4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #81

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Sister Golden Hair said:
BBM for emphasis

Cleaning a car is not a crime, so the PA GJ couldn't call them in to testify about that. We also know that PA cannot investigate ID & WA crimes, and that county can only investigate crimes in that county in PA. So narrowing down to crimes in that county in PA to which BK's parents might have information really limits the scope of what's possible. And I'm sure that any texts and phone call records have already been seized per the WA, ID and PA warrants, and how would the GJ in PA be investigating that anyway?

WA warrant gets them

PA warrant gets them

ID warrants also seized digital records and all his AT&T and other media.

I think the best we can know about this without making random leaps is that if we were LE, the prosecution and/or the defense in this case, we would want to review the GJ investigative hearing testimony of the parents of the man accused of a quadruple homicide and who was about to be tried and potentially sentenced to death. IMO that would be worthy of examination, regardless. But more than that, it's all assumption. We only know three things: 1) the parents were subpoenaed to testify in a GJ investigative hearing; 2) the county GJ can only investigate crimes in their county in their state; and 3) the parents are not the potential suspects. I think that's all we can be sure of, though ICBW.
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Thank you for helping me think this through. There has been a definite undercurrent in the news since this GJ investigation came up. I do feel the public is being steered by the media in this case, which is already, IMO hideous enough that steering is not needed.
 
DrQ said:
IMHO I don't know if BK's trial will be on live TV. However, there will be plenty of time for all of us to watch (maybe) and follow his trial.
Due to my career, I trend to not get emotional about anyone except the victims. In BK I see a man who dislikes himself so deeply and feels nothing to the point of (allegedly) killing four innocent young people. When looking at his pictures, I see a flat deadness to his eyes with a hint of anger. I have yet to feel that he is fearful and see slight arrogance in his arrest pictures. I see a man who is so awkward with women that (while filmed in court) he can barely make and keep eye contact with his attorney.
He has the right to be defended and roll the dice with hopes for his freedom. Madison, Kaylee, Xana, and Ethan had all of their hopes, dreams, and lives taken away which will forever haunt their families and friends.
Deep in my heart, I believe he did it. If this true, I hope he is found guilty. I am hopeful but doubtful that he will pled guilty if they remove the death sentence. It would save the pain of the parents and friends sitting in court. I am not a fan of BTK but he did pled guilty and was sentenced without all the drama, cost, and sadness for the families.
With this trial, everyone on both sides will have to live with all that comes out about their personal lives. All of BK's family dysfunction (which families usually have) will unfortunately be disclosed for all to hear. I find that sad.
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No winners here at all.
 
Predictions? and Court Dates
DrQ said:
IMHO I don't know if BK's trial will be on live TV. However, there will be plenty of time for all of us to watch (maybe) and follow his trial.
Due to my career, I trend to not get emotional about anyone except the victims. In BK I see a man who dislikes himself so deeply and feels nothing to the point of (allegedly) killing four innocent young people. When looking at his pictures, I see a flat deadness to his eyes with a hint of anger. I have yet to feel that he is fearful and see slight arrogance in his arrest pictures. I see a man who is so awkward with women that (while filmed in court) he can barely make and keep eye contact with his attorney.
He has the right to be defended and roll the dice with hopes for his freedom. Madison, Kaylee, Xana, and Ethan had all of their hopes, dreams, and lives taken away which will forever haunt their families and friends.
Deep in my heart, I believe he did it. If this true, I hope he is found guilty. I am hopeful but doubtful that he will pled guilty if they remove the death sentence. It would save the pain of the parents and friends sitting in court. I am not a fan of BTK but he did pled guilty and was sentenced without all the drama, cost, and sadness for the families.
With this trial, everyone on both sides will have to live with all that comes out about their personal lives. All of BK's family dysfunction (which families usually have) will unfortunately be disclosed for all to hear. I find that sad.
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Thank you @DrQ . I agree with everything in your post except
BK will never plead guilty DP or not. Don't believe he values human life, not even his own.
(edit: That's not a political statement;. but agree BK seems off-center, feels nothing, empty)
IDK either if trial will be on TV but we are about to find out. IMO

June 9 Hearing GAG Order & Cameras in Courtroom
by Goncalves' lawyer and a media coalition of thirty news organizations

June 27 Hearing defense's motion to compel discovery evidence

July 21, 2023. Deadline
Death Penalty Notice of Intent to seek DUE 60 days from 5/22/23

October 2. TRIAL expected to last four-to-six-weeks trial
Six Weeks from October 02, 2023 is November 13, 2023.

Will there be a change of venue?
 
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Balthazar said:
Thank you for helping me think this through. There has been a definite undercurrent in the news since this GJ investigation came up. I do feel the public is being steered by the media in this case, which is already, IMO hideous enough that steering is not needed.
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I was helping myself as well by walking through the logic, and you know I appreciate your raising these points. I do think the media is headed in one direction only, and IMO that is very manipulative. I hope the gag order stays in place.

