OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#46

[Cool Cats]

CG and FR had become friends. HHG, and FR, were rooting for CG, within hours of K's birth, to be allowed to come see his baby. CG had hurt HMR's feelings so badly, earlier in her pregnancy, (I personally believe), that that is why she didn't want him at the hospital, and made the comment about CH had been there for her through the pregnancy, so he was K's father (loosely quoting).

JW had to have read that, and seen the support for CG, and the comment about CH. More than one have said that if JW wasn't at his house, he was at the R house or HMR was at the W house. It has been said that the Rs/Ms treated him like family. Not only was CH stepping into the picture now, there was a photo of a lovely ring set, that was posted. If that came to fruition, there goes HMR, S, and K (if she was his), living with another man. JW, who had been a part of the R family for almost five years, at the very least, was possibly seeing himself as getting rooted out. What if he felt angry about that? What if he felt more at home around the Rs/Ms than his own kin? Nothing would ever be the same, now that HMR had chosen someone else. He stewed on it, and became angrier and angrier over time, till he acted (with assistance).

Also, S would be starting school soon. What would happen to JW's weeks then (AW's too)? Good chance they'd be trimmed down. S would probably have been enrolled in public school soon. Probably 1/2 day pre-school that upcoming fall.

Just pondering on some old theories.

Such a good post. LM said Jake was "at his house for all the Holidays".

This is a very important angle I had not picked up on. That Jake was happy with and felt like part of the Rhoden extended family----to the point where he felt angry and hurt that other men were now literally taking his place.

First It was CG and now it would be CH over at LM's on the Holidays, and often S would be there too, Jake is left alone. And Hanna's boyfriend helping to parent his daughter--- was unacceptable.

Perhaps this explains a little bit about the psychology behind murdering 8 family members. The Wagner's saw Hanna's rejection of Jake as being a rejection by all the Rhodens, and any support the Rhodens gave to CG or CH would be seen as being disloyal towards the Wagners. Seen as betrayal......My 2 Cents.....

PS... The Wagner's are a very enmeshed family and would view the Rhoden family in this way as well.

 

[rsd1200]

Such a good post. LM said Jake was "at his house for all the Holidays".

This is a very important angle I had not picked up on. That Jake was happy with and felt like part of the Rhoden extended family----to the point where he felt angry and hurt that other men were now literally taking his place.

First It was CG and now it would be CH over at LM's on the Holidays, and often S would be there too, Jake is left alone. And Hanna's boyfriend helping to parent his daughter--- was unacceptable.

Perhaps this explains a little bit about the psychology behind murdering 8 family members. The Wagner's saw Hanna's rejection of Jake as being a rejection by all the Rhodens, and any support the Rhodens gave to CG or CH would be seen as being disloyal towards the Wagners. Seen as betrayal......My 2 Cents.....

I know it sounds strange, but if he felt hurt and angry, that anger could simmer, and then boil over, when it reached a certain point. If JW felt rejected by the R/HHG family, and again, in some of my theories, I think in twos, then maybe, JW was the main instigator, and he gets his best friend, and elder bro, to help him? The Boondock Saints are fraternal twins, the W boys are 13 months apart (some call having two, that close in age, Irish Twins). Just a guess, but I'd bet the two were/are quite close. G4 may have helped only out of loyalty to his younger brother.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

Such a good post. LM said Jake was "at his house for all the Holidays".

This is a very important angle I had not picked up on. That Jake was happy with and felt like part of the Rhoden extended family----to the point where he felt angry and hurt that other men were now literally taking his place.

First It was CG and now it would be CH over at LM's on the Holidays, and often S would be there too, Jake is left alone. And Hanna's boyfriend helping to parent his daughter--- was unacceptable.

Perhaps this explains a little bit about the psychology behind murdering 8 family members. The Wagner's saw Hanna's rejection of Jake as being a rejection by all the Rhodens, and any support the Rhodens gave to CG or CH would be seen as being disloyal towards the Wagners. Seen as betrayal......My 2 Cents.....

PS... The Wagner's are a very enmeshed family and would view the Rhoden family in this way as well.

