Do you guys think AB and EB killed Zahra?

[TxLady2]

I am still REALLY torn on AB's involvement.
Something about LE having him at all these searches is telling me they know a lot more than we do. Notice ... EB wasn't allowed out of the vehicle. AB is out there like he's LE's right hand man. I just feel that it would be really strange if LE was allowing AB on all these search sites without some STRONG info that he's NOT involved OR that his involvement was limited (possibly to disposal? ) . There are too many "what ifs" that could arise with the potential perp on the site .

What if he saw something? What if he moved something? What if he purposefully planted someone elses DNA (hair, etc.) What if he saw LE mishandle something? What if he removed something from the scene ?
I don't think LE is going to GIVE him those possible defenses. They have either confirmation of what he was actually involved in .... or a written confession. Which tells me they AREN'T looking at charging AB for murder.

I am certain he would be watched closely while at the search sites, so the possibility of him planting evidence would be almost zero unless he's a magician. As for him recognizing whether LE mishandled something, he is not trained in police procedure, how would he know how evidence was supposed to be handled?

There have been cases where the perp actually led them to the body, and this was WHILE they were a suspect. LE does not usually recommend parents to take part in searches, because of the possibility they will find the body and mess up the crime scene and obliterate evidence, not to mention the emotional impact.... so maybe they were hoping he would give himself away in some manner. I can imagine how scared a person might be watching LE dismantle a woodchipper IF they had actually put their child's dead body through it.

 

[suepitzl]

I think she died of neglect and they panicked when they found her deceased. MOO

 

[mistressammie]

YES I do believe that BOTH EB & AB are directly involved in the horiffic murder of Zahra.

I believe this was not only premeditated with some degree of planning but was also somewhat ritualistic in nature and directly related to EB & AB's Pagon/religious beliefs.




JMO

BBM. I think we should be careful where we go with this. Paganism is NOT Satanism and Pagan religions, such as Wicca, are recognized religions in the US. Pagans are peaceful, and place a high value on life. Contrary to ignorant (and I use that in the very basic and real meaning that points to lack of knowledge) beliefs, there are no sacrificial killings, ritualistic sacrifices, etc. involved in Wicca.

If that's what EB practices, it's certainly not Wicca or Paganism as I know it. I'm not being ugly to you, Sailor Bug...just don't want to offend anyone's religion or beliefs here...especially not peaceful, loving religions.

 

[Meagain]

I think she died of neglect and they panicked when they found her deceased. MOO

Which is still killing her.

Neglect, refusing to call a doctor if she was sick, etc. etc. Same as killing her IMO.

 

[Clue Hopper]

I guess it won't be long before Lisa Dubs makes a public statement of "No Comment" or "My client has been unjustly treated".

 

[Meagain]

I wonder... The big bouts of cancer. The chemo and other treatments... can take a big toll on the body. I.e.; she lost her hearing. It's very possible there was an affect on organs as well? Perhaps a simple virus/fever could've been too much for her heart?
Just thinking.

Unfortunately, being hit with any type of neglect charge for not seeking medical care is just a hand slap compared to this vast coverup which obviously took tremendous energy.

I guess I was just hoping perhaps she had a heart attack and AB/EB went nutso paranoid.

 

[Nancy2441]

I don't believe Zahra died from neglect. I believe it was murder and planned by both EB and AB. As far as the plan not being well orchestrated these two aren't the brightest people on the planet.

 

[newone]

If the reports are true, and Z was ill with a stomach virus for 2 weeks - I believe (IMHO) it was death by neglect. Then AB and EB got rid of her body. I do not think there is a third party involved.

JMOOO

Mel

I got the impression this was slow death by neglect and abuse - sad to say. I wish I could the find the video where a 'neighbor' was saying something about EB breaking her hand by hitting ZB's prothesis.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

HomeU.S.AP - US .Nov. 13, 2010
Mystery Deepens Over Disabled NC Girl's Killing
Police Think They've Found The Remains Of Disabled NC Girl, But How She Died Still A Mystery

(AP) HICKORY, N.C. (AP) - Police were confident a freckle-faced disabled 10-year-old girl was killed, but the mystery of how she died deepened when police said a set of remains was uncovered five miles away from where one of her bones was found.