Of course, the argument is that we can decide what we want to believe, but a lot of people don't have legal and/or investigative education and/or experience, so it isn't as easy as it seems to sort through it. The clickbait and exaggeration sounds quite plausible until we take it apart and look at the underlying legislation and rules. And it really helps that all that varies from state to state (<<read doesn't help at all), so literally, something that is okay in PA is not okay in WA.

Truly, though, the only thing we can do with this share order is guess. Honestly, if I were any party to the ID case, I'd want every bit of info that comes from BK's family to make sure I didn't miss anything. Can you imagine if the parents said something that seemed innocuous but ended up being the clue that was the piece that put the "B" in BARD or added the "Not" to Guilty? I mean, they have to check it out, right? And yet, it's a very limited scope, so crimes in that county is our only clue.
 
NCWatcher said:
BK's extradition hearing was in Monroe Co, PA and the DA there, Michael Mancuso, has been the one who gave lots of press conferences. So it's confusing.

www.cbsnews.com

Bryan Kohberger waives extradition during Monroe County hearing

Bryan Kohberger will be surrendered to Idaho authorities within 10 calendar days.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
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Google mapping it, it looks like BK's parents' home is right outside of Carbon County and into Monroe County.

www.google.com

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.
www.google.com www.google.com
 
Hi y’all. I’ve stayed the hell away from this case. I’m already confused enough. So I don’t know if this is a repeat. Apologies if so. I tried to do a search but it would take me 81 days to read 81 threads so I’m just gonna leave this here. Y’all hang in here and see this one through. Good luck.
*eta: full episode:

Watch Dateline Episode: The Killings on King Road - NBC.com

Watch The Killings on King Road (Season 31, Episode 32) of Dateline or get episode details on NBC.com
www.nbc.com www.nbc.com
 
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"The Latah County Prosecutor's Office declined to comment to CNN citing the gag order in effect in the Kohberger case.

By law, a Monroe County grand jury can only review potential crimes that occurred within Monroe County, Pennsylvania. It is unclear what potential crime they are investigating"

I have a question. According to the above news quote, if Kohberger was arrested at his parents home in Albrightsville, Carbon County Pa., isn't the only link to his parents testifying to a Pa. Grand jury investigation in Monroe County the Dana Smithers case ?
 
Area52 said:
"The Latah County Prosecutor's Office declined to comment to CNN citing the gag order in effect in the Kohberger case.

By law, a Monroe County grand jury can only review potential crimes that occurred within Monroe County, Pennsylvania. It is unclear what potential crime they are investigating"

I have a question. According to the above news quote, if Kohberger was arrested at his parents home in Albrightsville, Carbon County Pa., isn't the only link to his parents testifying to a Pa. Grand jury investigation in Monroe County the Dana Smithers case ?
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I did a google map for their specific address, and it's actually in Monroe County (link is above), and we don't know that the DS crime is the only crime his parents could testify about; the DS crime is the only crime we know about.

ETA: and it could be about a crime other than murder, too. Just thinking ahead.
 
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NCWatcher said:
BK's extradition hearing was in Monroe Co, PA and the DA there, Michael Mancuso, has been the one who gave lots of press conferences. So it's confusing.

www.cbsnews.com

Bryan Kohberger waives extradition during Monroe County hearing

Bryan Kohberger will be surrendered to Idaho authorities within 10 calendar days.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
Click to expand...
Police raided the home in the 100 block of Lamsden Drive in the Indian Mountain Lakes development in the early-morning hours of December 30.

The actual lands of Indian Mountain Lake are located in Monroe and Carbon counties and consist of approximately 4,600 acres with 3,262 single family residential building lots.

The Kohberger's "lot" is in Monroe CO. IMO
 
schooling said:
I have a hard to pronounce name which provided for a pretty brutal (by elementary and middle school standards) first 14 or so years of my life. I'll always fondly remember and be thankful to the teachers who actually took the time to get it right before riffing off 2 to 3 ridiculous embarrassing pronunciations in a row before I, now in a cold sweat, interrupted the laughs to correct them.

Because of that, anytime I know I'm going to be in a meeting with someone, presenting something to someone, or simply reading someone's name off of a piece of paper I'll carefully review each and every one. First and Last.

If there are any names I don't immediately get I'll quickly search for it on Youtube. Since Kaylee is probably one of those names I wouldn't have looked up (the pronunciation looks pretty clear to me) it seems like Judge Judge resorted to recall (of the word) instead of actual pronunciation. Which is pretty low effort IMO. Regardless of how large his workload is. PARTICULARLY in murder/gross negligence and other life loss/bodily harm cases.
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I could not agree with you more. I have a first name spelled differently from the common pronunciation of my name so everyone gets it wrong. In saying that, IME, only people with simple names (Like John ha ha, just an example) get unusual names wrong, other people with unusual names seem to make more effort with other people’s names, because of the continued ongoing issues with their own unusual name.
 
