CA - Rayanna Nail, 10, dies of drug OD, Klamath, 31 July 2009

[PeteyGirl]

That child was doomed I worked for a while (all I could possibly stand) in an adolescent treatment facility, with young children who seemed determined to self destruct, sniffing glue and paint propellants, finding pills and taking as many of them as they can, finding alcohol and drinking ENORMOUS amounts, unbelievable amounts, all at once and poisoning themselves

What with her mother's inability to do BASIC parenting, who disregarded the smallest measures to protect the child from herself, SHE should be the one behind bars held on bail.

I can see why Grandma is also being held accountable. This happened BEFORE. There's no excuse there either

But the mother . . . OMG. She is the most culpable of them all. To pay so little attention to her daughter that she did not notice the child was intoxicated, breathing funny (I checked on my kids at that age), which I'm sure she did for hours before she died.

Most of us blame ourselves for things that we couldn't possibly have controlled, when tragedy happens. Then there are those that do unspeakable things without a whit of conscience as they blame everyone else. . . they are as dangerous to society as any sociopath

 

[Boyz_Mum]

If I read correctly, it's been said that Rayanna OD'ed twice before and both times she was in her grandma's care? If that's the way it happened, who in their right mind would have let her step foot in grandma's house, ever, ever again?

 

[STEADFAST]

They didn't put up yesterday's article, but here's the image of yesterday's front page: http://triplicate.mycapture.com/mycapture/enlarge.asp?image=24996865&event=811329&CategoryID=36468

And the letter to the editor (there were no more today on the subject):
http://www.triplicate.com/20090807106637/Opinion/Letters/Letters-to-the-Editor-August-7-2009

I hope they get more letters like that.

 

[Salem]

Wow, imo, that mother wanted that child dead and some one better keep an eye on the other child still with her until he's an adult...... if not longer.

Okay - I haven't finished reading the thread and catching up yet - but this is exactly my thought. I'm thinking that mom's disease - Machusian (sp?) where they make the child sick so the parent can get sympathy and attention?

I don't think this child od'd 3 times - I think mom was giving her stuff and then telling the child she did it herself, so the child was confused about what was real and what wasn't. The child maybe felt like she didn't have any control over her own actions. I am totally speculating here, but all we have is mom's story and it is not ringing true to me.

Salem

 

[Salem]

I really hope LE thoroughly investigates this case and doesn't just take mom's word for what happened. They need to go back and look at the other od's again too. That mom would bring the child's urn to court is over the top. Much of what mom has done here appears to be over the top.

Very hinky, in my opinion.

Salem

 

[Boyz_Mum]

I really hope LE thoroughly investigates this case and doesn't just take mom's word for what happened. They need to go back and look at the other od's again too. That mom would bring the child's urn to court is over the top. Much of what mom has done here appears to be over the top.

Very hinky, in my opinion.

Salem

I found the headline about the urn in the courtroom pretty odd too. (Thanks Oblio for providing the photo of the newspaper.) I'm bothered by the itchy rash too. If Rayanna had an itchy rash and fever, is this normal to appear in an OD without other symptoms? I would think that difficulty breathing would be a symptom as well, but I don't know as I've never studied medicine. ( I've had an itchy rash from meds though and it got harder and harder to breath as I also had swelling. )

I just don't like how this all happened or is alleged to have happened. It doesn't seem right. JMO.

 

[OneLostGrl]

ohh God.

 

[OneLostGrl]

I really hope LE thoroughly investigates this case and doesn't just take mom's word for what happened. They need to go back and look at the other od's again too. That mom would bring the child's urn to court is over the top. Much of what mom has done here appears to be over the top.

Very hinky, in my opinion.

Salem

Which may have something to do with why her 10 year old daughter had two previous OD's (the mom being so over-the- top) so sad.

 

[OneLostGrl]

That child was doomed I worked for a while (all I could possibly stand) in an adolescent treatment facility, with young children who seemed determined to self destruct, sniffing glue and paint propellants, finding pills and taking as many of them as they can, finding alcohol and drinking ENORMOUS amounts, unbelievable amounts, all at once and poisoning themselves

What with her mother's inability to do BASIC parenting, who disregarded the smallest measures to protect the child from herself, SHE should be the one behind bars held on bail.

I can see why Grandma is also being held accountable. This happened BEFORE. There's no excuse there either

But the mother . . . OMG. She is the most culpable of them all. To pay so little attention to her daughter that she did not notice the child was intoxicated, breathing funny (I checked on my kids at that age), which I'm sure she did for hours before she died.

Most of us blame ourselves for things that we couldn't possibly have controlled, when tragedy happens. Then there are those that do unspeakable things without a whit of conscience as they blame everyone else. . . they are as dangerous to society as any sociopath

Ooohh thank you, Thank you for seeing this!!! :blowkiss:

 

[OneLostGrl]

I have never taken oxycontin but I would imagine anyone would be able to tell a child (or an adult that had never taken it) was deeply impaired by one.

