Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #19

[Strangeworld]

An Australian man and his American girlfriend have died in suspicious circumstances in Canada, sparking fears they may have been murdered.

Lucas Fowler is reported to be the son of senior NSW police officer, Inspector Stephen Fowler. He was found dead alongside his girlfriend, North Carolina woman Chynna Deese, in British Columbia earlier this week sparking fears of foul play.

Chynna’s sister Kennedy Deese wrote they pair were “homicide victims along a remote stretch of highway in Canada while on a road trip.”

An older style blue mini-van the pair was believed to have been travelling was found at the scene.

Canadian police are looking for anyone who saw the vehicle or offered assistance. They’re also appealing for anyone that travelled the stretch of highway around the time of the discovery to come forward, according to a RCMP media release.

Australian man found dead in Canada


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Thread #15 - Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #15
Thread #16 - Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #16
Thread #17 - Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #17
Thread #18 - Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #18

 

[Sillybilly]

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[acutename]

I wondered if it was hunting camo, but I have no idea. Would be very interested in hearing from someone familiar with camo.

I do not qualify as a camo expert at all, but have seen camo for sale and it is supposed to "match" the environment- thus desert camo is grayish brown, light; mossy oak is kind of like spring in the forest- some light green, some grayish brown like trees. BS's camo looks highly pixilated to me and not something I have seen- does it match summer in BC or in Manotoba?

 

[acutename]

Because it's a kid in a gas mask in front of a Happy Birthday banner hanging on gramma wallpaper. That juxtaposition is why it's SO sad...and maybe that he got the gas mask for his birthday. That is just sad too.

plus, most people who have to wear a mask like that do not find it comfortable or funny; it is an unpleasant but necessary part of a dangerous job, and here he is sporting it for fun

 

[acutename]

Sorry, I'm not sure what 48- bit means...

I can't readily find a pic of my son's casual camo jacket. But for those interested, I did find this photo of a real Canadian Army Temperate Woodland jacket. It looks a bit different to BS's.

For what it's worth, BS was wearing a camo jacket that is available in army surplus stores and probably some online retailers too.

Army Surplus is just the name of a store, I don't believe it really means "army surplus". At least in Canada. There'd be hell to pay if the army here ordered so much extra that they could stock retail stores continuously.

"Army surplus" store just means it sells the type of army inventory that looks like and could pass for army surplus. My 8 year old son bought his camo jacket at an army surplus store and was thrilled to find it in his size.

Just think about that if you think army surplus is really army surplus...

Lots of kids (and adults too) like camo print for a variety of reasons but I doubt there is any connection between BS's camo gear and real Canadian army gear. JMO.

FWIW, I have not seen either of these guys, in pictures, in anything that looks remotely waterproof. BS's outfit looks like heavy cotton canvas- maybe abrasion resistant but deadly cold and heavy if wet, IMO.

 

[Gina20]

It's a graduation portrait, not a picture of the moment.



I agree.

From my experience 5 years ago, the pictures are taken say Jan. or Feb., proofs are sent out to the graduating students in March and then the grads pick their choice of pose and what extra portraits they want to order. They can also ask for retouches if they wish (blur out a zit for example.) Final portraits are sent to the graduating student (and most likely the school too so they can use them in their yearbook) in April-May.

As to how the portrait was taken, when my kids graduated, they filled out a form ahead of time saying what background they wanted and then when the time came for them to go to the gym for their portraits, just before the pic, they put on a grad gown and sat in front of the background of their choice. The photographer can process these grad photos very quickly.

As an aside and hopefully it's not too off topic but when my kids went to school in B.C., whether a student and his parents ordered a portrait package from grade one to 12, all students were photographed.

In return for the photographer being able to offer portraits to the kids, the photographer was obliged to provide the school with a photo of each child with the same background. This was kept in case the child ever went missing.

I found this out when volunteering in the school office one day for the "call home" program (if the school had an absent student and a parent hadn't called in and left a message on a designated phone number to let the school know they were safe at home, we would call to make sure the child had not gone missing on the way to school.)

I'm pretty sure the background in the Port Alberni grad portraits is just a drop sheet and doesn't account for the time of year the photo was taken. The fact that the background for most is an outside setting could just be the generic shot taken of all students to pass on to the school.

JMO

Just a quick mention from yesterday that Lifetouch takes grad portraits for the Alberni school district in December. The Lifetouch schedule is consistent from year to year.

Grad - Home - Alberni District Secondary School

 

[Moriarty]

SBM

This is true, but we can still glean some context from them, and I think the result is still more ostensibly normal than Bryer's world that we see in pictures.

