Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #110

[MJPeony]

From following previous cases I have learned that prosecutors are heavily involved during investigations advising LE. When an arrest is made, the clock starts ticking toward a speedy trial. Now, we know it is more than likely, there will not be a speedy trial. However, if an arrested person demanded a speedy trial, there would be one. There will only be one trial. An arrest will not be made until prosecutors believe there is enough evidence for a conviction. LE gathers the evidence. Prosecutor presents that evidence in court.

Yes, but if there is enough evidence for LE to know who their BG is, it seems there would be enough to make good headway towards a strong court case.

Arrests have been made with circumstantial evidence before (several mentioned in earlier thread pages), and not only when there is a “slam dunk”. Anyway, something has never added up to me regarding the concept that LE hasn’t arrested anyone just bc it’s not a slam dunk.

Topic has been hashed out several times so apologies to bring up again. I just remain baffled as to why they don’t have enough to make an arrest if (IF) they have enough to know for sure who he is. I’m not sure I’ll get a reason that will make sense in my head.

 

[Charlot123]

I apologize for a late response to this but yes, I believe BG was interviewed and may have contributed to one of the sketches, perhaps the first. I think he did assist in the first OBG sketch. Another witness assists in a sketch and they toss it aside due to the video matching the sketch. When the case started getting cold, they attempt to go back to this witness, who is a significant witness and they can’t find him due to providing false info. LE finally realizes that they’ve been duped. The witness was OBG and they lost him. So they issue the NBG sketch. At the April presser they’re talking to him calling him out on his bs sketch and tell him in so many words, we figured you out and you never thought we would. Common sense tells me that the witness giving direction for the first sketch “saw the BG” and LE came full circle to say, he is the BG. LE admits they had that sketch for a long time. I think police had 2 people who were interviewed having seen BG; one was a credible witness and the other was BG. They changed course a little too late giving BG with false identity time to make a run. MOO

Very possible. I wonder what made him credible in the first place.

I mean, if there is a murder in my neighborhood, I would tend to trust my neighbors or coworkers. But the policemen are trained differently than me. They should suspect anyone who was next to that place, right? So what made the person so credible?

 

[Pedrosmom]

Very possible. I wonder what made him credible in the first place.

I mean, if there is a murder in my neighborhood, I would tend to trust my neighbors or coworkers. But the policemen are trained differently than me. They should suspect anyone who was next to that place, right? So what made the person so credible?

I don’t think he was credible at all. The question becomes what did LE do to investigate him and his story? Did they find him to be a credible (unknowing the he was a sociopath) and so believable that they didn’t go investigate him until years later. “You never thought we would change our strategy” tell me that they did re-visit all of the people there and he high tailed it out of Delphi, perhaps finding an alibi that will not budge.

 

[tresir2012]

no, I meant has anyone on SM - not WS, posted the side by side. I think many people do consider a few specific individuals as the most likely culprits, and I bet one of them stands at the top for many.
Anyway, I just wondered if anyone knew of anyone on SM who has done the side by side of the probably culprit, bc I'd be surprised if not. But I can't find anything in my own searches.

Yes I have found this on Twitter.

 

[tresir2012]

Very possible. I wonder what made him credible in the first place.

I mean, if there is a murder in my neighborhood, I would tend to trust my neighbors or coworkers. But the policemen are trained differently than me. They should suspect anyone who was next to that place, right? So what made the person so credible?

So won't they have the names and addresses of these witnesses?

 

[Charlot123]

So won't they have the names and addresses of these witnesses?

I don’t know. Either someone moved abroad, or another witness died?

I think it was one of the “no way, he is such an upstanding member of the community” case.

 

[Charlot123]

.

I don’t think he was credible at all. The question becomes what did LE do to investigate him and his story? Did they find him to be a credible (unknowing the he was a sociopath) and so believable that they didn’t go investigate him until years later. “You never thought we would change our strategy” tell me that they did re-visit all of the people there and he high tailed it out of Delphi, perhaps finding an alibi that will not budge.

I wonder if part of the problem was that he did not look exactly like the BG from Libby’s video. The video is taken at an angle, with the person walking looking down, so I assume the BG from the video doesn’t resemble anyone specifically. In fact, he probably looked very different from the “faux witness”.

 

[Pedrosmom]

Very well said. And very close to what I believe.

The only thing I might disagree with is whether or not LE can identify this false witness (BG). I do think it's possible he's flown the coop and now LE needs to find him. But I think it's more likely he is known to LE, but they can't show enough evidence to prove it was him to actually arrest him.

I think this second scenario is more likely b/c IMO this false witness would have been relied upon heavily in the early stages of the investigation. LE would have had to follow-up with him on multiple occasions, would have had to establish alibi (although fake), etc. But in doing the follow-up they would have certainly had to know his legitimate identity- his contact info, real name, etc.

So in this case, I think LE knows who it is, but can't yet nail him down. However, I still don't understand why they wouldn't be able to make an arrest, b/c I thought LE only had to show reasonable cause.... That remains a huge question mark in my brain that keeps me from definitively landing on one theory about whether LE has their POI.

One thing that makes me believe that LE may know who it is was when the sister went on YT and debunked rumors. Her response to a question if she’s afraid of him (or something along those lines) made me believe that they do know who it is or have strong suspicion.

There was also something I read that still puzzles me to this day. It was a person or witness whose wife didn’t remember if he was at an ultrasound that day. You’d remember if your husband is at an ultrasound. Maybe this person has been ruled out or maybe not.

 

[Pedrosmom]

It's possible they aren't doing much with the tips if they already know who the individual is. They can choose to ignore anything that isn't directly related to their POI. And anything related may be "that one tip" they are looking for to establish his alibi was false, etc.