I have taken Vicodin which is much milder than oxycontin and been sick as a dog from it. Taken Soma when I put my back out, out of it, deep sleep.

Not a mother, but I would also assume that any mother on this board would notice if their child was under the influence of narcotics. Especially if your child had ODed twice before.

My question is whether this girl was suicidal or how long has she been exposed to drugs (gestation?). For a child that young to take meds to the point of OD repeatedly, which would not be a fun experience, having your stomach pumped, the sore throat, the naseua. Not something most ten year olds would seek out and repeat and repeat.

Attention seeking? Early addict? Manchausen by proxy? Bio mom sure seems to loving the limelight and attention this is bringing her.....

Not if the mother is also an addict and passed out with or just like gramma. I was well on my way to becoming an addict at 12 but no one noticed because what I was on the same prescriptions my mother was on.

 

[OneLostGrl]

Are these drug addicted people taking narcotics? Or legit meds taken by people who need them? I understand that people leave pills on their tables and nightstands, I do as well. But the addicts I have been around pay more attention to their narcotics than their children.

And the only people I have EVER seen let their children roam about freely with adults that are popping pills to that degree are other drug addicts.

Many times the ones who take them for legit reasons are the ones who become addicted to them!

 

[Boyz_Mum]

Many times the ones who take them for legit reasons are the ones who become addicted to them!

I have to agree with you. Most of the people I've met who needed Fentanol (sp?) patches, would have gladly traded their condition for a regular life without drugs.

 

[OneLostGrl]

I'm highly suspicious of the mother. It's not uncommon for legimate users of Oxycontin to have one or more family members addicted to the medication. They wait until the owner of the med is "out of it" so to speak, and raid their pills. When they wake up, they know nothing of what went on. If pills come up short, they don't have the recall to accuse anyone of theft.

My scenario has the daughter getting into her mother's stash of pills that were stolen from g-ma. Mom goes over to g-mas house to verify that she's knocked out (not to clean), maybe to spread pills around but, she can't get into the safe. Instead she claims that she cleaned them up and put them back into the safe. She invents the potato, pills everywhere story to frame the g-ma. G-ma can't defend herself...she was out cold and knows nothing.

Usually it's the multiple user families that end up with the lock boxes (safes as this mother refered to it), they get sick of every time they pass out their meds end up MIA. The fights in homes like these are horrid, the finger pointing and accusing is stomach turning! My sister used to have to keep her key to her lock box in her work locker because her ex-husband always found it and stole all her oxy's.

 

[OneLostGrl]

she may detox, but staying clean is unlikely.

She isn't going to leave with new coping skills unless she really seeks them out.

I was thinking about my drug addict mother and her pills, addictions are ritualistic and pills to an addict are very very very valuable. I cannot think of one time my mother tossed pills around the house, couldn't keep track of them, etc....

She hid them around the house "for when she ran out", or at least she thought she did, i never actually saw proof of that occuring, the only portion of that that was visible was the dismantling the house looking for the pills she knew she hid somewhere.

I am not buying this passed out in a pile of pills.
This isn't alcohol where you pass out with the bottle in your hand.
Or herion where you wake up with needle in your arm.

This is take the pills, wash them down, have enough time for them to get into your system, pass out.

Spread around the house sounds like someone who wants to make someone else sound reckless and negligent.

ita!!

 

[Marina2]

Usually it's the multiple user families that end up with the lock boxes (safes as this mother refered to it), they get sick of every time they pass out their meds end up MIA. The fights in homes like these are horrid, the finger pointing and accusing is stomach turning! My sister used to have to keep her key to her lock box in her work locker because her ex-husband always found it and stole all her oxy's.

I know. I've seen this first hand. A family friend has terminal cancer. Each of his three sons, their girlfriends, and friends of their's wait until this man passes out and then steal all of his medication. I take that back, they leave a couple of pills for him occasionally. The fighting amongst themselves is wicked. Often, the man supplies them with pills for favors(rides to the doctor, food brought to the house, etc) because they won't lift a finger for him otherwise. This leads to fights over who did what for Dad and who is "owed" more for favors. It is stomach turning and even though the man is dying and needs the meds, he's enabled them to this point and is just as much to blame.

 

[Boyz_Mum]

I know. I've seen this first hand. A family friend has terminal cancer. Each of his three sons, their girlfriends, and friends of their's wait until this man passes out and then steal all of his medication. I take that back, they leave a couple of pills for him occasionally. The fighting amongst themselves is wicked. Often, the man supplies them with pills for favors(rides to the doctor, food brought to the house, etc) because they won't lift a finger for him otherwise. This leads to fights over who did what for Dad and who is "owed" more for favors. It is stomach turning and even though the man is dying and needs the meds, he's enabled them to this point and is just as much to blame.

