CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #5

[kkdj]

Sad to say it, but RT could go ahead and offer a million bucks for her safe return at this point.

The overwhelming odds are that his money would be perfectly safe.

The reason his money would be safe is because the overwhelming odds are that BT will never be returning safe from anywhere again.

JMO.

I sorry agree.

 

[Kapua]

BBM

I brought this time gap up quite awhile ago, but people seemed to think it was reasonable. Various ideas...they stopped for breakfast, shopped for supplies, etc.

As a former RVer I’ll just say that the usual plan is to do your shopping without the rig attached, hitch up and get on the road after breakfast. Running errands with an RV is just not something you normally do unless there is a big parking lot and it’s something you have to do (like drop off the dog) that can’t wait until you detach the truck.

I’m not saying it never happens, but I really think the time gap would be better explained by a stop along the road to eat lunch and to see something like the Pisgah Lava Caves or another interesting site along the way.

This makes perfect sense to me. They did stop to drop the dog at the kennel. Not sure if they did so with the RV attached or not. I either missed that, or it was not stated.

 

[10ofRods]

Yes, I'd think so too. I'm just a little confused about where this is going. Do you think she's in the Lava Tubes? MOO

I think people are trying to point out that there are features that could hide a body.

I think it would be very hard to murder someone at the lava tubes (there are more people there than at some random spot in the desert) so a kidnapper wouldn't choose such a place. It would be hard to carry an already dead person to the tubes.

The perfect murder out that way would be made to look like someone died of heat stroke, although if one was interested in making something look like an abduction, the tubes would work because really, wouldn't it take two people to transport even a lightweight person from the parking lot to the tubes - quickly?

Amboy Crater would look good as a dumping spot as well. Not far from Kelbaker/HH. If I were someone who was trying to make a murder look like an abduction, Amboy Crater area would come to mind (road is usually deserted, can see someone coming, lots of places to hide body, could claim a southbound car picked up the deceased and placed her there, parking big enough for almost any vehicle).

There's a road with a defunct airstrip-like thing where a truck and trailer could park on the non-touristed side of the crater, and the rocks out there are like a maze and, while really barren, also sort of like a frozen sea of rock with tons of dips and gullies.


And a trail...a trail leading right into that maze of rocks.

ETA: part of my point is that a body could be almost anywhere out there...so it's really hard for LE to find one, without some clues...I sure hope there are digital footprints.

 

[noel leon]

If the police had evidence of Barbara being on that walk with Rob , would they keep that from her son , her brother , her sweet nephew? Would they let a family suffer that way?

 

[distracted]

Some good 'detectives' in this case would be surveillance cams.

For instance-- is there any security footage at the kennels ?
Some places have them for the employee's safety.
(for instance-- if someone's dog is hurt and it wasn't the employee's fault -- the cameras would show what happened)

So, inside and out in the parking lot showing the front door/drop off areas ?

Then we'd know --at least at that time -- what Barbara was wearing.

Not sure why-- but the bikini description niggles at my mind.

We still don't know if the photo of her in the red visor and black bikini top were taken that day.

Thanks also to PommyMommy , and everyone else -- who have been contributing to this thread to help find Barbara.
That is all that matters.

I'm glad you brought this up because it's been bugging me. The timestamp of a photo taken with an iPhone can be changed. I have done it in the past and googled to see if it can still be done. And it can.

A quick Google search of "change iPhone photo timestamp" provided instructions.

 

[firstsleuth]

At the very beginning it was a few days, it has since been changed to 5 days from misquoted repeats.

kennel confirmed it. websleuths were the first to reach out

@dbdb11 ; I believe you are saying kennel confirmed 5 days (so would that mean 4 nights and pick up on Tuesday?) also, I believe you said Barbara’s HK flight was supposed to leave on Wednesday. IMO; no wonder she was stressed. Lots of travel plans prior to flying across the world. Thank you for clarifying

 

[Lilibet]

@dbdb11 ; I believe you are saying kennel confirmed 5 days (so would that mean 4 nights and pick up on Tuesday?) also, I believe you said Barbara’s HK flight was supposed to leave on Wednesday. IMO; no wonder she was stressed. Lots of travel plans prior to flying across the world. Thank you for clarifying

I thought pommymommy said BT was leaving for HK July 22.
CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #5

That would give her approximately 5 days to get ready after returning from the RV trip. Or is my math off?