Sundog said:
On the other hand, I hope that the PA legal system would have some policies or guidelines in place for judges to follow in the event of a decision to share grand jury testimony transcripts with other states and legal jurisdictions. Otherwise, it would seem to be quite arbitrary. I haven't had time to research this, but maybe someone here knows the policy/guidelines if there are any.

Maybe our verified attorney @prairiefriend can help us out withoon this.
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^^^
too late to edit, but meant to type @PrairieWind
 
Lol. It doesn't surprise me that the parent's home may be on or close to the border of two different PA Counties! Just joking but I could almost believe that is fated. As things stand now from our outsiders POV so many small details potentially related to this case seem to be open to the most intricate nuances of interpretation! MOO
 
Off topic but I wonder if anyone has written a book or researched the aftermath of a serial killer’s actions on their families? How do they cope? Do they abandon or support their child? Do they move? Change their names? Contact the relatives of their victims? Do they get divorced? Do they blame themselves? Do they feel guilty? Probably exists but I am unaware but I’m sure this group can point me in the right direction. Just curious.
 
SLouTh said:
One thing I don’t understand …. With BK being a Criminolgy Student, and allegedly this murder being a planned premeditated murder…. Is why did he take his phone with him at all that night???? We all know it will catch you out…

To me, reading the affidavit, it seems like he actually forgot to turn his phone off before leaving his home …. And then has an “oops moment” 5mins later and turns his phone off ….

For someone who was studying a PHD in Criminolgy, who was allegedly attempting the perfect murder, wouldn’t you abort you plan right there and then as you had already made a mistake???? (Or am I being too rational?)
Especially if his predetermined alibi was built on being at home that night??? (He had already left his residence..)


On November 13,2022 al approximately 2:42 a.m., the 8458 Phone was utilizing cellular resources that provide coverage to 1630 Northeast Valley Road, Apt G201, Pullman, WA, hereafter the "Kohberger Residence." At approximately 2:47 a.m., the 8458 Phone utilized cellular resources that provide coverage southeast ofthe Kohberger Residence consistent with the 8458 Phone leaving the Kohberger Residence and traveling south through Pullman, WA'
This is consistent with the movement of the white Elantra. At approximately 2:47 a.m. the 8458 Phone stops reporting to the network, which is consistent with either the phone being in an area without cellular coverage, the connection to the network is disabled (such as putting the phone in airplane mode), or that the phone is tumed off
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IMO - I’m interested in this too & also…… why drive his car to & from the crime scene? Just these two mistakes seem ridiculously stupid. MOO
 
Helechawagirl said:
Off topic but I wonder if anyone has written a book or researched the aftermath of a serial killer’s actions on their families? How do they cope? Do they abandon or support their child? Do they move? Change their names? Contact the relatives of their victims? Do they get divorced? Do they blame themselves? Do they feel guilty? Probably exists but I am unaware but I’m sure this group can point me in the right direction. Just curious.
Click to expand...
So glad you asked!! I love true crime and good storytelling though most I read are not by family members.
  • Written by the daughter of BTK, Kerri Rawson, A Serial Killer's Daughter 2019
  • Not family but a friend of Ted Bundy was Ann Rule who wrote The Stranger Beside Me 1980
  • An actress named Dominique Dunne was murdered 1982. Dominick Dunne, her father, attended the trial of her murderer (John Thomas Sweeney) and subsequently wrote Justice: A Father's Account of the Trial of his Daughter's Killer.
Both sides of the aisle are deeply affected by these monsters.

JMO.

edit. took out the dark part.
 
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Karin1974 said:
IMO - I’m interested in this too & also…… why drive his car to & from the crime scene? Just these two mistakes seem ridiculously stupid. MOO
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I know … it just doesn’t make sense …. Most WSer’s could most likely plan a better murder scenario …. Not that we could go through with it … IMO

How did he not know there was CCTV that would capture his car, if he, as alleged, had been there so many times to case the house prior???

It just seems like such a fail in ”Murder 101”…. IMO
 
I'm Nobody said:
So glad you asked!! I love true crime and good storytelling though most I read are not by family members.
  • Written by the daughter of BTK, Kerri Rawson, A Serial Killer's Daughter 2019
  • Not family but a friend of Ted Bundy was Ann Rule who wrote The Stranger Beside Me 1980
  • An actress named Dominique Dunne was murdered 1982. Dominick Dunne, her father, attended the trial of her murderer (John Thomas Sweeney) and subsequently wrote Justice: A Father's Account of the Trial of his Daughter's Killer.
Both sides of the aisle are deeply affected by these monsters.

JMO.

edit. took out the dark part.
Click to expand...
Thank you.
 
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