Good analysis. Mass murder is often committed by someone who feels rejected. There are many examples from other cases.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

D

 

[OhioBlues]

I know it sounds strange, but if he felt hurt and angry, that anger could simmer, and then boil over, when it reached a certain point. If JW felt rejected by the R/HHG family, and again, in some of my theories, I think in twos, then maybe, JW was the main instigator, and he gets his best friend, and elder bro, to help him? The Boondock Saints are fraternal twins, the W boys are 13 months apart (some call having two, that close in age, Irish Twins). Just a guess, but I'd bet the two were/are quite close. G4 may have helped only out of loyalty to his younger brother.

It doesn't sound strange to me. GW3 attorney claims that BCI thinks that he is the mastermind.
But they put Jake in the jail that seems nearest to BCI instead of BW3.

 

[rsd1200]

D

I'm probably wrong, it's just a theory I've been toying with. It could have been the parents. JW stayed home w/S. What better alibi, than staying home with the kids, and binge watching Bubble Guppies, for example?

 

[OhioBlues]

I'm probably wrong, it's just a theory I've been toying with. It could have been the parents. JW stayed home w/S. What better alibi, than staying home with the kids, and binge watching Bubble Guppies, for example?

FW and AW both seemed to emphasize that JW couldn't have done it. They acted so incredulous that someone might consider him a suspect.

It made me wonder if he had an ironclad alibi and allowed the others to do his bidding. Maybe they thought that BCI would look at him or him hiring a hitman but never suspecting that his parents or brother would do the crime for him.

 

[Dudly]

I'm probably wrong, it's just a theory I've been toying with. It could have been the parents. JW stayed home w/S. What better alibi, than staying home with the kids, and binge watching Bubble Guppies, for example?

I have given this thought. I've wondered if they left him home thinking he couldn't be charged and he gets to keep S. That could be why JW is all smiles in court. If he knew about what was going to happen, or, was in on helping or planning the crimes, he will do time at the least...

 

[Dudly]

FW and AW both seemed to emphasize that JW couldn't have done it. They acted so incredulous that someone might consider him a suspect.

It made me wonder if he had an ironclad alibi and allowed the others to do his bidding. Maybe they thought that BCI would look at him or him hiring a hitman but never suspecting that his parents or brother would do the crime for him.

Keeping him out of the actual crimes may have been their thought on how to make sure he still gets S. It would not surprise me with all the twisted thinking and planning done...

 

[Loomis124]

No Loomis I'm sorry I don't know if he is.

Thank you. The age seems to match. JMO

 

[sunshineray]

I think Tiff23 is correct, I think she facilitated the relationship in the opinion of the W's. I also think there may be a small chance that JW thought Hanna's child was his initially. I've seen some conflicting reports about the autopsy's, as in was DR shot in chin or neck? Most say chin, also CRSr had more decomposition than the others, but by how much? Another detail is bruising, some sources indicate that this is a sign that 2 were beaten. Which 2? And were they beaten or did they struggle/fight? We know CRSr is one, I say DR is the other. Some had skull fractures which mean nothing until we see specifics of the bullet trajectory. I worked for Neurosurgery in a Level 1 trauma center (where I still work). A single GSW to the head can cause a skull to fracture, not to mention 5 at close range. I initially thought these were fairly quick, in and out murders but the more I dig the more I get a sense that's not the case for all 8. It's sad enough in it's own right but to think they suffered is worse. Whoever did this or had part in it lost their humanity some time ago.

I agree the murderers lost their humanity to even plan this all, yet alone carry it out with such viciousness. Where that comes from, I don't know, it's so foreign to my being. Twisted, twisted minds and black souls.

 

[sunshineray]

Keeping him out of the actual crimes may have been their thought on how to make sure he still gets S. It would not surprise me with all the twisted thinking and planning done...

You know Dudly, I've never even considered that. My God.

 

[sunshineray]

For so long I have felt something happened in 2014. I'm just not sure what it was. So many things started changing and that is the year the hacking, etc. began.
Could 2014 have been when CSR and BW's friendship started going sideways? If so why?

Was it just something inside the W family? I'm not sure...

Was 2014 when GW4 got custody of his child?

 

[Jonas_Klein]

I'm probably wrong, it's just a theory I've been toying with. It could have been the parents. JW stayed home w/S. What better alibi, than staying home with the kids, and binge watching Bubble Guppies, for example?

