Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #4

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Wonderful. It’s so important to get the local vibe and familiarity with the land. Thanks for sounding in. Seriously. You can really help fill in the geo aspect of hiding a crime. Any recycling, landfill or waste systems between or around the cities?
Unfortunately, I don’t know. I don’t live in the area. I just have a bit of knowledge of Bakersfield and the area around the 58 because it’s the mid-way child exchange point for my ex-husband and I.
 
Snipped and bbm

I think she would be the one to break first. Although, she appears confident, I think that may be because he is doing all the talking and she is merely backup when deemed necessary.
I pray to God she is smart enough to start talking to the DA with a representative. She needs to end this farce. Step up girl.

amateur opinion and speculation
 
So the dogs hit on what is reported to be the scent of these two boys, inside the house, but don't hit on the scent outside the house? I wonder what items were used to get the original scent for the canines.

TW says for certain the boys were outside. Doesn't add up. Scent found inside, no scent found outside, TW says boys were outside. How can that be?

Neighbors report never seeing the boys. Never? As in, never, ever saw them? Since September? That right there I find amazing. I think I also read NONE of the 6 children reported to be living in the home were ever seen by neighbors?

Then there's that reported last time they were seen was by Grandma.

I dunno. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say, and it's my opinion only, but I'm going to postulate that those boys were never in that home. And, IF they were in that home at some time prior, they were out of there long before the evening they were reported missing. Long enough for any scent to dissipate, assuming the scent given the canines was indeed the scent of those two boys.

So I look to Bakersfield for answers. And if/when that dead ends, then.....

I speculate these two boys may have been missing for much longer, possibly days, weeks, or even months. But why? Why would the adopted parents bring the entire thing to light by making that 911 call? I mean, if they were involved in some nefarious activity, and nobody has said a word, and nothing has been reported, then why would they make it a national issue all of sudden?

Or, maybe those boys were squirreled out of that house under cover, but unbeknownst to the other 4 children living there?

And why, or what, would lead LE to conclude foul play? Does LE think the dogs were wrong, that they just had bad sniffers that day, and the story is true, and those boys went out that gate, and were kidnapped by someone who just happened to be driving by, and said, HEY, maybe I'll take those kids right there?

Nah, MOO, I think something very bad has happened to these boys, and the entire convoluted story is fabricated to cover it up.

Go easy on me, I've just read up on this thing, and haven't read the entire 4 threads thus far :)
 
So the dogs hit on what is reported to be the scent of these two boys, inside the house, but don't hit on the scent outside the house? I wonder what items were used to get the original scent for the canines.

TW says for certain the boys were outside. Doesn't add up. Scent found inside, no scent found outside, TW says boys were outside. How can that be?

Neighbors report never seeing the boys. Never? As in, never, ever saw them? Since September? That right there I find amazing. I think I also read NONE of the 6 children reported to be living in the home were ever seen by neighbors?

Then there's that reported last time they were seen was by Grandma.

I dunno. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say, and it's my opinion only, but I'm going to postulate that those boys were never in that home. And, IF they were in that home at some time prior, they were out of there long before the evening they were reported missing. Long enough for any scent to dissipate, assuming the scent given the canines was indeed the scent of those two boys.

So I look to Bakersfield for answers. And if/when that dead ends, then.....

I speculate these two boys may have been missing for much longer, possibly days, weeks, or even months. But why? Why would the adopted parents bring the entire thing to light by making that 911 call? I mean, if they were involved in some nefarious activity, and nobody has said a word, and nothing has been reported, then why would they make it a national issue all of sudden?

Or, maybe those boys were squirreled out of that house under cover, but unbeknownst to the other 4 children living there?

And why, or what, would lead LE to conclude foul play? Does LE think the dogs were wrong, that they just had bad sniffers that day, and the story is true, and those boys went out that gate, and were kidnapped by someone who just happened to be driving by, and said, HEY, maybe I'll take those kids right there?

Nah, MOO, I think something very bad has happened to these boys, and the entire convoluted story is fabricated to cover it up.

Go easy on me, I've just read up on this thing, and haven't read the entire 4 threads thus far :)
when the chief says "foul play" and that "someone picked them up" I think he specifically leaves room for interpretation (of outsiders being involved) but in reality believes the parents are behind it, as we have watched exactly where (or who) LE has been investigating. MOO
 
I’m still catching up on the last couple of pages of this thread so forgive me, but I’m really struggling to believe the other four children saw O and O on Dec 19, unless it was Dec 19 of 2019. If - IF - there was an abusive situation going on in the home, and I was 10 or younger, I’m pretty sure I’d stick with what my parents told me to say. I’d be way more afraid of my parents than the nice police officers.
I just can’t buy it. IMO of course. I just think children in abusive ( even if “only” emotional abuse ) situations learn a hard lesson early and well about crossing their parent(s).
My mother was very emotionally abusive (never physically, but scars are scars) and they could have threatened me with life in prison and I would not have gone against her story at a young age.
 
Ugh exactly. Whaaaaat?

And then this little gem:
(Bayan’s reference to bio mom and then question about foul play)
TW:
“That’s understandable. I would think the same thing.
I mean- That’s exactly the point. And if we can find our, find our babies, then guess what? That’s, that’s no.”