One of the biggest differences I noticed is pictures of Bryer tend to be focusing on something he is proud of, as I have already posted. The focus isn't so much Bryer, but it is his gas mask, his airsoft rifle, his suit, his Slav squat skills, etc. Unless he is modeling his headset in that one pic, it's one of the only photos of him that I can think of where he's just being himself rather than apparently trying to show someone something. It's also, I'd argue, about the most normal picture I've seen of Bryer as a teen. As a result of the fact he almost always seems to be showing off something, there are a fair number of pics of him where he is obviously taking the photo (see thumb in his gas mask picture). And, with the exception of that one photo of him with Kam, Bryer is always alone.

In contrast, the handful of pictures of Kam seem to be about marking an occasion/specific moment, even if it isn't quite clear what that moment is. They are all also obviously not pictures that he is taking himself. (Between that and the fact that Kam doesn't have pictures of himself on social media, I really do think he didn't like having his picture taken and didn't initiate photos on his own.)

The close-up picture of him outside (https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/teens-manhunt-homicides-mcleod-schmegelsky-1.5222515)--I am not 100% sure what that is behind him. Is it a vehicle trunk that's open? That's sure what it looks like to me. If so, seems like possibly a picture taken when packing for a road trip/camping trip.

In the picture of Kam that was initially circulated, it's cropped, but there is clearly some sort of social function going on. I think Kam is sitting next to someone who has been cropped out, but you can see a bit of what looks like their shirt next to him, and he is leaning in toward them, which is pretty normal in a picture. There also appears to be someone sitting behind him in a chair. (Canadian teen murder suspects killed themselves with guns, police reveal).

His graduation picture is harder to detect anything from because it's a canned photo op (If you ‘inadvertently’ helped two suspected killers escape, please come forward, RCMP urge), but I did notice he's wearing a white collared shirt with a black tie. Several guys on that page of the newspaper have a similar look, but not everybody does. Kam's collars are also a lot straighter than some of the other guys with a similar look. One guy is clearly in a T-shirt. Kam's outfit is a much more formal look than Bryer's purple shirt and tie suit would have been if such a graduation picture existed for him. Was there school guidelines for the picture that he followed? Or did his parents put their foot down and say, "Your graduation picture isn't going to be you in a Cathulu shirt, pal!" Who knows--but I still think it is something worth analyzing. He obviously put some effort into looking nice for that picture, whether it was under his own initiative or not. His hair even looks marginally less tousled and combed down!

Also, there are more pictures of Kam outside. (Not counting graduation picture since that seems to be the set style.) I'm really surprised Bryer didn't take the time to take his airsoft/camo pic outside, especially since the whole point of buying it for him, according to his dad, was to get him outside. Bryer almost always looks fairly pale in any picture of him. I assume he just had really fair skin. To me, Kam looks quite pallid in that surveillance footage, but in earlier pictures of him, he looks like he's been in a bit of sunshine. I'd never say he was tan, but he just doesn't look as pale. I think it's reasonable to assume since he was raised on the lake, he probably was outside more than Bryer. The only picture I can think of Bryer being outside is the one he's in with Kam, actually.

So, yeah, we can't glean a lot from Kam's world based on those photos, but what I do see still seems much less odd than Bryer and his sad Happy Birthday banner behind him while he's rocking a gas mask.

All MOO

Thanks so much for this, @Zella !!! Really perceptive! (Are you sure you weren’t in art history and not literature studies? )

 

[MistyWaters]

'I do still wonder why Professor Dyck's murder was only charged as second degree though. One theory I have is that they did run him over accidentally during the robbery. That would also explain why they had to burn their car instead of just abandoning it somewhere where it wouldn't be found for a while, because there would be blood on it and so on. But who knows. But there had to be some reason it was charged as second degree and not first.'

way back it was pretty much settled that the reason for the charge of 2nd degree was , it is easy to up grade that, and not so easy to downgrade it, and at that time, the RCMP fully expected to be able to interrogate K and B, and it didn't need a charge in the 1st degree to set off the program of the huge search that got underway with the trigger being a charge of 2nd degree.,

The RCMP would have been hoping to be able to charge the person who pulled the trigger after interrogation, no doubt, and it was policy to begin , before being able to hear each boys story, to kick off with the lower charge. Lower in the sense of it still attracted a hefty life sentence for murder, it wasn't manslaughter or neglectful death, it was m.u.r.d.e.r.

