under 40 - so perhaps it did sweep through their crowd but was viewed as minor. They didn't want us coming in the house (I'm usually cavalier about viruses).

The thing is, there's the issue of viral loading. I don't want to give too much personal information, but my daughter and husband definitely spent time with the returnees from China (in fact, so did I - I was with one of them in the third week of January for a party and sat a table with him - two weeks later, my email shows I was out of work with a fever - it was only 99.8 so I almost felt like I was fibbing about it, but I didn't feel well).

Viral loading refers to how much virus is in the air. One sneeze an hour before you walk in a large classroom - not such a big deal. A bunch of sneezes in a small living room - much more like wildfire. Hotel and apartment lobbies, that kind of thing, can be viral pumps. My daughter saw her BiL in circumstances that, if he was shedding and his son was shedding, the viral load would have been really high.

Now I'm really hoping and praying we find they did have it, at least, and have antibodies.
 
I had pink eye in one eye in late March. Never had it before, unless I had it as a child and don't remember. I thought maybe pollen was irritating my eyes and rinsed with distilled water for a while, then thought I might have a stye. The whites of my eyes didn't ever get very pink. I sent a message and photos to my doctor, and she faxed a prescription for erythromycin eye gel to my pharmacy. I used it every 6 hours for 5 days and my eye cleared up. So...I guess that means it was bacterial.

I have had loss of taste and smell with flu and other bad respiratory viruses in the past. And I often get some asthma with such infections--this started when I was a child and manifested as nighttime coughing. I'm old so there were no medicines I could take in those days. Now I have an inhaler I use when that happens. Have never had a serious bout with asthma, thankfully.

OH! You reminded me - yes, I had conjunctivitis at the same time as my temperature spiked. And it wasn't a regular kind at all, the rims of my eyelids were so red that I was embarrassed about it when I went back to work (I actually dug out an eye pencil to cover it). I had a prescription already, so just used that. Mine was a steroid Rx for eyes.

We should be out in the streets demanding an antibody test - which would do more to fix the economic ails than any other measure, other than a vaccine or outright cure.
 
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