Are you freaking kidding? Wth kind of response is that? o_O:mad:
This was my
Yeah, that was definitely the strangest part of the interview. What is exactly the point? That it's their fault the kids went missing?
i ageee they seem to subconsciously tell on themselves. Like “that’s the point “ if we find them, “that’s no” because we wont. This interview . I could convict them with so many assumptions. But that’s just my assumptions . I wish they’d get it all out already they would feel better ! Oof
 
People would have heard me screaming several blocks away. I would have been so hysterical in that situation that the neighbors would have probably called the police for me based on my current state. MOO
I would have been banging down every neighbor door and screaming their names and begging for help but that’s the thing we want to remove from a case Becuase not everyone acts the same .. however we have seen in the past . The innocent don’t act like these two did.
 
Actually, after watching again, it also appears the children enter the van through the front passenger door when they are departing the house. Maybe they use that front passenger door for loading and unloading the kids & the little ones did exit when they returned. The camera may not have caught it because the van door blocks the view. IMO

As someone else said, they could've picked O & O up from grandma's house at the same time they dropped the 4 older boys off?
I don't think so. As TW Specifically stated the two littles stay with them because they watch them. Not the GP, not aunts or uncles,or anyone else. Just him and JW. MOO
 
So the dogs hit on what is reported to be the scent of these two boys, inside the house, but don't hit on the scent outside the house? I wonder what items were used to get the original scent for the canines.

TW says for certain the boys were outside. Doesn't add up. Scent found inside, no scent found outside, TW says boys were outside. How can that be?

Neighbors report never seeing the boys. Never? As in, never, ever saw them? Since September? That right there I find amazing. I think I also read NONE of the 6 children reported to be living in the home were ever seen by neighbors?

Then there's that reported last time they were seen was by Grandma.

I dunno. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say, and it's my opinion only, but I'm going to postulate that those boys were never in that home. And, IF they were in that home at some time prior, they were out of there long before the evening they were reported missing. Long enough for any scent to dissipate, assuming the scent given the canines was indeed the scent of those two boys.

So I look to Bakersfield for answers. And if/when that dead ends, then.....

I speculate these two boys may have been missing for much longer, possibly days, weeks, or even months. But why? Why would the adopted parents bring the entire thing to light by making that 911 call? I mean, if they were involved in some nefarious activity, and nobody has said a word, and nothing has been reported, then why would they make it a national issue all of sudden?

Or, maybe those boys were squirreled out of that house under cover, but unbeknownst to the other 4 children living there?

And why, or what, would lead LE to conclude foul play? Does LE think the dogs were wrong, that they just had bad sniffers that day, and the story is true, and those boys went out that gate, and were kidnapped by someone who just happened to be driving by, and said, HEY, maybe I'll take those kids right there?

Nah, MOO, I think something very bad has happened to these boys, and the entire convoluted story is fabricated to cover it up.

Go easy on me, I've just read up on this thing, and haven't read the entire 4 threads thus far :)

I'm going to guess that furniture, bedding, and other items with the boys scent made the move from Bakersfield and the boys did not. This would account for dogs picking up the scent inside the house but not outside, as the boys were, Imo, never outside or inside the new house, only items with their scent.
 
I think CPS would remove all the children if there were past allegations of abuse, or if their investigation uncovered signs of abuse or neglect.

Every situation is different. Children can be healthy but if they are not up to date in annual medical checkups, immunizations or dentist appointments, or if they have a record of excessive absences from school, truancy, etc, it is considered neglect. Imo

In this case the Wests were able to foster several children and were approved for adoption so I would think the children were well cared for. CPS must have a reason, though.

The Police Chief made it clear that taking all the children from the home was the call of CPS.

I believe that CPS takes steps to protect all children perceived to be in danger -- including any danger that might be directed at the parents-- and not necessarily to protect them from their parents. It's possible that the parents voluntarily requested CPS take custody.

For example, what if the missing boys were abducted from the home and the parents fear the same could happen to their other children... I recall a case where a father was asked by CPS to leave the family home (not permitted to be around his sons) after his 5-year-old daughter was abducted. And he was INNOCENT. He voluntarily complied.

Always better to defer on the side of caution when it comes to children.

MOO
 
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Bump Police Chief comments on CPS call to remove all the children from the home.

According to Police Chief, this was the decision of Child Services.

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: Police chief reveals new details about missing California City toddler brothers


23 ABC News -- Jan 22, 2021


16:46
why until we can we can determine
16:50
uh what happened to the other two kids
16:52
um
16:53
and determine well then it's up to uh
16:56
children's services

16:57
when they want to release the children
16:59
back to the parents
17:01
so at this point it's not really in
17:02
authority's hands you guys share

17:04
information with cps
17:06
they look at the situation and at this
17:08
point they're acting on their own and
17:10
deciding
17:10
what happens with the children correct
 
Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Department, says the boys' adoptive parents claim they left their California City house on Dec. 19 with their six children, to go do Christmas shopping in Bakersfield.

Security camera footage from a neighbor shows an adult holding the door open while four children go into the van. Then later that day two adults, which appear to be Trazell and Jacqueline West, come back to the house without any kids.

Chief Walker says the parents claim they dropped off four of their children, not including Orrin and Orson, at a family member's home that day. Walker says Dec. 19 was the last day the other four children say they saw Orrin and Orson.

New Security Cam footage on the days before West boys went missing

Simple math - 4+2=6
So 6-4 should = 2 but it doesn't-
Maybe Trezell & Jacqueline West are really bad at math, or simply didn't account for the fact a neighbor's camera would tell on them ...
 
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