In Canada, if a victim is murdered during the course of robbery it’s 2nd degree murder. Those charges were filed July 24th iirc, as soon as B&K were confirmed to have been at Meadow Lake, Sask driving a stolen car and so a Canada-wide warrant was required in order to arrest the two. But it appears LD’s identity was still being confirmed at about the same time. If so, police wouldn’t had time to investigate whether or not the pair had crossed path with LD days earlier in or around Dease Lake, to prove the added element of premeditation of murder required for 1st degree homicide. So IMO the Crown went with the lower charge of 2nd degree murder as the RAV4 was known to be stolen from the murder victim. Had the two been successfully arrested, upon the completion of the investigation, the opportunity would be there to upgrade the charges if circumstances warranted.

 

[MistyWaters]

There are just so many possible scenarios. Maybe they left Port Alberni with the intent to kidnap a female and the victim would not cooperate. Maybe they were interrupted just taking a purse, but then decided to kill the witness. Maybe they just wanted to kill someone and see what it felt like. So many possibilities.

One thing to keep in mind, though, is that for someone like Bryer, whose friends left him one by one, who likely had no idea how to get himself a girlfriend; he looks around at everybody else who has friends, at everybody else who has a boy/girlfriend, and it can build a great deal of anger and resentment.

As for courage, there's this: Why Alcohol Makes You Feel Invincible

I’d never thought of this until you mentioned the possibility but yes indeed, attempting to kidnap an attractive female victim may have been their original motive particularly if the two had driven by earlier and noticed L&C siting outside the van.

An unsuccessful abduction of C involving a raging fury of defeat could certainly pose a reason for them to continue on to viciously murder both victims, representing a much different scenario entirely than a poorly thought out notion to pilfer what might’ve appeared as an old, abandoned van.

 

[SnooperDuper]

In Canada, if a victim is murdered during the course of robbery it’s 2nd degree murder. Those charges were filed July 24th iirc, as soon as B&K were confirmed to have been at Meadow Lake, Sask driving a stolen car and so a Canada-wide warrant was required in order to arrest the two. But it appears LD’s identity was still being confirmed at about the same time. If so, police wouldn’t had time to investigate whether or not the pair had crossed path with LD days earlier in or around Dease Lake, to prove the added element of premeditation of murder required for 1st degree homicide. So IMO the Crown went with the lower charge of 2nd degree murder as the RAV4 was known to be stolen from the murder victim. Had the two been successfully arrested, upon the completion of the investigation, the opportunity would be there to upgrade the charges if circumstances warranted.

Murder during a robbery can be first or second degree murder or manslaughter. All that can really be said is that it was not an accident, it's culpable homicide.

 

[MistyWaters]

This press release is dated July 21st, two days after the burning truck and camper was found. Looking back on it now, I notice how carefully it’s crafted including no mention whatsoever of concern over the wellbeing of the two. I think preliminary investigation had already given reasons for police to suspect their criminal involvement.

"Kam and Bryer have periodically connected with family and friends over the past week and it is possible that they are now in area without cell coverage", says Dawn Roberts, BC RCMP Communications. "However, we have found their vehicle and have not been able to locate either of them at this time. We are asking for Kam or Bryer to connect with police right away and let us know you are okay. Or we ask that anyone who may have spoken to or seen them over the last few days to call police so we can get a better understanding as to where they might be or their plans."
RCMP in British Columbia - Update - Police seek public assistance in Dease Lake investigation

 

[FactFinder3000]

Murder during a robbery can be first or second degree murder or manslaughter. All that can really be said is that it was not an accident, it's culpable homicide.

Murder is never manslaughter. Murder means it was intentional, manslaughter means it wasn't.

 

[MistyWaters]

Murder during a robbery can be first or second degree murder or manslaughter. All that can really be said is that it was not an accident, it's culpable homicide.

This was discussed here earlier. Robbery is no longer included as a factor of 1st degree murder in Canada’s Criminal Code. There was an excellent article including the date when the Supreme Court tossed it and I’ll see if I can find it again. So regardless if robbery occurred, the Crown must prove the defendant premeditated the murder of the victim in order to support a 1st degree charge. Intent to kill, but not premeditation, is required for 2nd degree and dependant on what caused LDs death, it appears that element was satisfied.

Criminal Code

 

[Jan424]

SBM - I agree, can't see them both snapping at the same time. Instead of 'snap' I think this might've been more of a build up over time and feeding off and even encouraging each other's dark ideas possibly. They might've been talking about doing something for years.

