Syringe in bottle contained traces of chloroform

[JBean]

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/11911-11987.pdf

 

[QuietStorm]

Okay now with the syringe, chloroform evidence released how do we fit the pool theory in? maybe after she killed Caylee with the cloroform, she placed her in the pool to make it appear to be a drowning and then when she could not get ahold of anyone, fished her out with the shovel placed her back in the trunk... but why put the duct tape over her mouth?

IF she concocted the kidnap ruse before murdering her child, the duct tape could simply be "proof" that Caylee was kidnapped?

 

[spqr]

Entomology conclusion.. the body was removed from the car between June 20-27.

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/1106/21539770.pdf

Meaning... at minimum 4 days in the trunk.. Body farm report 2.6 days. Yes, close.... But I do believe it wasn't until later that she dumped her body. (gas can incident on the 24th)...which would be 8 days. She reports to Amy June 27th that she got rid of the dead squirrel plastered to her car. So how accurately do the two really dovetail together? And how accurate is the Chloroform finding in the same report? I am sooo on the fence with the Chloroform issue.

BBM

Maybe they are both right. Ponder this...starting with the basic math of 4 days minus 2.6 days = 1.4 days(being the difference between the entomology and the farm). Maybe/possible the first 1.4/1.5 days was spent in the sand box or her playhouse in the yard. THEN moved to the trunk for the additional 2.5/2.6 days. If that scenario is feasible, that would make both reports correct. Thoughts???

 

[Friday]

I agree that the proximity of the bag/bottle/syringe in very curious, but do agree nothing we have seen ties it to KC. Still trying to catch up on today's posts, but something hit me today. How is it possible this was less than a foot from her remains, with the huricaines and the flood waters in the area, wouldn't be more likely to float away? Perhaps it was originally in the bag with Caylee, and later drug out by creatures. Thoughts or theories?

I know what I'm trying to say, but not quite how to say it, but here goes: As high water receeds, debris doesn't usually float back whence it came and settle there. Instead, it tends to accummulate, esp. where there's some sort of obstruction like vines, or a larger piece of debris.

I have no opinion as to how the syringe, et al, came to be near Caylee's remains, or if there's any relevance to the items. Just tryin' to answer your question.

 

[QuietStorm]

I'm working on a theory...

• KC didn't make the chloroform - too hard & too lazy.
• One place she could have gotten it was the Tattoo shop. While chloroform is a banned substance in cleaning supplies, a quick Google search shows that it is used in tat shops
• Quick forum search and this was validated by a tat shop worker who posted here
• Ok - KC visited the tattoo parlour the week before she got the tattoo, didn't she? (It sounds as if she would drop in there fairly often - have to refresh my brain)
• Anyway, while researching chloroform online she notes use by tattoo artists OR she happens to see her buddy cleaning his equipment with it during a visit to the parlour
• Next visit brings a gatorade bottle with her --> Bathroom is likely near back of shop, where cleaning supplies are usually kept - inc. chloroform --> 'scuse please, I have to pee
• Swipes bottle of chloroform and tosses in backpack, or pours some in juice-bottle while in bathroom
• puts it in the trunk when she leaves
• as she is fiddling with it in the process of murdering Caylee, she spills some in the trunk. Perhaps be pouring from stolen bottle into smaller Gatorade bottle, or dousing the cloth (Mama Doll's clothes?) Many scenarios here - regardless she spilled some or it leaked.
• > CA got rid of the bigger bottle when she was cleaning out the trunk, in my little theory, btw... just sayin' <
• I still haven't seen anything definitive in regards to the amount of chloroform that was actually registering in the syringe, so I'm still on the fence about that (could be chloroform from the testing 'postive control solution' from what I am reading in the reports & results print-outs - won't know until someone figures out the amount registered)
• So at this point syringe is only part of this theory in that KC shoved the syringe in the bottle - perhaps she injected Caylee with testosterone and used Mama Doll's clothing to apply the chloroform, perhaps it was just an artifact lieing in her trunk from when she stole Tony's garbage. Lots of possibilities

Bottom-line - she might have stolen chloroform, quite possibly from the tattoo shop, and she spilled or it leaked in the trunk.

