Found Deceased TX - Alan White, 55, seen leaving LA Fitness, Dallas, 22 Oct 2020 #3

[Limecat]

Speculation only, I believe LE and RJ know that Alan is deceased. That there is sufficient evidence to support that. LE will not tip their hand on what they know, as it is a criminal investigation.

As far as RJ panicking when AW was 15 mins late, I get it. I had something very similar happen. When you live with someone who lives a military precision life and is extremely predictable....you know. And your gut tells you. In my case, my loved one wasn't injured or killed, but a work colleague was. I knew immediately that something was horribly wrong, and I was right. RJ was right too.

Amateur opinion and speculation

ITA that I also believe LE knows that Alan is deceased or willfully disappeared (I lean toward deceased also). And I also think RJ and family believe he is gone, too.

This clearly isn’t playing out like most MP cases and the radio silence is telling and deafening.

I hope some day they find Alan so he can be laid to rest and his loved ones can escape the fear and worry and begin to heal.

 

[SuziQ]

Aside from the home, what happens to Alan's assets -- cash, investments, etc -- while he is "missing". Is there a joint account holder?

Missing person cases create a horrible situation for those left behind. They can not not be declared dead for a long time they are just missing and have every right to be. Only joint accounts can be accessed.

 

[SuziQ]

Speculation only, I believe LE and RJ know that Alan is deceased. That there is sufficient evidence to support that. LE will not tip their hand on what they know, as it is a criminal investigation.

As far as RJ panicking when AW was 15 mins late, I get it. I had something very similar happen. When you live with someone who lives a military precision life and is extremely predictable....you know. And your gut tells you. In my case, my loved one wasn't injured or killed, but a work colleague was. I knew immediately that something was horribly wrong, and I was right. RJ was right too.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I agree, for some reason they know he isn't coming back.

 

[Lhughessk]

Imo this was never about the car. This was never a car theft. It was always about AW.

So, all the talk about chop shops, joyriding, stripping, tracking system disabling, parting out, letting the car sit till it cools down - to me - all that stuff is irrelevant. They didn't want the car (just my opinion).

Again, I think this was all about AW, and I think it could have been one of two scenarios: either a targeted hired killing orchestrated by someone who was very very close to AW (but not work-related) and where money was the motive, - or a carjacking. Yes, a carjacking (not a car theft).

Carjackings are armed robberies. They are an urban culture crime. The one thing that defines them is that the driver/owner of the vehicle is always present. The driver/owner is often taken along with the vehicle, and is sometimes assaulted, threatened with extortion and/or sometimes kidnapped for ransom. In that sense, a carjacking is much more a "people" crime than a "property" crime (jmo)

I think another way to look at it is, a carjacking is no more an "auto theft" than a hijacking is just a "plane theft".

To solve this crime, LE has to figure out why AW was specifically targeted. All Jmo

I feel the complete opposite. This was all about the car. Someone took notice of his vehicle at either the gym or the gas station. The simplest answer is usually the correct one, and that’s a lot simpler than some targeted scenario for which there is no evidence, IMHO.

 

[Rush4087]

I feel the complete opposite. This was all about the car. Someone took notice of his vehicle at either the gym or the gas station. The simplest answer is usually the correct one, and that’s a lot simpler than some targeted scenario for which there is no evidence, IMHO.

Then why didn't they just wait for AW to park, force him to hand over the keys, and drive off to a chop shop somewhere and leave AW standing on the curb with his gym bag? Alan wouldn't have been harmed - and the car would never have been found.

But that's not what we see here. We see the exact opposite. We have the car - but no AW. They ditched the car asap, and made no attempt to keep it, sell it, or strip it.

If the simplest explanation is usually the correct one, the simplest explanation in this case is that AW was targeted. If not, where is he? All jmo.

 

[anonypotomous]

Then why didn't they just wait for AW to park, force him to hand over the keys, and drive off to a chop shop somewhere and leave AW standing on the curb with his gym bag? Alan wouldn't have been harmed - and the car would never have been found.