Exactly! I’ve always felt they were like minded given their close impenetrable bond thru the years. I agree this was built up over time, and then some “perfect storm” (for lack of a better term) propelled them into murder and mayhem once they left home. JMO

 

[Jan424]

SBM

So .. it is reasonable to assume that Kam wasn't backwards in this as well, and the reasonable assumption rests on the bloody bodies of Mr Fowler and Miss Deese discarded in full view on the highway. That didn't come from nothing. And they were the closest of friends. They shared everything, obviously.

Agree 100%!

 

[Kubirai]

This press release is dated July 21st, two days after the burning truck and camper was found. Looking back on it now, I notice how carefully it’s crafted including no mention whatsoever of concern over the wellbeing of the two. I think preliminary investigation had already given reasons for police to suspect their criminal involvement.

"Kam and Bryer have periodically connected with family and friends over the past week and it is possible that they are now in area without cell coverage", says Dawn Roberts, BC RCMP Communications. "However, we have found their vehicle and have not been able to locate either of them at this time. We are asking for Kam or Bryer to connect with police right away and let us know you are okay. Or we ask that anyone who may have spoken to or seen them over the last few days to call police so we can get a better understanding as to where they might be or their plans."
RCMP in British Columbia - Update - Police seek public assistance in Dease Lake investigation

I highlighted July 21 comment by BC RCMP. We know that Bryer's phone didn't receive his dad's messages, so the "family" may just be his grandma via phone call. The rest were Kam's family, probably contacted via Kam's phone.

RCMP also knew on July 21 which "friends" were contacted, and probably from what location. We may never know.

They probably turned on "airplane mode" after this press release.

 

[Jan424]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

I thought I recall seeing a Mod’s post a short time ago saying we weren’t allowed to label them spree killers or any other type, for that matter.... could be wrong about that tho. I didn’t want to go there if we couldn’t.

 

[Jan424]

Also, I happened upon this little gem. It's Kam's graduation ceremony held on June 21st, 2018 at 8pm. The video quality wavers between good to potato quality atrocious. Also, pardon that it's a Facebook link. Apparently Port Alberni News live streamed it. Check it out. At the 2:53 mark in the video, is that Kam in the white button down shirt and tie? The video gets pixelated but the guy has the same slight stoop in his posture that Kam characteristically has. I'm not 100% but I think it's him. Curious what others think and I apologize for those who don't have Facebook, it won't let me save the video. Ugh... Anyway, there's two links, so I'll post both of them.

Eighth Avenue Learning Centre graduation... - Alberni Valley News

Alberni Valley News

This video really is a little gem.... hard to say for sure but definitely could be Kam.... tall, slight stoop as you point out, and looks like he’s got a beard too! IMO

 

[Lexiintoronto]

This was discussed here earlier. Robbery is no longer included as a factor of 1st degree murder in Canada’s Criminal Code. There was an excellent article including the date when the Supreme Court tossed it and I’ll see if I can find it again. So regardless if robbery occurred, the Crown must prove the defendant premeditated the murder of the victim in order to support a 1st degree charge. Intent to kill, but not premeditation, is required for 2nd degree and dependant on what caused LDs death, it appears that element was satisfied.

Criminal Code

That’s what confuses me.

If you use a gun during a robbery and the victim dies, how is that not 1st degree murder?

Especially when the killers are two men with guns.

I’m wondering if only one shot may have been fired, and that may factor into the charges of second-degree murder as opposed to first-degree murder.

(Based on the information the RCMP had at the time. They may now have more information and had they lived, the suspects may have faced 1st-degree murder charges.)

The case that follows is unique as it was a police officer involved and charged while on duty, but the type of charges he faced came down to the sequence of shots fired.

Some shots rendered the suspect that was shot incapacitated, paralyzed. Then the officer continued to shoot.

The separation of the two volleys was vital to Forcillo’s conviction and formed the basis for his appeal. A jury found Forcillo not guilty of second-degree murder in connection to the first volley, but convicted him of attempted murder for the second.

Within less than a minute of arriving on scene, Forcillo fired nine shots at Yatim in two distinct volleys separated by 5.5 seconds. He first fired three bullets, including the fatal shot to Yatim’s heart, then fired six more as Yatim lay on the floor of the streetcar, paralyzed and dying.

Court of Appeal upholds conviction for Toronto cop who shot Sammy Yatim | The Star

 

[FactFinder3000]

If you use a gun during a robbery and the victim dies, how is that not 1st degree murder?

[...]

In order for it to be 1st degree murder it must be shown that the murder was "planned and deliberate." Not just the robbery, but the actual murder. That can be very difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt.