Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #2

[Dre]

Ughhh who burns children??? That’s so heartbreaking!! I too would assume the border would be closed due to covid, but 3 hours is not that far if your future depended on it, I could see where someone would hope that the connection wouldn’t be made or that jurisdiction would get in the way.

<modsnip: No MSM to substantiate reason for the fractured leg>

 

[nyvictoria]

From the article:

According to members of the search party, a Christmas gift bag with one of the boys name’s on it, as well as clothing items were found during the search. The community members say the items were taken to police for further analysis. The California City Police Department has not confirmed that they have been given items found Saturday, and it’s still unclear how the found items ended up in the desert near the home.

BBM
Aren’t items, which could be potential evidence, supposed to be photographed in place and picked up by LE? Community members handling items could contaminate evidence.

 

[TTF14]

BBM
Aren’t items, which could be potential evidence, supposed to be photographed in place and picked up by LE? Community members handling items could contaminate evidence.

The police probably arrived on the scene and took the items themselves.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

While looking for the article and my post about the kern secret witness program - there’s only one article where they listed the website link in addition to the call line. I posted it when it first came out but it might be in thread #1.
Anyways, I found this while rereading the articles. I must have missed it if someone posted but I find it interesting about the pictures. I don’t recall reading where the pictures were specifically mentioned as potential evidence.

Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department says foul play is suspected, right now. He says they're waiting for findings of the pictures and items from the house, that were taken to Bakersfield for further investigation.
Cal City community members ask dirt bike riders to look for missing boys

 

[PommyMommy]

BBM
Aren’t items, which could be potential evidence, supposed to be photographed in place and picked up by LE? Community members handling items could contaminate evidence.

Yes, and I would be very surprised if that's not exactly how the evidence was collected since LE was involved in the search. See photo below. Looks like the officer has a camera. MOO


Source: California City search party find items that may be related to missing boys - YouTube

 

[imstilla.grandma]

The police probably arrived on the scene and took the items themselves.

In the videos I watched, horns were being honked when searchers found items and Walker was walking around checking the lead out. There were so many shrubs or idk, maybe bushes, sage?, that would definitely catch plastic bags and such flying in the wind.

 

[PommyMommy]

While looking for the article and my post about the kern secret witness program - there’s only one article where they listed the website link in addition to the call line. I posted it when it first came out but it might be in thread #1.
Anyways, I found this while rereading the articles. I must have missed it if someone posted but I find it interesting about the pictures. I don’t recall reading where the pictures were specifically mentioned as potential evidence.

Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department says foul play is suspected, right now. He says they're waiting for findings of the pictures and items from the house, that were taken to Bakersfield for further investigation.
Cal City community members ask dirt bike riders to look for missing boys

BBM I thought he was talking about the photos LE took during the second search of the home. MOO

DEC 29, 2020
California City Police Chief says case of missing boys is still an active investigation | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Tuesday afternoon, the California City Police Department was assisted by a Bakersfield Crime Scene Unit in serving a search warrant at the California City house where four-year-old Orrin and three-year-old Orson West were last seen.

Investigators were seen taking pictures outside the house and going in and out of the house. Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department says police are taking bags filled with items from the house to Bakersfield, for further investigation.

[...]

 

[imstilla.grandma]

BBM I thought he was talking about the photos LE took during the second search of the home. MOO

DEC 29, 2020
California City Police Chief says case of missing boys is still an active investigation | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Tuesday afternoon, the California City Police Department was assisted by a Bakersfield Crime Scene Unit in serving a search warrant at the California City house where four-year-old Orrin and three-year-old Orson West were last seen.

Investigators were seen taking pictures outside the house and going in and out of the house. Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department says police are taking bags filled with items from the house to Bakersfield, for further investigation.

[...]

Gracias. I’m afraid I’m running low on common sense as usual in helpless children’s cases. I know better. Is Bakersfield PD taking lead? I also hadn’t noticed before they took the evidence to Bakersfield.

 

[Knox]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> If he had a fractured leg at the time of his disappearance, I'm confident it would have been mentioned by LE. The fracture is listed similar to dental records. It would be used for identification purposes if necessary, IMO.

I think the items found yesterday have an explanation which is unrelated to the boys disappearance.

 

[Luckyzmom]

I believe that Bakersfield has so many more resources than CCPD they work together often. And FBI is a world of difference in technology and resources outside of a small community PD.
Prayers for these little guys to be found soon. MOO.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

About – Kern Secret Witness
[...]

History of Kern Secret Witness Program

The Kern Secret Witness Program was formed as a public benefit, non-profit corporation in 1982. It is a collaborative effort between law enforcement and the community to involve the public in the criminal justice system by removing the fear of reprisal for assisting law enforcement. This is guaranteed by ensuring that those who provide information will never be identified by the Secret Witness Program.

Rewards are available for those who provide information that leads to the arrest and conviction of suspected persons. This program is administered by the Secret Witness Board of Directors, and all funding for the program comes from public donations.

The Bakersfield Police Department and Kern County Sheriff’s Department support the Secret Witness program and recognize it as a valuable tool to help solve crimes and apprehend wanted persons.

How The Program Works

The Kern Secret Witness Program relies on anonymous tips from community members. Secret Witness maintains a 24-hour hotline to receive information provided by community members. The information may be in response to a law enforcement agency’s request for assistance on unsolved crimes or unsolicited information about a crime or wanted person.

If information provided proves to be worthwhile, the caller – who is given a code name and number at the time of their initial call – is asked to re-contact the hotline to arrange for collection of the reward. The hotline documents all information received and faxes it to the appropriate law enforcement agency for follow-up. Information that is used to successfully solve a crime or locate a wanted person is forwarded to the Secret Witness Board of Directors who will determine the significance of the information provided and decide on the amount of reward to be disbursed.