The bone, discovered in some brush alongside Zahra Baker's prosthetic leg, was discovered in an area near where the family lived until mid-September. Zahra's stepmother, Elisa Baker, is currently in jail, charged with trying to throw off investigators with a bogus ransom note. Her father, Adam Baker, has been arrested on charges unrelated to Zahra's disappearance and is free on bail.

Recently, Elisa Baker began cooperating with police and led them to the areas where the remains and the bone were found, though she has not been charged in Zahra's death.

more at the link:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/11/13/ap/national/main7050663.shtml

Zahra was born in Australia and moved to North Carolina about two years ago after her father met his soon-to-be wife online. Zahra's friends and relatives in Giru, Australia, described her as an outgoing, happy girl despite the cancer, and said she didn't want to come to the U.S.

Poor Zahra, taken to a foreign land and didn't want to come here. Why didn't AB leave her with her grandmother KB? Poor Zahra, her fate was doomed when this stepmomster came into her life...JMHO

Neighbors and relatives have said that Elisa Baker had a short temper and was abusive toward her stepdaughter. Caldwell County Department of Social Services investigated the family because Zahra went to school with bruises and a teacher alerted school officials, who have said they are prohibited by law from discussing the case.

Poor Zahra, after all she suffered medically and survived until doom met her father...how can someone abuse someone else's child? If this womans own daughter is afraid of her, I can only wonder what precious Zahra felt...isolated and alone, no one who stood up for her...just angers the heck out of me...of all the people why wouldn't daddy stand up for his girl?

I do hope LE finds the answers to the hows and whys of Zahra's demise.

I do hope whoever is responsible, the DP awaits them, for any child who is abused, tortured and the end result is death, IMO, they too should die...JMHO




Justice for Zahra

 

[Nosee_Parker]

Initially I was sure EB was involved (that's as plain as day).

AB, meh, I wasn't sure. But, after the news report tonight on Australian TV and the comments from our PM I am absolutely convinced that AB is involved also. The comment relayed directly from PM Gillard said support would be given to Emily, no mention of AB. That speaks volumes to me ... PM Gillard would definitely be in the loop to the future plans of US LE - hence the reason that no mention of support being provided to him.

 

[Reannan]

I believe AB and EB killed her as a consequence of some twisted act in their lives. I believe they were initially drawn together by their twisted religious views. I am not going to call their religion paganism because the pagans I know are some of the most kind, caring people in the world and are actually much more peace-loving than I think AB and EB have EVER been. This horrible event we find ourselves drawn into began when AB and EB first made contact with each other. Of course, this is all MOO, but I am confident the future will bring us disturbing revelations about these two monsters.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

I read an account where AB was away from the home for a few days, somewhere here, in one of the Zahra threads...I'll try to locate it...

The night he came home was the night of the fire, so I'm thinking this is all on EB...Not quite sure if AB aided in the coverup but he must have known the ransom note was written by EB, at that time of the 911 call. I wonder if her writtings (we really didn't kill her but what AB did after was somewhat horrifying) was all just BS or he did help after the fact. Either way, wouldn't absolve him, he should have called 911 immediately if he found out Zahra died at the hands of EB...this child should not have been scattered and buried but it appears, they found Zahra near one of the homes EB used to reside. Filicide studies has shown women who kill will bury the remains within 5 miles of their own home, usually in a womblike tomb.... So this is what is familiar to EB...her disconnect, her selfishness, her narcisisism shows in those letters. She misses her waterbed for goodness sake...JMHO

I believe LE will find out the whats and whos of Zahra's demise, they did such a diligent job finding Zahra...AB not being under arrest doesn't matter right now. They know where he's at and I'm sure they confiscated his passport, so he's not going anywhere. They know where EB is at, that high bail wont' be met, so, she's not going anywhere...I just hope she doesn't commit suicide before murder charges are brought foward...if she is narcisistic, she won't take her own life. So, if shes' kept away from the other prisoners, she's safe for the moment...JMHO


Justice for Zahra

 

[NancyA]

I read an account where AB was away from the home for a few days, somewhere here, in one of the Zahra threads...I'll try to locate it...