Thoughts?

I just posted similar thoughts. I am thinking that KC was too hyper, too immediate in her own needs, to make chloroform in a home shared with her parents and with a brother who dropped in. And I don't think she cared a hoot about how it synthesized or reacted with anything. JMHO.

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

Oh, I've good news everyone... I probably should have mentioned it earlier, but started posting and forgot. I'll be speaking with Tricia sometime tomorrow to get my qualifications/educational background OFFICIALLY verified and everything... yay!! I'm excited!

 

[spqr]

I just posted similar thoughts. I am thinking that KC was too hyper, too immediate in her own needs, to make chloroform in a home shared with her parents and with a brother who dropped in. And I don't think she cared a hoot about how it synthesized or reacted with anything. JMHO.

Maybe she made it in her trunk....

 

[lizzysf]

BBM

Maybe they are both right. Ponder this...starting with the basic math of 4 days minus 2.6 days = 1.4 days(being the difference between the entomology and the farm). Maybe/possible the first 1.4/1.5 days was spent in the sand box or her playhouse in the yard. THEN moved to the trunk for the additional 2.5/2.6 days. If that scenario is feasible, that would make both reports correct. Thoughts???

But what about the blowfly issue? Had she been in the sandbox, wouldn't they have arrived on the scene quite rapidly and easily? I know this isn't the entomology thread..but I am questioning accuracy of the body farm report, including the Chloroform results. And the car still smells 2 months later from a bagged body in the car for 2.6 days? I have a hard time believing that.

 

[notthatsmart]

Yes, I had forgotten that, thanks. That was way before she disappeared though, wasn't it?

I was refering to swamp water. Talking about people in that area draining their pools into the yards come winter.

 

[QuietStorm]

Casey may have just poured some in the trunk thinking it would take the smell away and all evidence

Could be, and remember that LE took insectiside and other chemicals from the Anthony home. KC could have doused the remains with insectisides thinking that would keep the bug evidence at bay. And all this did not have to happen on Day one.

 

[OneLostGrl]

and i wish i could help to prevent beautiful children from growing up to become killers..:innocent:

We can help by not ignoring or blaming others for the warning signs that there may be something very wrong with our childrens thinking. By refusing to allow mental illness to eat away at our loved ones. If a child shows signs of cancer or other health issues parents rush them to a doctor, demanding tests etc. The day parents begin to do the same for signs of mental illness (including personality disorders) perhaps our innocent children will stop growing up to become monsters.

 

[QuietStorm]

Also if she did not plan on making it, why would she research it on her putor?

She seems to be tracking what is on the forensic shows. She could have purchased it but that would be trackable. So to make it or to steal it -- that may be the question.

 

[lizzysf]

I'm working on a theory...

• KC didn't make the chloroform - too hard & too lazy.
• One place she could have gotten it was the Tattoo shop. While chloroform is a banned substance in cleaning supplies, a quick Google search shows that it is used in tat shops
• Quick forum search and this was validated by a tat shop worker who posted here
• Ok - KC visited the tattoo parlour the week before she got the tattoo, didn't she? (It sounds as if she would drop in there fairly often - have to refresh my brain)
• Anyway, while researching chloroform online she notes use by tattoo artists OR she happens to see her buddy cleaning his equipment with it during a visit to the parlour
• Next visit brings a gatorade bottle with her --> Bathroom is likely near back of shop, where cleaning supplies are usually kept - inc. chloroform --> 'scuse please, I have to pee
• Swipes bottle of chloroform and tosses in backpack, or pours some in juice-bottle while in bathroom
• puts it in the trunk when she leaves
• as she is fiddling with it in the process of murdering Caylee, she spills some in the trunk. Perhaps be pouring from stolen bottle into smaller Gatorade bottle, or dousing the cloth (Mama Doll's clothes?) Many scenarios here - regardless she spilled some or it leaked.
• > CA got rid of the bigger bottle when she was cleaning out the trunk, in my little theory, btw... just sayin' <
• I still haven't seen anything definitive in regards to the amount of chloroform that was actually registering in the syringe, so I'm still on the fence about that (could be chloroform from the testing 'postive control solution' from what I am reading in the reports & results print-outs - won't know until someone figures out the amount registered)
• So at this point syringe is only part of this theory in that KC shoved the syringe in the bottle - perhaps she injected Caylee with testosterone and used Mama Doll's clothing to apply the chloroform, perhaps it was just an artifact lieing in her trunk from when she stole Tony's garbage. Lots of possibilities

