CA CA - Marilyn Monroe, 36, Los Angeles, 5 Aug 1962

[shopper]

She would be 80 I think. If she stayed away from all the cosmetic stuff you are right on that.

I hope Marilyn somehow knows that she is still very much loved and adored by people. I remember that Mariah Carey bought some of MM's stuff at an auction, and has her piano. MC won't let it be photographed or anything and I remember thinking "who does Mariah think she is, to be stingy with MM's things? She wasn't related to MM". But then I was glad that MC was protective over MM, and not wanting to exploit her like others have done, like so called "friends" of MM's have done.

On that 48 Hours piece the other night, remember when that freak Jeanne Carmen said that MM called her wanting some sleeping pills? And JC said that she'd been drinking that night and didn't want to risk getting in trouble for drinking and driving? Well, was that a big deal in the early 60's like it is today, was that something to get arrested for back then? (I know you're close to my age and you don't know firsthand lol). But does anyone know? I wonder if that was JC's way of getting in on the hoopla, making their friendship more close than it really was? An example of her so called friends exploiting her IMO.

 

[michelle]

I hope Marilyn somehow knows that she is still very much loved and adored by people. I remember that Mariah Carey bought some of MM's stuff at an auction, and has her piano. MC won't let it be photographed or anything and I remember thinking "who does Mariah think she is, to be stingy with MM's things? She wasn't related to MM". But then I was glad that MC was protective over MM, and not wanting to exploit her like others have done, like so called "friends" of MM's have done.

On that 48 Hours piece the other night, remember when that freak Jeanne Carmen said that MM called her wanting some sleeping pills? And JC said that she'd been drinking that night and didn't want to risk getting in trouble for drinking and driving? Well, was that a big deal in the early 60's like it is today, was that something to get arrested for back then? (I know you're close to my age and you don't know firsthand lol). But does anyone know? I wonder if that was JC's way of getting in on the hoopla, making their friendship more close than it really was? An example of her so called friends exploiting her IMO.

I dont know if you would get arrested for drinking and driving back then.

 

[concernedperson]

I hope Marilyn somehow knows that she is still very much loved and adored by people. I remember that Mariah Carey bought some of MM's stuff at an auction, and has her piano. MC won't let it be photographed or anything and I remember thinking "who does Mariah think she is, to be stingy with MM's things? She wasn't related to MM". But then I was glad that MC was protective over MM, and not wanting to exploit her like others have done, like so called "friends" of MM's have done.

On that 48 Hours piece the other night, remember when that freak Jeanne Carmen said that MM called her wanting some sleeping pills? And JC said that she'd been drinking that night and didn't want to risk getting in trouble for drinking and driving? Well, was that a big deal in the early 60's like it is today, was that something to get arrested for back then? (I know you're close to my age and you don't know firsthand lol). But does anyone know? I wonder if that was JC's way of getting in on the hoopla, making their friendship more close than it really was? An example of her so called friends exploiting her IMO.

I don't believe the drinking and driving arrests aspect was enacted until the late 70's and early 80's. The 60's were wide open.

Marilyn was a pawn. Not sure if it is a murder situation at all.But she was vulnerable. People used her constantly but the purpose other than monetary gain is unclear to me.

 

[shopper]

I don't believe the drinking and driving arrests aspect was enacted until the late 70's and early 80's. The 60's were wide open.

Marilyn was a pawn. Not sure if it is a murder situation at all.But she was vulnerable. People used her constantly but the purpose other than monetary gain is unclear to me.

Thank you. As soon as Jeanne said it, my b.s. meter went off. She was trying to re-write history, and made that little slip-up IMO. Plus, that was back in the day when the studios made little problems go away, or covered them up. Unless Jeanne wasn't a big deal back then.


ETA this link: http://www.crimemagazine.com/05/marilynmonroe,0724-5.htm
I have no idea as to the reliability of this piece, but it seems as if I'm not the only one who doubts Jeanne Carmen's "friendship" to Marilyn and her credibility.