Idk. It's why I erased my post. But it's my opinion the 2 boys, still living with their parents, were still under their influence. Would they have planned this without their parents having knowledge? If not prior, at least after?

You know, if I were to learn 2 weeks after that my two boys were involved in something like this, I would be ordering 2 BPVs for my wife and me. Just saying...

 

[sunshineray]

BBM
Agree.

The link below is one report on the shot numbers, and the shot locations, from WLWT5 Ohio.

I am not comparing human life to that of a farm animal, (although being that I did hand raise this particular one, I was fond of this one, and saddened to lose him), but, I had to help put the animal out of its misery (a firearm was used). While I was not traumatized from the experience, and it was absolutely necessary, it is not something I ever wish to have to repeat. Very unsettling. Based on that experience, with an animal, that I'd raised and cared about, I could not see how anyone could kill another human being (who was of no immediate threat to them).

These murders weren't done in the heat of passion, but, were premeditated, so that they could be there, up close and personal, in the moment, to watch them die, otherwise there were other ways, that didn't risk the four defendants getting the death penalty, if caught. If it was solely about the control of children, it's been stated many times that the Senior W's, not only have vast wealth but have connections, if true, the custody issue could probably have been settled in an entirely different way.

It was theorized at one time that hired assassins had been brought in to do the job. The plan was made, by the killers, I believe, b/c they had a personal score to settle and they wanted to not only kill their victims, themselves, to settle it, but be up close and personal to watch them die, and hated them enough to risk everything. Heinous. To be able to have killed the first person, and go on to kill the other seven, in such a fashion, I've often wondered if it's possible, that they were responsible for the murders, of a local mother and daughter, as a sort of trial run.

The way the other murders were done, I don't think so. Didn't the young lady almost get away, if I'm remembering correctly? It wasn't done in the dead of night while they were sleeping?

 

[Tiff23fr]

Was 2014 when GW4 got custody of his child?

It was the year he and his wife split.

 

[rsd1200]

Was 2014 when GW4 got custody of his child?

That's when his divorce was filed.

 

[rsd1200]

Idk. It's why I erased my post. But it's my opinion the 2 boys, still living with their parents, were still under their influence. Would they have planned this without their parents having knowledge? If not prior, at least after?

You know, if I were to learn 2 weeks after that my two boys were involved in something like this, I would be ordering 2 BPVs for my wife and me. Just saying...

Maybe, they thought at first that their boys were being falsely accused because of JW's link to HMR. Denial imo, is posting a pic of your son w/his hair dyed black as night, on their public, FB, farm site. It would be very hard for me to believe that my boys were capable of such a thing, because one's former fiance wasn't going to come back to him.

What if you turn them in, and they don't have enough evidence? Awkward, and potentially dangerous. Maybe once you come to the realization, you take them far away so maybe they can start a new life but that doesn't work. Iirc, AW was looking at two bedroom rentals, too, during her internet searches for AK. They come back, and wait. Talk is one thing, action is another. G3 wasn't hiding in the horse trailer. There was a horse in there and nowhere to hide in that type trailer anyway. He calmly gave it up.

 

[sunshineray]

Good points. I forgot about Frankie. It is likely he too was blamed for HR/CH.

And yes your right, it wouldn't only be about men in Hanna's life, but also getting the men OUT of S' life.

Chilling thought you brought up. If Hanna had gone back to Jake and Jake was trying to raise Kylie as his own, then yes, I do think (2 Cents Only) CG would have gone "missing".

Controversial statement I know, but, if the Wagner's are guilty of 8 murders it means we do know they are very capable of making their problems "disappear". And CG would most definitely have been a problem because Jake is obsessed with the control of children.

Remember what he said? If Kylie wasn't his...Quote: "I will want mandatory visitation."

Yeah quite the bold and entitled statement. I bet that reporter CG will probably be called to testify. I hope she audio recorded that interview.

 

[rsd1200]

The way the other murders were done, I don't think so. Didn't the young lady almost get away, if I'm remembering correctly? It wasn't done in the dead of night while they were sleeping?

Probably not, but, if it was their first, it may not have went as planned. The Rs/HHG were probably the only ones. They were probably the only folks they had reason to hate that much, and have the determination to put together such a plan as they did. They just didn't think it all the way through.