But that's not what we see here. We see the exact opposite. We have the car - but no AW. They ditched the car asap, and made no attempt to keep it, sell it, or strip it.

If the simplest explanation is usually the correct one, the simplest explanation in this case is that AW was targeted. If not, where is he? All jmo.

100%

BBM

 

[SimplyCass]

I feel the complete opposite. This was all about the car. Someone took notice of his vehicle at either the gym or the gas station. The simplest answer is usually the correct one, and that’s a lot simpler than some targeted scenario for which there is no evidence, IMHO.

The problem with that theory is that AW's car was a loaner. If given the chance, most people would have tossed the keys and ran. (I've read that if someone attempts to rob you of your car keys, you don't hand them over, you throw them as far as you can and run the opposite direction.)

 

[Shamrock1]

If the car was the target, something went wrong. Perhaps he resisted/didn’t comply as ordered and was harmed. The carjacker panicked.* And if the car could tie him to AW (blood etc), he just dumped the car - knowing it would become a target of another thief. Alternatively, he panicked, harmed AW, and thereafter realized a loaner Porsche was likely being tracked.

*Maybe like the Lane Bryant murders?

JMO

 

[Lhughessk]

Then why didn't they just wait for AW to park, force him to hand over the keys, and drive off to a chop shop somewhere and leave AW standing on the curb with his gym bag? Alan wouldn't have been harmed - and the car would never have been found.

But that's not what we see here. We see the exact opposite. We have the car - but no AW. They ditched the car asap, and made no attempt to keep it, sell it, or strip it.

If the simplest explanation is usually the correct one, the simplest explanation in this case is that AW was targeted. If not, where is he? All jmo.

More and more I see people using this logic. What you’re basically asking is, “Why didn’t the criminal do the right thing while in the midst of doing the wrong thing?” The answer is simple. It’s the spur of the moment and the person has already decided to take an expensive car that doesn’t belong to them (“according to this scenario), so is it a huge stretch for them to commit murder while in the act of the theft? No, it is not. People die during the commission of relatively petty crimes every day. Muggings, convenience store robberies, etc.

Not to mention, you have no idea if Alan was willing to give up the car quietly. Or that the thief intended to use a “chop shop” in the first place.

 

[SimplyCass]

More and more I see people using this logic. What you’re basically asking is, “Why didn’t the criminal do the right thing while in the midst of doing the wrong thing?” The answer is simple. It’s the spur of the moment and the person has already decided to take an expensive car that doesn’t belong to them (“according to this scenario), so is it a huge stretch for them to commit murder while in the act of the theft? No, it is not. People die during the commission of relatively petty crimes every day. Muggings, convenience store robberies, etc.

Not to mention, you have no idea if Alan was willing to give up the car quietly. Or that the thief intended to use a “chop shop” in the first place.

Supposing that this was a random carjacking gone wrong, there is no evidence of any kind of struggle in the car or out of the car and no body anywhere.

There are events that are clearly random and someone was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nothing about what has been disclosed suggests that scenario happened. Normal people are not carjacked and disappear without any trace whatsoever.

 

[Curious_in_NC]

OK, here's another idea. The car showed up intact, far from the site it was taken, and was arguably cleaned up with no sign of AW. Sure, this could have been a professional hit targeting AW. It doesn't seem like the work of careless opportunist type criminals. But so far no plausible reason (IMHO) has emerged for why AW would have been targeted.

A carjacking seems somewhat possible. But random carjack hoodlums looking for a joyride in a somewhat exotic vehicle would seem unlikely to be around at 6am, unless they were up all night way past their bedtime. But... what about a carjacking with a purpose? Someone looking for an SUV just like this one for its cargo capacity and speed for a very specific job, like a bank heist? Maybe AW was resistant or somehow things went sideways? (I still can't see him putting up a struggle over a dealer loaner).

I looked at possible crimes between AW's disappearance on Oct 22 and the car being found on the 27th. There were over 40 commercial burglaries and robberies in the greater Dallas area the vehicle could have been used for. LexisNexis® Community Crime Map

 

[anonypotomous]

I have so many questions as to how this sale went through. I was under the impression that one cannot use a POA for someone who is missing - and if declared dead, the POA is not valid, and said person has to be proven to be alive for a POA to be in play.