The night he came home was the night of the fire, so I'm thinking this is all on EB...Not quite sure if AB aided in the coverup but he must have known the ransom note was written by EB, at that time of the 911 call. I wonder if her writtings (we really didn't kill her but what AB did after was somewhat horrifying) was all just BS or he did help after the fact. Either way, wouldn't absolve him, he should have called 911 immediately if he found out Zahra died at the hands of EB...this child should not have been scattered and buried but it appears, they found Zahra near one of the homes EB used to reside. Filicide studies has shown women who kill will bury the remains within 5 miles of their own home, usually in a womblike tomb.... So this is what is familiar to EB...her disconnect, her selfishness, her narcisisism shows in those letters. She misses her waterbed for goodness sake...JMHO

I believe LE will find out the whats and whos of Zahra's demise, they did such a diligent job finding Zahra...AB not being under arrest doesn't matter right now. They know where he's at and I'm sure they confiscated his passport, so he's not going anywhere. They know where EB is at, that high bail wont' be met, so, she's not going anywhere...I just hope she doesn't commit suicide before murder charges are brought foward...if she is narcisistic, she won't take her own life. So, if shes' kept away from the other prisoners, she's safe for the moment...JMHO


Justice for Zahra

BBM. I don’t think the claims he was away for a few days before the fire have been substantiated and from his own words in the emergency call it was “Tuesday…oops sorry Thursday” when he says he last saw Zahra. I'm discounting Tuesday as a misstatement on his part, so if we stick to Thursday and it was really early when he left, let’s be generous and give him 36-40 hours away, so he's home some time late Friday night because after all he was there when the mulch fire started early hours Saturday morning. I just don’t think in that space of time that EB could have killed her, chopped up her body, ran all over the countryside scattering some bits, burying others, discarding mattresses, cleaning up the house etc.

 

[GoneWithTheWind]

I do believe that the abuse from BOTH EB/AB had gotten so bad that they murdered her.
Zahra may of laid there needing medical attention, and they just ignored Zahra.
IMO, Zahra was just in the way of EB/AB doing their thing.
EB hated Zahra, saddist punchiment.
EB could care less. I am even thinking sexual abuse by him and maybe 1 other man.
This is the reason I feel that AB/EB and maybe 1 other had to make sure there was NO BODY of EVIDENCE left to show the abuse that caused Zahra to die. JMOO

Who is the third person? Can you give me the initials. Perhaps in an im or email? I can't figure that part out.
TIA

 

[chief]

I've been lurking for most of this case. Just coming out to play devil's advocate.

So, what if neither AB nor EB killed Zahra? What other scenarios are possible? I'm interested to see what all your brilliant minds come up with.

FYI - I am NOT advocating that either are innocent. Just looking for other directions of thought...

 

[LCoastMom]

It is possible Zahra had a relapse of CA - that still makes this a crime of NOT SEEKING MEDICAL CARE - child abuse (a felony).

 

[NancyA]

Zanny the Nanny did it.

Sorry, not really what you were looking for I know but that's about how certain I am that this sorry pair DID do it, there just isn't another logical scenario my brain can wrap itself around.

 

[Lera213]

There is no other possibilities....evil took her and that evil had two names PERIOD

 

[Lera213]

Zanny the Nanny did it.

Sorry, not really what you were looking for I know but that's about how certain I am that this sorry pair DID do it, there just isn't another logical scenario my brain can wrap itself around.

Now that is funny! I don't care who you are that is FUNNY!

 

[ynotdivein]

I keep trying... but I simply cannot wrap my head around that possibility in this case.

If neither AB nor EB harmed Zahra or played a part in desecrating her dead body and scattering her remains, what does either of them stand to gain by lying/not turning in the real guilty party ASAP? In EB's letters she's pretty clearly trying to blame AB for everything; if she had someone else to blame why wouldn't she finger them too? She herself apparently led LE to the site where Zahra's prosthesis was found. (OK, I guess somebody could have told her where it was after the fact, but if that was the case I think she would be blabbing that person's name all over the place "So-and-so TOLD me where it was, I didn't do it, go talk to him/her")

Maybe it's still too soon. Just can't get my head there.