 

[al66pine]

Pisgah Lava Tubes

July 22.
Also, I don't know anything about the Pisgah Lava Caves, but they're about an hour's drive from Kelbaker/Hidden Hill Rd. Google Maps

@PommyMommy Thanks for your post. You are the greatest.

I don't know much but if anyone is curious - wikipedia ppl are pretty smart. For ex.:
"Recreation The crater and much of the surrounding lava field are on private property. Despite this, the lava tubes in the area are a somewhat popular and easily accessible destination for caving. Historic Lavic Siding is to the east, with the Mojave National Preserve beyond."
^ Pisgah Crater - Wikipedia ^
And
http://www.vulcanospeleology.org/sym06/ISV6x15.pdf.
and a map:
Google Maps
And
Pisgah Crater, A Virtual Tour:
http://geology.campus.ad.csulb.edu/VIRTUAL_FIELD/Pisgah_Crater/pismain.htm

Lots more at wiki link.

 

[rosesfromangels]

@dbdb11 ; Lots of travel plans prior to flying across the world.

Respectfully snipped for commentary focus.
I have not been able to reconcile this point in my logic filter. Getting ready to fly to China to see an ailing brother, and going camping don’t add up.

We are missing a critical piece of info on this point.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[firstsleuth]

I thought pommymommy said BT was leaving for HK July 22.
CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #5

That would give her approximately 5 days to get ready after returning from the RV trip. Or is my math off?

No, unfortunately I posted that before I read PommyMommy ‘s post; I was just trying to find mine to correct when I saw yours. Thank you

ETA but I agree with @rosesfromangels

post immediately preceding mine

 

[ChuckMaureen]

SPECULATION

Wondering whom it was who wanted BT to wear a black bikini and red cap and to carry a beer-filled insulated travel mug that day?

How easily identifiable such an individual would be... such specific clothing and accessories... and who was supposed to key in on the individual donning such attire and who also would be "crossing that road" at some particular time frame?

Did BT simply "walk ahead" or was she instructed to do so, and by whom?

 

[al66pine]

He could take a second mortgage on the house.

I (think I) understand the thought ^ here, but who is to say there is even a first mortgage on the house,
Has anyone checked prop. records, usu, avail by the county??

 

[gsleuth]

It's probable that since RT was the last person to have seen/been with BT, LE (via warrants) has collected RT's computer(s) and cell phone(s) and hopefully has also called for obtaining RT's cell phone data as collected by the carrier... of course to assist them in their attempts to locate BT.

Wondering if BT had actively used any computers that may have been in their house or libraries?

Wondering if RT's cell phone was fully powered up (i.e.: not fully powered off or battery removed) the entire day of July 12?

Wondering if there is a gap(s) in location data for RT's phone?

Wondering if BT has currently-prescribed medications? Were all medications taken (as verified by remaining quantities) up to the day she went missing?

Does BT have hobbies, such as stamp-making, picture-painting, clay modeling or whatever? Are there any works-in-progress; what are the themes, if any? Happy? Sad?

Ex-wives? Ex-husbands? Have they been contacted, questioned, whereabouts verified?

Good questions.

 

[topockaz]

Thanks for this info about the flyers/posters on the ground there. I work with trucking firms, etc to get the word out for the missing and I have heard back from several of them that their trucks will have the flyers.
Also, drivers in that area have been made aware. I cannot mention the firms by name.
Hoping to help,
Chi

I was in Laughlin today, at the Riverside Casino, took the grandkids home who live in Bullhead City, shopped in Fort Mohave and I didn't see any flyers or posters anywhere.

 

[gsleuth]

SPECULATION

Wondering whom it was who wanted BT to wear a black bikini and red cap and to carry a beer-filled insulated travel mug that day?

How easily identifiable such an individual would be... such specific clothing and accessories... and who was supposed to key in on the individual donning such attire and who also would be "crossing that road" at some particular time frame?

Did BT simply "walk ahead" or was she instructed to do so, and by whom?

the detail of beer in that insulated cup..?
an opportunist abducter notices a woman in a bikini with an insulated cup..that had no idea of it's contents.