Bottom-line - she might have stolen chloroform, quite possibly from the tattoo shop, and she spilled or it leaked in the trunk.

Thoughts?

She seems like she has plenty of time on her hands and the devious imagination to create evidence of a job via fake emails etc..I don't think that making Chloroform is rocket science, and afterall, someone researched it for a recipe.. I think she is more mentally/emotionally affected than stupid.. while no braniac by all means..she gets by better than average on smarts..

 

[notthatsmart]

They have analyzed the contents of the bottle and no mention is made of 'swamp water'.

I saw that they analysed it, but didnt see what was in it other than cleaning solution. What cleaning solution? brown cleaning solution?

 

[OneLostGrl]

Oh, I've good news everyone... I probably should have mentioned it earlier, but started posting and forgot. I'll be speaking with Tricia sometime tomorrow to get my qualifications/educational background OFFICIALLY verified and everything... yay!! I'm excited!

I'm glad! Your explanations have been very helpful!! :blowkiss:

 

[notthatsmart]

Someone other than Casey you mean? What makes you think it would not be Casey's?

Because they haven't showed us print evidence on the trash in the trunk.

 

[notthatsmart]

Caylee swam at the pool at Tony's apartment, but I doubt the pool chemicals were readily available for KC to grab, so I am not sure that is meaningful in regards to your question.

ETA: - dang y'all is good. ^

Its only meaningful to me if they through their bathing suits or towels in the trunk

 

[QuietStorm]

Okay, I have read all 800+ posts on this thread and nobody has convinced me that this new "evidence" is at all connected to Caylee's death. I have yet to see what the proportion of chloroform was in the syringe or the bottle. I keep thinking of how this spot on Suburban was a dump site and even though Casey is a ding-a-ling she's not goofy enough to inject Caylee then repackage a syringe and throw it out near the dump site. It is also my belief that she was not thinking clearly enough at that time to be trying to frame anyone.
So, can anyone convince me otherwise?

I don't think any of us can say what KC would or wouldn't do. I am pretty sure, though, that she knew the flood pattern of that section of those woods. Also, saying she was the person who dumped Caylee's body, how can we say what frame of mind she was in while doing so? Her frame of mind could have been totally chaotic. She could have been in a panic and thrown things away that perhaps she should have, or would have if she was not pretty sure that mother nature would not do damage to them. She could have been perfectly lucid. Or she could have been interrupted and had to get the heck out of there.

What makes sense to us just isn't going to the most likely scenario in any murder case, in my humble opinion.

 

[magic-cat]

I had to search for the actual documents from the FBI labs on this so I thought I would post actual link - these are on the Webleuths current docs but were hard to find :

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/11911-11987.pdf

(pages 11984 and 11985 are the report pages - the other pages show all the lab results)

In those particular pages/reports I did not find ANY chloroform mentioned at all in any of the samples??? And if you look carefully at that report, Q240.1(the syringe) is stated to have been within Q240(the BAG). Hmmm...

So this report actually says the syringe was in the bag and not inside the bottle at all...
The only items listed as from within the bottle are the liquid and a piece of plastic...

 

[magic-cat]

Its only meaningful to me if they through their bathing suits or towels in the trunk

Many people do this after swimming away from home, throw their suits and towels etc into the trunk so they do not wet the interior of the car.