But I'm still looking for a reason why LE can't arrest him if they know who he is but are just wanting "a conviction". To my knowledge, that burden of proof is not on LE. They only need probable cause. And they could continue to break down the missing pieces as they work with the prosecutor ahead of trial. So anyone who is knowledgable about this, please share why it would make sense- in this real life case- that LE would not go ahead and arrest based on reasonable evidence.

This is a double capital murder case. If they have more than one DNA profile and BG has an alibi they won’t risk bringing charges. Until they have solid evidence there will be no arrest. They have one shot at him and it had better be a good one or they risk letting this crazed maniac go free. The DA is calling all of the shots here. MOO

 

[watcher9]

I watched The Shack movie on TV a night or two before the presser so when ISP Carter mentioned The Shack, I assumed he was taking about the movie and not the book. I have not read the book so I don't know if there is a difference between the two.

 

[Sugarcane18]

I would not have chosen "The Shack" if I were searching for a book to read. I found it in Goodwill, recognized it, paid fifty cents for it, brought it home, and put it in my "when I get time" book stack. My husband read it first and pronounced it "deep." I am not going to go into the plot, characters, etc. because if people are interested, they can read it for themselves. I mention it only because ISP Carter included it in the PC . My husband was right, it is "deep." I almost wanted to get a reference Bible to have on hand as I read it. I think if LE wanted to mention a book during the PC, I don't think they would have chosen this one because it doesn't have mass appeal. Only someone familiar with the book would make that connection with ISP " Carter. I would only change my mind if ISP Carter announced that he had made a mistake in mentioning the book.

I would imagine that everyone interviewed had to answer the question of their specific whereabouts during the murders. How interesting would it be if BG was interviewed and his alibi was that he spent the day reading "The Shack." MOO.

 

[pearl]

I would imagine that everyone interviewed had to answer the question of their specific whereabouts during the murders. How interesting would it be if BG was interviewed and his alibi was that he spent the day reading "The Shack." MOO.

This is a good idea. I had not thought of that. I was thinking more along the lines of something being found at the crime scene. If that actually happened, I would think at the PC the cops let the guy know it might take some more time but they were coming for him.

 

[pearl]

I watched The Shack movie on TV a night or two before the presser so when ISP Carter mentioned The Shack, I assumed he was taking about the movie and not the book. I have not read the book so I don't know if there is a difference between the two.

I have not watched the movie and probably will not do so because I do not often watch anything but news. As I said upthread, the book is deep thinking material. Well worth the read if one is interested in this case and are a book reading person.

 

[Sugarcane18]

This is a good idea. I had not thought of that. I was thinking more along the lines of something being found at the crime scene. If that actually happened, I would think at the PC the cops let the guy know it might take some more time but they were coming for him.

Your theory is very plausible too. I have often considered that myself but have struggled with what examples of evidence would point to "The Shack" other than a piece of the book, or a receipt for it or something like that.

 

[pearl]

Your theory is very plausible too. I have often considered that myself but have struggled with what examples of evidence would point to "The Shack" other than a piece of the book, or a receipt for it or something like that.

ISP Carter could have been referring to the movie. I do not know how closely the movie follows the book. If so, maybe something at the crime scene was staged to, and I dislike even thinking this much less writing it, copy something from the movie. No disrespect to Libby and Abby intended. My opinion is that the killer has talked to, maybe confided in, someone who has provided a legitimate tip. That isn't to say that person has told all to LE. I think as soon as LE can get the one thing they need, an arrest will be made. I do have strong faith in LE.

 

[Charlot123]

I think that the perp is not a psychopath. I wonder if he has a real emotional problem, and is unaware of it himself. There is something very ... different about this case. Don’t other people feel it, too?

There must be a reason why the LE was alluding to his conscience. It never happens in murder cases. Who, and when, assumes that the double murderer has conscience? Yet here LE did. And I don’t think it had to with the fact that the perp, allegedly, read “the Shack”. JMO x 2.

 

[Pedrosmom]

I think that the perp is not a psychopath. I wonder if he has a real emotional problem, and is unaware of it himself. There is something very ... different about this case. Don’t other people feel it, too?

There must be a reason why the LE was alluding to his conscience. It never happens in murder cases. Who, and when, assumes that the double murderer has conscience? Yet here LE did. And I don’t think it had to with the fact that the perp, allegedly, read “the Shack”. JMO x 2.

I totally agree. LE’s approach is strange. They’re speaking to him as if it will cause him to make a move. They either got this approach from a behavioral analysis specialist or they know who it is. Either way, that April presser was extremely odd at best. MOO

 

[FinePrint]

I think that the perp is not a psychopath. I wonder if he has a real emotional problem, and is unaware of it himself. There is something very ... different about this case. Don’t other people feel it, too?

There must be a reason why the LE was alluding to his conscience. It never happens in murder cases. Who, and when, assumes that the double murderer has conscience? Yet here LE did. And I don’t think it had to with the fact that the perp, allegedly, read “the Shack”. JMO x 2.

The Shack played the weekend prior to the press conference on the Lifetime channel.

 

[ScumbagTrav]

ISP Carter could have been referring to the movie. I do not know how closely the movie follows the book. If so, maybe something at the crime scene was staged to, and I dislike even thinking this much less writing it, copy something from the movie.

Carter specifically states he "recently watched a movie called 'The Shack.' But also mentions there is a book too. But during the PC, he specifically says he personally watched the movie.

It was released theatrically just weeks after the murders.

 

[tresir2012]

.


I wonder if part of the problem was that he did not look exactly like the BG from Libby’s video. The video is taken at an angle, with the person walking looking down, so I assume the BG from the video doesn’t resemble anyone specifically. In fact, he probably looked very different from the “faux witness”.

Maybe the father of BG or a relative, gave a false ID?