Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #3

[Salah11]

I wonder if she's allowed to contact them?

That’s a good point but surely as she hasn’t been charged she should get some kind of interaction with them?


I am sure somebody who knows the laws better than me will know

 

[sceawian]

Yes, JennieM posted a link earlier today that said the Pattersons had been interred. It was in the link in the post about the planned memorial service.

Perhaps the conflicting stories were a way to prevent EP from showing up?

I REALLY hope she did not attend the funeral. Honestly, I'm not sure she could've anyway; there was a non-zero possibility she'd get lynched.

I think whether the children did or did not attend depends on who has custody - I don't think it's been definitively stated whether they've gone into the care system, or are with their Dad/other relative?

 

[MissTwiddle]

I wonder if she's allowed to contact them?

Moo - I think she is as she complained that the press were outside the house where her kids were staying

JMO as it seems logical she is in contact if she is complaining about that

 

[jjenny]

On the show, they had a Swiss mushroom expert (now lives in Australia) who used to work at one of the 10 mushroom-inspection stations in Bern. The Swiss have such a problem with poisonous mushrooms that they set up lots of these stations throughout Switzerland for foragers to have their mushrooms looked at.

The Aussie toxicologist on the show said that it is possible that the police may have to send samples overseas to a place that is more familiar with mushroom poisonings, to get assistance with test results. (It was his own speculation.)

Australia presumably should have a place that is an expert in death cap?

 

[jjenny]

Moo - I think she is as she complained that the press were outside the house where her kids were staying

JMO as it seems logical she is in contact if she is complaining about that

She has a sister who therefore is children's aunt. Maybe the children are with their aunt?

 

[jjenny]

Yes it makes sense to cover their backs. I am amazed that LE are not moving more quickly here surely if she is guilty of poisoning 4 people she is a danger to the community.

IMO

Well hopefully community is not going to be attending her lunches and dinners.

 

[Ellery84]

Well hopefully community is not going to be attending her lunches and dinners.

I agree, if she has committed this crime, she possibly could be a danger to the community.

Moo

 

[jepop]

Moo - I think she is as she complained that the press were outside the house where her kids were staying

JMO as it seems logical she is in contact if she is complaining about that

Well if that's true, the press should leave the kids alone and take a hike Jmo.

 

[MsMarple]

Australia presumably should have a place that is an expert in death cap?

I thought the ex relatives were transferred to Austin Hospital specifically because medical staff are equipped to deal with infectious diseases and other public health concerns including poisons. They also have comprehensive diagnostic equipment, an ICU and can handle emergencies.

EP was sent to Monash Medical Centre for care for her symptoms so IMO she wasn’t deemed critical.

Austin Health: Referrals

www.austin.org.au

 

[kittythehare]

Tragic message on mud-covered note at eerie grave of mushroom victims

A mud-covered note on an unmarked grave has revealed the final eerie resting place of a couple who died from a suspected mushroom poisoning.

www.dailymail.co.uk

appalling 'journalism'.
This is so invasive.
To photograph the notes on the flowers sent..
They just do not know where to stop.

 

[jepop]

appalling 'journalism'.
This is so invasive.
To photograph the notes on the flowers sent..
They just do not know where to stop.

Sickening. Jmo

 

[kittythehare]

The police were at the rubbish dump on Tuesday, looking for microwave trays and other kitchen utensils.
The private investigator had spoken with the workers. He said the workers have been told not to talk to the media.
He said there is also CCTV at the rubbish dump, which the police would have.

The former Major Crimes detective said that the police would have gone to all the local dumps looking for the same items. Not only the rubbish dump where EP is said to have dumped the dehydrator.

The private investigator said there are two dumps in the area. The one that EP said she went to, and another one that is closer to her home.

(from the Under Investigation show)

Did it point towards her guilt or examine any other possibilities?

 

[SouthAussie]

Australia presumably should have a place that is an expert in death cap?

I was wondering if the toxicologist said that because he thought that they may need more experienced (mushroom) help to discount any other poison being involved. To cover all bases legally.

When the show comes up on the internet I will try to rewatch and get the exact context of why he said that. It wasn't easy to catch it all on the first watch. There was lots and lots of mushroom talk.

 

[SouthAussie]

Did it point towards her guilt or examine any other possibilities?