 

[kato]

Well, even if drinking and driving was not a law then it showed some common sense on her part. Law or not it should not happen. JMO

 

[gaia]

I remember seeing an interview with Jeanne years ago and she didn't use that drinking and driving defense back then. She just said she didn't want to take any pills to Marilyn in the middle of the night. As I recall, Jeanne said she could tell Marilyn was very drunk and already on pills and she just wasn't going to contribute further to that. Now, to me, THAT sounds like the real reason.


gaia

 

[Maral]

I hope Marilyn somehow knows that she is still very much loved and adored by people. I remember that Mariah Carey bought some of MM's stuff at an auction, and has her piano. MC won't let it be photographed or anything and I remember thinking "who does Mariah think she is, to be stingy with MM's things? She wasn't related to MM". But then I was glad that MC was protective over MM, and not wanting to exploit her like others have done, like so called "friends" of MM's have done.

On that 48 Hours piece the other night, remember when that freak Jeanne Carmen said that MM called her wanting some sleeping pills? And JC said that she'd been drinking that night and didn't want to risk getting in trouble for drinking and driving? Well, was that a big deal in the early 60's like it is today, was that something to get arrested for back then? (I know you're close to my age and you don't know firsthand lol). But does anyone know? I wonder if that was JC's way of getting in on the hoopla, making their friendship more close than it really was? An example of her so called friends exploiting her IMO.

History of drunk driving laws

The first jurisdiction in the United States of America to adopt laws against drunk driving was New York in 1910, with California and others following. Early laws simply prohibited driving while intoxicated, with no specific definition of what level of inebriation qualified. The first generally-accepted legal limit for blood alcohol concentration (BAC) was 0.15 (in 1938, the American Medical Association created a "Committee to Study Problems of Motor Vehicle Accidents"; at the same time, the National Safety Council set up a "Committee on Tests for Intoxication". After some study, these two groups came up with their findings: a driver with 0.15 BAC or higher could be presumed to be intoxicated; those under 0.15 could not).

In the US, most of the laws and penalties were greatly enhanced starting in the late 1970s, and through the 1990s, largely due to pressure from groups like Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD) and Students Against Driving Drunk (SADD) and leaders like Candy Lightner. These organizations — MADD in particular — are also widely cited for getting the drinking age raised to 21 in those states where it had once been lower. Also during this era, enforcement of drunk driving laws became a priority for police for the first time.

 

[shopper]

Well, even if drinking and driving was not a law then it showed some common sense on her part. Law or not it should not happen. JMO

I doubt anyone is arguing that it should happen. It just seemed as if she might have been applying today's laws to the 1960's. That's why I asked if anyone knew what the laws were back then.

Anyway, doesn't matter. According to the link I posted, she and MM may have only been mere aquaintences and if so, it's obvious she's tried to get some attention for herself.

 

[shopper]

History of drunk driving laws

The first jurisdiction in the United States of America to adopt laws against drunk driving was New York in 1910, with California and others following. Early laws simply prohibited driving while intoxicated, with no specific definition of what level of inebriation qualified. The first generally-accepted legal limit for blood alcohol concentration (BAC) was 0.15 (in 1938, the American Medical Association created a "Committee to Study Problems of Motor Vehicle Accidents"; at the same time, the National Safety Council set up a "Committee on Tests for Intoxication". After some study, these two groups came up with their findings: a driver with 0.15 BAC or higher could be presumed to be intoxicated; those under 0.15 could not).

In the US, most of the laws and penalties were greatly enhanced starting in the late 1970s, and through the 1990s, largely due to pressure from groups like Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD) and Students Against Driving Drunk (SADD) and leaders like Candy Lightner. These organizations — MADD in particular — are also widely cited for getting the drinking age raised to 21 in those states where it had once been lower. Also during this era, enforcement of drunk driving laws became a priority for police for the first time.

Interesting, thank you.