 

[Lhughessk]

Supposing that this was a random carjacking gone wrong, there is no evidence of any kind of struggle in the car or out of the car and no body anywhere.

There are events that are clearly random and someone was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nothing about what has been disclosed suggests that scenario happened. Normal people are not carjacked and disappear without any trace whatsoever.

Nothing about what has been disclosed suggests that ANYTHING happened. But obviously something did. A man has gone missing.

The car was found days later. Could have been cleaned. And since we don’t knowcthe physical spot where the thing went down, we don’t really know what occurred around/outside the car.

But as I think through this, something else comes to mind. Maybe the perpetrator was just as interested, if not more so, in Alan and what he could get them, as opposed to the car. So maybe the intent was to drive to a bank and force him to make ATM withdrawals. That certainly is not an unheard of scenario. And maybe things somehow went sideways along the way and forced the kidnapper to abandon the plan.

 

[Rush4087]

OK, here's another idea. The car showed up intact, far from the site it was taken, and was arguably cleaned up with no sign of AW. Sure, this could have been a professional hit targeting AW. It doesn't seem like the work of careless opportunist type criminals. But so far no plausible reason (IMHO) has emerged for why AW would have been targeted.

A carjacking seems somewhat possible. But random carjack hoodlums looking for a joyride in a somewhat exotic vehicle would seem unlikely to be around at 6am, unless they were up all night way past their bedtime. But... what about a carjacking with a purpose? Someone looking for an SUV just like this one for its cargo capacity and speed for a very specific job, like a bank heist? Maybe AW was resistant or somehow things went sideways? (I still can't see him putting up a struggle over a dealer loaner).

I looked at possible crimes between AW's disappearance on Oct 22 and the car being found on the 27th. There were over 40 commercial burglaries and robberies in the greater Dallas area the vehicle could have been used for. LexisNexis® Community Crime Map

Quoting your post:
"But so far no plausible reason has emerged for why AW would be targeted"

I think a plausible reason might be money. First, possibly in a targeted disappearance orchestrated by a very close family member, and second, possibly in a kidnapping for the purposes of extorting AW (not necessarily at ATM's) and collecting ransom from his family.

This latter scenario is exactly what happened less than two weeks after AW's disappearance, within three blocks of the Inwood Rd and Lemmon Ave intersection at Hedgerow Dr. - and at the same time in the morning. The two perps arrested for that crime were caught and put in the Lew Sterrett Jail. Pure speculation, but if they were involved in AW's disappearance, and if they knew where AW was at that time, I doubt they were talking.

I just think that if this was a "carjacking" (I still think a domestic situation is possible) it was a carjacking targeting the person who was driving the car, not a carjacking targeting the car for car theft. There are easier ways of stealing a car that won't risk receiving a life sentence.

And why steal a car which likely had dealer plates or dealer loaner decals on it - and a vehicle which was likely equipped with a dealer GPS tracking locator in it? Why dump it so soon? Why not sell it? Why not strip it? And, again, if it was a car theft, where is AW? Jmo

 

[Curious_in_NC]

Was it ever disclosed what the odometer reading or fuel tank level was of the recovered vehicle? That might give clues about where it had been after AW's last sighting at the Racetrak station.

 

[Curious_in_NC]

This latter scenario is exactly what happened less than two weeks after AW's disappearance, within three blocks of the Inwood Rd and Lemmon Ave intersection at Hedgerow Dr. - and at the same time in the morning. The two perps arrested for that crime were caught and put in the Lew Sterrett Jail. Pure speculation, but if they were involved in AW's disappearance, and if they knew where AW was at that time, I doubt they were talking.

RSBM
I'm not doubting you, but do you have a link or more info on this other incident?

 

[Rush4087]

RSBM
I'm not doubting you, but do you have a link or more info on this other incident?