The Secret Witness Board of Directors has sole discretion to authorize and set the value of a reward. If you are interested in becoming a board member, please complete and submit a Board Member Application.

Thank you so much for finding this information. I have never heard it before on any threads here at websleuths.

I wonder why they went with that organization instead of the one that we are so familiar with. Any ideas?

 

[MimosaMornings]

Yes, and I would be very surprised if that's not exactly how the evidence was collected since LE was involved in the search. See photo below. Looks like the officer has a camera. MOO

View attachment 277963
Source: California City search party find items that may be related to missing boys - YouTube

Wonder how far that is from the house?

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you so much for finding this information. I have never heard it before on any threads here at websleuths.

I wonder why they went with that organization instead of the one that we are so familiar with. Any ideas?

From reading the description, it sounds like an excellent program. I wonder if LE thinks there is someone who might be afraid to come forward for fear of retaliation by someone involved?

 

[MsMarple]

Respectfully snipped for space
The dirt here is definitely nothing like the dirt in Michigan! (I am originally from the west coast of MI and played in the dirt all the time growing up.) I now live in so Cal. This past summer we had our backyard landscaped. Previously it was just so Cal dirt and tumble weeds. I've tried to dig in it and you don't get very far. When our yard was being worked on, they brought in a rototiller. It didn't work! The soil was so compacted that they ended up renting a HUGE one that looked so out of place. I assume the dirt in their backyard was pretty similar, as that is just desert dirt in general. I don't like saying this, but that's why many desert homicide victims are found in shallow graves. You really can't dig too far down. Also, trying to cover up your tracks is difficult. You can't really just fill in the hole and tamp the dirt down with your feet without making it pretty obvious there is a disturbance there unless you're in a sandy area.
If the family just moved in in September, did they have cement poured? If it was already there when they moved in I'm not sure why a jackhammer would be needed. Curious. If it was done recently, how recently? (Just thinking aloud here.)

Thank you for that information! So if the neighbor did hear a jackhammer then it may have been to penetrate hard soil, which blows away my assumption that LE was using machinery to bust up concrete or brick. Which also negates the theory that the boys have been gone long enough to bury their bodies under some solid material. IF that's the case.

OTOH, why would LE need to penetrate hard, compacted ground? Wouldn't that mean the dirt hadn't been disturbed for quite a while, if ever? Apologies for being dirt ignorant!

 

[dixiegirl1035]

From reading the description, it sounds like an excellent program. I wonder if LE thinks there is someone who might be afraid to come forward for fear of retaliation by someone involved?

Understood. If what you are saying is that somebody may have had an issue previously with Crime Stoppers and therefore that is the reason that they didn't use Crime Stoppers which all states and all cases I have followed have used?

And instead, used this other one that I have never seen it here on WS of years following cases?

Looking forward to learning more about this fabulous organization!

 

[MsBetsy]

I mentioned earlier that we took a road trip today. Santa brought hubs a side by side for Christmas, so we are looking for places to camp and go off-roading.
Some friends recommended the Randsburg, Cal City area.

I don't really have much to share, but we did a loop around the house (Procter, 108th, Aspen, Georgetown). There were people milling around the house, and small groups out in the neighborhood. They gave us the eagle eye as we drove by. There were two CCPD vehicles pulling onto Georgetown as we were leaving, but that's it. Hubs was put out by my request to check the house out so we didn't stop to look around or make another loop around. My takeaway -there is no way I believe any 3&4 year old would have booked it past all those houses to run into the middle of the desert and not be found within a couple of hours. Procter/Randsburg Mohave Rds were pretty busy at the time we went through, so was CC Blvd. If they went up Aspen and crossed 108th, to me that would be the most likely way they wouldn't be seen and could get lost in the open desert. But why would they bolt when it was near dark like that? One last thing, we saw five big signs in different parts of town which said, "Where are the Boys?"

TW & JW did something with/to Orson & Orrin. Whether it was prior to moving to Cal City or after, hopefully we learn the truth soon.

Thanks for sharing your observations, Knox! Did you by any chance notice where the gate is located? I can't find it in any of the pictures.

One thing I did notice is the sliding glass doors in the kitchen overlook the patio where I assume the boys were playing. The kitchen table would be the perfect place to sit and wrap presents while keeping an eye on the boys. I wonder which room the mom was in when the boys disappeared.

 

[ColoGirl]

Ugh I hate to see small city police, with not much experience, botch cases with too much going on... they lose control. Flying drones, people standing around potential evidence and standing on tire tracks, breaking windows of the home with rocks — not good.

I don’t think this will end well, and I have a feeling the previous home could be a possible crime scene.

The other kids will be helpful if they are old enough? Has anyone heard?

 

[MimosaMornings]

Wonder why all the children weren’t on “vacation” with grandmother.

 

[Bopit]

Wonder how far that is from the house?

From looking on Google Maps, if the mountains in the distance are to be believed (camera might cause some distortion I believe) then it's not very close by. The photo faces west towards the mountains and doesn't have much in terms on landmarks. We'd be looking for a dirt road with electricity poles on either side, which unfortunately not too many of them have street view.

 

[ColoGirl]

It reminds me of the Arrone Thompson case. I don’t believe she was ever found. The older kids had things to say. They revealed that she had been missing for awhile.

“Her parents registered their children for a Christmas gift program two weeks before the girl was reported missing, but did not include Aarone’s name on the registration form.”

Aarone Thompson