 

[Steely Dan]

Elton John's Candle In The Wind.


This is from my "This Day in History" daily email from the History Channel:


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

August 5: General Interest
1962 : Marilyn Monroe is found dead

On August 5, 1962, movie actress Marilyn Monroe is found dead in her home in Los Angeles. She was discovered lying nude on her bed, face down, with a telephone in one hand. Empty bottles of pills, prescribed to treat her depression, were littered around the room. After a brief investigation, Los Angeles police concluded that her death was "caused by a self-administered overdose of sedative drugs and that the mode of death is probable suicide."

Marilyn Monroe was born Norma Jean Mortenson in Los Angeles on June 1, 1926. Her mother was emotionally unstable and frequently confined to an asylum, so Norma Jean was reared by a succession of foster parents and in an orphanage. At the age of 16, she married a fellow worker in an aircraft factory, but they divorced a few years later. She took up modeling in 1944 and in 1946 signed a short-term contract with 20th Century Fox, taking as her screen name Marilyn Monroe. She had a few bit parts and then returned to modeling, famously posing nude for a calendar in 1949.

She began to attract attention as an actress in 1950 after appearing in minor roles in the The Asphalt Jungle and All About Eve. Although she was onscreen only briefly playing a mistress in both films, audiences took note of the blonde bombshell, and she won a new contract from Fox. Her acting career took off in the early 1950s with performances in Love Nest (1951), Monkey Business (1952), and Niagara (1953). Celebrated for her voluptuousness and wide-eyed charm, she won international fame for her sex-symbol roles in Gentlemen Prefer Blondes (1953), How to Marry a Millionaire (1953), and There's No Business Like Show Business (1954). The Seven-Year Itch (1955) showcased her comedic talents and features the classic scene where she stands over a subway grating and has her white skirt billowed up by the wind from a passing train. In 1954, she married baseball great Joe DiMaggio, attracting further publicity, but they divorced eight months later.

In 1955, she studied with Lee Strasberg at the Actors Studio in New York City and subsequently gave a strong performance as a hapless entertainer in Bus Stop (1956). In 1956, she married playwright Arthur Miller. She made The Prince and the Showgirl--a critical and commercial failure--with Laurence Olivier in 1957 but in 1959 gave an acclaimed performance in the hit comedy Some Like It Hot. Her last role, in The Misfits (1961), was directed by John Huston and written by Miller, whom she divorced just one week before the film's opening.

By 1961, Monroe, beset by depression, was under the constant care of a psychiatrist. Increasingly erratic in the last months of her life, she lived as a virtual recluse in her Brentwood, Los Angeles, home. After midnight on August 5, 1962, her maid, Eunice Murray, noticed Monroe's bedroom light on. When Murray found the door locked and Marilyn unresponsive to her calls, she called Monroe's psychiatrist, Dr. Ralph Greenson, who gained access to the room by breaking a window. Entering, he found Marilyn dead, and the police were called sometime after. An autopsy found a fatal amount of sedatives in her system, and her death was ruled probable suicide.

In recent decades, there have been a number of conspiracy theories about her death, most of which contend that she was murdered by John and/or Robert Kennedy, with whom she allegedly had love affairs. These theories claim that the Kennedys killed her (or had her killed) because they feared she would make public their love affairs and other government secrets she was gathering. On August 4, 1962, Robert Kennedy, then attorney general in his older brother's cabinet, was in fact in Los Angeles. Two decades after the fact, Monroe's housekeeper, Eunice Murray, announced for the first time that the attorney general had visited Marilyn on the night of her death and quarreled with her, but the reliability of these and other statements made by Murray are questionable.

Four decades after her death, Marilyn Monroe remains a major cultural icon. The unknown details of her final performance only add to her mystique.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[SleuthyMama]

Thanks for starting the thread SD. Her death has always intrigued me. I do believe she was murdered by the Kennedy's to keep her quiet.

 

[angelmom]

Thanks for that. I have always heard the stories but never read that much detail.