I'm unable to link using this phone, but the info came from a WFAA.com article on Nov. 5, 2020: "2 men arrested following kidnapping incident near Dallas Love Field". It was first linked by EnachiTx on thread 1, in post#382

 

[Curious_in_NC]

I'm unable to link using this phone, but the info came from a WFAA.com article on Nov. 5, 2020: "2 men arrested following kidnapping incident near Dallas Love Field". It was first linked by EnachiTx on thread 1, in post#382

Thanks! Just found it. Here it is again for anyone else who is interested:
2 men arrested following kidnapping incident near Dallas Love Field | wfaa.com
Ironically, at the end under "Related Articles" WFAA lists one about AW.

 

[Orgona]

Thanks! Just found it. Here it is again for anyone else who is interested:
2 men arrested following kidnapping incident near Dallas Love Field | wfaa.com
Ironically, at the end under "Related Articles" WFAA lists one about AW.

They did ask for money in that case, though. They made the victim even call a relative to ask for money. In the case of AW we haven’t heard anything like that. Completely different MO IMO.

If someone was after the car, why would they just leave it behind? That defies logic.

IMHO if a thief targets a specific type of vehicle to steal (to sell it in whole or to dismantle it in a chop shop) the chance it knows how to disable gps tracking is big. It happened in 2020 not in the nineties. They have all kind of gadgets already, but most likely one just needs to unplug something somewhere.

If they were after money, why wouldn’t they take AW or his cards alone to an ATM or even make him ask money from someone like those not so bright individuals in the article above?

If something went wrong during the course of a crime, why would they take AW but leave the car behind? Taking a dead body or a dying victim along is a PITA... unless that was your intention all along.

To me not much makes sense.

The theories I can make work in my head are:

1,) AW left on his own accord to harm himself
2,) AW left on his own accord to get away from something/someone
3,) AW met someone and got into the other person’s car to do and/or speak about whatever and in the course of it something went horribly wrong wherever they were at that time.
4,) AW was made to disappear by order or someone made him disappear

Do I remember correct the seats were wet?
If he left the window(s) down or a sunroof slightly open, that IMO would be indication he thought he would be back soon.
(For total disclosure: I have no idea if his loaner had sunroof or his windows were definitely down.)
If the windows were closed and an eventual sunroof wasn’t open, that indicates some sort of clean up job.

 

[Rush4087]

They did ask for money in that case, though. They made the victim even call a relative to ask for money. In the case of AW we haven’t heard anything like that. Completely different MO IMO.

If someone was after the car, why would they just leave it behind? That defies logic.

IMHO if a thief targets a specific type of vehicle to steal (to sell it in whole or to dismantle it in a chop shop) the chance it knows how to disable gps tracking is big. It happened in 2020 not in the nineties. They have all kind of gadgets already, but most likely one just needs to unplug something somewhere.

If they were after money, why wouldn’t they take AW or his cards alone to an ATM or even make him ask money from someone like those not so bright individuals in the article above?

If something went wrong during the course of a crime, why would they take AW but leave the car behind? Taking a dead body or a dying victim along is a PITA... unless that was your intention all along.

To me not much makes sense.

The theories I can make work in my head are:

1,) AW left on his own accord to harm himself
2,) AW left on his own accord to get away from something/someone
3,) AW met someone and got into the other person’s car to do and/or speak about whatever and in the course of it something went horribly wrong wherever they were at that time.
4,) AW was made to disappear by order or someone made him disappear

Do I remember correct the seats were wet?
If he left the window(s) down or a sunroof slightly open, that IMO would be indication he thought he would be back soon.
(For total disclosure: I have no idea if his loaner had sunroof or his windows were definitely down.)
If the windows were closed and an eventual sunroof wasn’t open, that indicates some sort of clean up job.

Great point about: why no immediate ATM withdrawals. I don't believe there have been any reports of credit card use either. But I don't think that (in the case of a kidnapping) LE would necessarily release that information to the public.

I'm also not sure we know whether AW even had any bank cards with him - though maybe that's been covered and I missed it. I think RJ indicated that when he went looking for AW that morning, he was calling hospitals because he was afraid that AW had been in an accident and maybe didn't have any ID on him. Jmo