It did examine if it could have been a mistake, to add poisoned mushrooms to the mushroom coating. No real consensus.

Both the private investigator (who is also a former detective) and the former Major Crimes detective thought that the police will get to the bottom of what happened.

 

[MsMarple]

I was wondering if the toxicologist said that because he thought that they may need more experienced (mushroom) help to discount any other poison being involved. To cover all bases legally.

When the show comes up on the internet I will try to rewatch and get the exact context of why he said that. It wasn't easy to catch it all on the first watch. There was lots and lots of mushroom talk.

Is this the same forensic toxicologist that appeared on the show? Dr. Robertson?

Yes in the article linked below he said the toxicologist needs to establish a standard in order to proceed:

"They may have to purchase some additional standards or compounds that are known toxins so that then the laboratory can compare what they find in the urine, to what is known to be the toxin … and that process might take a couple of weeks," he says.

He says the relative rarity of mushroom toxins means a standard might have to be procured from interstate or overseas, potentially delaying the process.

"If it were cocaine and this was a high profile case, you could get the results in 24 hours, or 48 hours," he says.

"When you get these unusual cases, it can take a little bit longer to do."

Dr Robertson says once a "standard" of the mushroom toxin has been obtained, toxicologists will be able to tell with "scientific certainty" whether someone had those toxins in their body at the time of their death.

What happens when you eat a death cap mushroom?

The deaths of three Victorians after a Saturday lunch in the small town of Leongatha sent shock waves through the community, but also shone the spotlight on one of the most poisonous organisms on earth.

www.abc.net.au

 

[SouthAussie]

Is this the same forensic toxicologist that appeared on the show? Dr. Robertson?

Yes in the article linked below he said the toxicologist needs to establish a standard in order to proceed:

"They may have to purchase some additional standards or compounds that are known toxins so that then the laboratory can compare what they find in the urine, to what is known to be the toxin … and that process might take a couple of weeks," he says.

He says the relative rarity of mushroom toxins means a standard might have to be procured from interstate or overseas, potentially delaying the process.


"When you get these unusual cases, it can take a little bit longer to do."

Dr Robertson says once a "standard" of the mushroom toxin has been obtained, toxicologists will be able to tell with "scientific certainty" whether someone had those toxins in their body at the time of their death.

What happens when you eat a death cap mushroom?

The deaths of three Victorians after a Saturday lunch in the small town of Leongatha sent shock waves through the community, but also shone the spotlight on one of the most poisonous organisms on earth.

www.abc.net.au

Yes, same toxicologist. That explanation makes sense and is likely the context in which he made the remark. Thanks.

 

[SouthAussie]

Also she went to the rubbish dump on the Saturday. I think they said in the morning before the lunch. The investigator said he only found that out because one of their employees slipped up and said he wasn't working on the Saturday!

From the show "under Investigation" Channel 9

Yes, the worker said that he wasn't working that Saturday morning.

 

[kittythehare]

i am assuming she lived with her two children and that nobody else lived in that house.
Her 2 children disliked mushrooms so any she had in the house would have been for her own personal use alone.
Unless she was having guests.

How often did she entertain guests?
was it a rare or frequent occurrence?

I cannot get a sense of her personality at all and find myself grasping at straws constantly.

 

[jjenny]

I thought the ex relatives were transferred to Austin Hospital specifically because medical staff are equipped to deal with infectious diseases and other public health concerns including poisons. They also have comprehensive diagnostic equipment, an ICU and can handle emergencies.

EP was sent to Monash Medical Centre for care for her symptoms so IMO she wasn’t deemed critical.

Austin Health: Referrals

www.austin.org.au

Her samples should be analyzed for any presence of the toxin.

 

[jjenny]

i am assuming she lived with her two children and that nobody else lived in that house.
Her 2 children disliked mushrooms so any she had in the house would have been for her own personal use alone.
Unless she was having guests.

How often did she entertain guests?
was it a rare or frequent occurrence?

I cannot get a sense of her personality at all and find myself grasping at straws constantly.

She claimed her children disliked mushrooms, but who knows if that's accurate. She also claimed she fed the children her beef wellington with mushrooms scrapped off. But if beef wellington had death cap mushrooms, it would still be poisonous. But her children apparently had no symptoms.