I wonder if there were ever any other witnesses who could confirm or rule out RK's presence there that night.

I wonder what reasons were given by those who doubted the maid's testimony - did they think she came up with that story just for money or what?

Now I'm curious.

 

[Steely Dan]

Thanks for starting the thread SD. Her death has always intrigued me. I do believe she was murdered by the Kennedy's to keep her quiet.

Check out this site.


Like any conspiracy site separating truth from fiction is sometimes hard. I found this intriguing;

Allegedly when Deborah Gould asked her ex-husband, Peter Lawford, how Marilyn had died he told her that, ‘Marilyn took her last big enema.’

Oddly enough her colon showed congestion and purplish discoloration and it was shown impossible for her to have swallowed the pills or been injected with them. Evidence of yellow dye should have been found in the digestive tract-especially in an empty stomach. Coroner Nogushi found no trace of yellow dye. Sometimes the residue moves to the duodenum but they found none there either.

Marilyn Monroe would have had to of swallowed 52-89 capsules to achieve her percentages of the drug in her blood. No case has yet to be reported in which anyone has swallowed over 12 capsules without leaving any residue in the stomach. Yet Marilyn had no residue at all.

Joe Hyams, a reporter, tried to obtain Monroe’s phone records. A employee at the phone company told him “All hell’s broken loose down here. Apparently you’re not the only one interested in Marilyn’s calls. The tapes disappeared…. I’m told it was impounded by men in dark suits and well-shined shoes…. Somebody high up ordered it.”

 

[Steely Dan]

 

[SleuthyMama]

Thanks for the link SD. Much of it I have read before in a few of the MM biographies but that tidbit about Louise Dimaggio at the end was pretty interesting.

I do see how it could be a toss up between the Kennedys and the mob. Although at that time they were pretty tied up with each other, what with their relationship w/ Frank Sinatra. Pretty incestuous to say the least.

My mom was a huge MM fan and that's how I got interested at first. I read all the books my mother had on her and the part about how there was no barbituate residue in her stomach is what always stuck with me.

 

[Hopeful One]

Fascinating stuff. Like angelmom said, I hadn't ever learned that much in-depth info before. Now I'm very curious as well.

Is her autopsy report available online?

 

[Hopeful One]

Another question: Does anyone know what medication she supposedly overdosed on? I thought I read somewhere that it was chroral hydrate, which is what Anna Nicole Smith overdosed on. But that's a sleeping aid, not a medication used for treating depression, which is what is claimed to have killed her in the article posted above.

 

[Hopeful One]

I just answered my own question, thanks to the link above.

Here is the full autopsy report in case anyone else is also interested: http://www.marilynmonroemurdered.com/autopsy.htm

 

[Steely Dan]

The part I have a problem with from the, self alleged hitman in the asylum, is that he says they got the diary. However, it was never dropped off to a media outlet to really embarrass the Kennedy's. If it had mob info in it then they could've just pulled those pages out. I'm not ruling out a mob hit just what he said. After all he was in an asylum.

 

[SleuthyMama]

The part I have a problem with from the, self alleged hitman in the asylum, is that he says they got the diary. However, it was never dropped off to a media outlet to really embarrass the Kennedy's. If it had mob info in it then they could've just pulled those pages out. I'm not ruling out a mob hit just what he said. After all he was in an asylum.

I feel you. My gut leans more toward Kennedys than mob. It's pretty well known that Peter Lawford was their cleanup guy of sorts. So the comment from his wife sounds pretty on target.

Also, would the asylum guy, having worked on keeping himself away from his own mob hit really spill the beans to some guy working on the phone line in the hospital? I suppose anything is possible but it just doesn't seem too likely to me.

The diary does interest me. Amazing after all this time it's never popped up. I remember a Vanity Fair article from last year maybe about a ton of MM's things that were going up for auction and whole scandal about the guy who had the items...he was a scammer, I think? Are you familiar with that part of the story?