 

[deugirtni]

the detail of beer in that insulated cup..?
an opportunist abducter notices a woman in a bikini with an insulated cup..that had no idea of it's contents.

How do we know the beer was in an insulated cup? I thought she had a beer bottle? If cup, then yes, how would anyone have known it was beer?? But yet, the narrative we're being given by the person who was with her, suggests she was a target BECAUSE of that beer, along with the bikini. Hmm.

 

[dbdb11]

@dbdb11 ; I believe you are saying kennel confirmed 5 days (so would that mean 4 nights and pick up on Tuesday?) also, I believe you said Barbara’s HK flight was supposed to leave on Wednesday. IMO; no wonder she was stressed. Lots of travel plans prior to flying across the world. Thank you for clarifying

nobody i spoke to said five days. i have never heard five days. her flight was scheduled to arrive in hk on july 23.

the kennel confirmed nobody else had made contact to ask questions regarding Barbara Thomas. until LE say something of consequence, Websleuths is leading the investigation.

my own opinion.

Besides this public forum there are upwards of forty damned fine sleuths communicating with me, and helping to find Barbara.

my own opinion.

Waiting and hoping someone who knew or worked with Robbie can chime in to offer insight...

also if anyone in the area can share the numbers/contact info for gas stations in the area, especially one with a circle k in it, id like to send them posters and flyers and photos they can tape up.

I reached out to one last night and they hadn't even heard of Barbara Thomas! But now they know and they were very friendly and helpful.

 

[dbdb11]

SPECULATION

Wondering whom it was who wanted BT to wear a black bikini and red cap and to carry a beer-filled insulated travel mug that day?

How easily identifiable such an individual would be... such specific clothing and accessories... and who was supposed to key in on the individual donning such attire and who also would be "crossing that road" at some particular time frame?

Did BT simply "walk ahead" or was she instructed to do so, and by whom?

edit: i agree

 

[Lilibet]

@dbdb11 You are doing an amazing job! I’m so glad you have so many working with you.

The longer this goes on, and the less RT seems to do, the harder it is to maintain my benefit-of-the-doubt victim-friendly attitude. It reminds me too much of my first case here on WS six years ago when Stephanie Warner’s boyfriend was the last to see her and things just didn’t add up. He made one half-hearted plea for her to return, but didn’t search for her in the mountains he knew so well. He didn’t put up posters. He didn’t organize anyone to help. He just moved into her house and partied. Because family lived far away, it ended up being Websleuthers who did the sleuthing and publicity. I wish I could say she was found and her boyfriend was arrested but unfortunately that didn’t happen. At least we tried. And we still keep a hopeful vigil on her thread.

All I can say is, keep on keeping on with the helpers here that you have. I’m sure you are informing LE of all information you dig up. Be their partner. You may have to politely but firmly hold their feet to the fire so that they will continue the investigation, but keep it up.

I will leave you with this valuable advice/pep talk from Dave Van Norman who was a San Bernardino County deputy coroner’s investigator. I don’t know if he is still working, but his contact info is at the end of the article, although it may be outdated. He gives detailed advice to families of missing persons and ends his article...

A missing person is too important to be left to one person. Those family members who wish to “leave it to the professionals,” and sit back on the couch to let the police do the work will probably get out of this what they put into it. I prefer the Team Approach, with the family involved in a productive way. We must help law enforcement to accomplish this mission, and if they do not know how, we can show them the way.

Will law enforcement accept your assistance? Perhaps not willingly. We in law enforcement tend to think that we don’t need any help, and some investigators will view the family as hindrance. That’s too bad. The missing person is YOUR LOVED ONE. You may have to be insistent. You may ruffle some feathers. Is there anything more important?

Everything You Need to Know When Your Loved One Goes Missing | Justice In Miami #Justice4Lily

More links to David Van Norman:
David Van Norman - IMDb
Confessions of a coroner

 

[Officer Dibble]

Respectfully snipped for commentary focus.
I have not been able to reconcile this point in my logic filter. Getting ready to fly to China to see an ailing brother, and going camping don’t add up.

We are missing a critical piece of info on this point.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I think the opposite to you, I think its entirely possible if you get into the mindset of how they lived.