This is so sad and maddening at the same time.

 

[impatientredhead]

Not if the mother is also an addict and passed out with or just like gramma. I was well on my way to becoming an addict at 12 but no one noticed because what I was on the same prescriptions my mother was on.

I completely concur. Everything about the mother in this case from her decision making, observation skills, and attention loving behavior scream addict to me.

Usually it's the multiple user families that end up with the lock boxes (safes as this mother refered to it), they get sick of every time they pass out their meds end up MIA. The fights in homes like these are horrid, the finger pointing and accusing is stomach turning! My sister used to have to keep her key to her lock box in her work locker because her ex-husband always found it and stole all her oxy's.

In my experience no one even has to steal the pills for it to be the source of blow out fights. Just the paranoia and obsession that they become.

When I was a freshman in high school my mother was CONVINCED that I had taken 40-50 of fluorinal 3s. She screamed, yelled, tore the house part, insisted that her boyfriend beat me with a belt until I told where they were or who I sold them to. Fortunately the boyfriend realized that my hysteria level seemed to indicate that I didn't have them. Of course this happened on a Friday so it went on all weekend.

Monday morning the pharmacy called her to let her know the rest of her meds had arrived and she could pick them up anytime. She didn't even apologize.

 

[Salem]

~Respectfully snipped~

That child was doomed I worked for a while (all I could possibly stand) in an adolescent treatment facility, with young children who seemed determined to self destruct, sniffing glue and paint propellants, finding pills and taking as many of them as they can, finding alcohol and drinking ENORMOUS amounts, unbelievable amounts, all at once and poisoning themselves

Hey Peteygirl! I'm happy to see you on this thread. Also Impatientredhead and One Lost Girl. It sounds as if all 3 of you have different levels of personal experience in this area - which is very helpful to the rest of us.

In your experience at the treatment facility - did you see children as young as 9/10? If so, was it common within the facility or, generally speaking, were the kids older?

Like many sleuths here, I grew up around drugs, and I was pretty street wise at the age of 10 - but I never thought about doing drugs until I was older. Not much older, mind you, but not till I was 12 or 13. I knew about drugs and could speak the lingo and once I even told a story about taking "reds" (can you tell how old I am :crazy, but the story was a lie. I don't remember any of my friends actually taking any drugs either. Most of what we knew came from older siblings and related to the illegal drug world. I am not familiar with folks that have become addicted to legal drugs.

I do have a hard time believing that this young girl of 10 stole Grandma's pills, came home, waited for dinner, ate dinner, played cards and then went to bed BEFORE she took the pills. Wouldn't that require a lot of restraint on the part of a 10-year? Then, according to mom, at some point she wakes up not feeling good.

Why didn't mom ask her why she was feeling bad if mom knew she was prone to steal drugs and had been to Grandma's where, apparently, drugs were laying around? Mom should have asked immediately when the girl returned if she took any of the drugs AND mom should have followed up when the girl said she didn't feel well and taken her to the hospital at that point.

I'm not believing mom here, not for a minute. Just too pat! Mom knew better if what she says is true.

Salem

 

[PeteyGirl]

In my SHORT (a year and a half) experience with kids in the treatment facility, it was rare for a child that young, but there were three or four that I remember. They'd been swigging alcohol from a younger age, almost always led on by an older sibling.

Some children are very bright and inquisitive, but their environment is SO destructive their brightness combines with their depression and pain and they do unimaginable things. Some of the kids will develop a major mental illness when they are older, like schizophrenia, and engage in these bizarre self destructive behaviors even in a good home.

I was shocked at how calculating a little child could be I think it is VERY rare for a child to be that self possessed, but possible.

Even more likely, the mother is lying to cover her own lack of attention because she herself was impaired in some way by alcohol or drugs and has no memory of anything that happened to the girl that evening. She's covering her own butt. THAT would be more likely than a little child being THAT cunning, having that kind of restraint

 

[OneLostGrl]

I completely concur. Everything about the mother in this case from her decision making, observation skills, and attention loving behavior scream addict to me.



In my experience no one even has to steal the pills for it to be the source of blow out fights. Just the paranoia and obsession that they become.

When I was a freshman in high school my mother was CONVINCED that I had taken 40-50 of fluorinal 3s. She screamed, yelled, tore the house part, insisted that her boyfriend beat me with a belt until I told where they were or who I sold them to. Fortunately the boyfriend realized that my hysteria level seemed to indicate that I didn't have them. Of course this happened on a Friday so it went on all weekend.

Monday morning the pharmacy called her to let her know the rest of her meds had arrived and she could pick them up anytime. She didn't even apologize.

Bold is mine-

Course not, I'm sure somehow you were still made to feel at fault! :hug: