Gilgo Beach 4 Only (GB4)

[FindHG]

Have been going through information online about the believed serial killer Neal Falls that was shot and killed by a supposed prostitute on July 18th 2015 that he met on back page. He was carrying 4 sets of hand cuffs. He was linked to deaths of six women in Chillicothe Ohio, 3 of the six were found dead in local waterways. Could this guy be LISK?

:welcome4:​

aes8827, thank you for joining Websleuths. I'll check to see if there is a thread that may have information on this very topic, as it seems to have come up in seems possible to some. I hope you stick around and keep asking questions and sharing your thoughts.

 

[docrocker]

I was a little nervous suggesting what I still believe about LISK leaving clues to direction of his business, home, or killing site.
Then last night, the FBI Profiler from Florida commented on the AC4 & suggested their faces being pointed East might suggest "the direction to his home".

This is what I've believed, but I've only been involved with this for about a week.

I was mistaken however; I told Rachel & Josh that I disagreed with the Florida SK. He said the killer is a Mission Killer because of his "cravings from his foot fetish". The problem with that assessment (all due respect to him) is that ALL SK's CRAVE to kill. Mission Killers kill for a specific purpose, such as to do God's work by ridding the world of "depraved prostitutes" (definition by SK's...not my def'n of prostitutes).
Therefore, I think the FBI profiler is very possibly correct. This might be a Mission Killer, but they're the same one. See below some items not mentioned that I discovered.

1) When I checked the longitudinal & latitudinal coordinates of the GB4 site & the drainage ditch behind the Golden Key Motel in (8030 Black Horse Pike; Pleasantville, NJ) just outside of Atlantic City, I was startled to find that these 2 locations have almost the exact Latitude! Only the longitudes are N and S of each other.

2) Since GB4 were north of AC4 killings, and using my theory of the numbers (both 4 victims, btw) of 500 divided by 4 which = 125 (125 degrees ESE), I began to look across the Atlantic to find islands that either suggest connections with these coordinates or an INTERSECTION OF 125 Degrees ESE & STRAIGHT EAST FROM AC4 Site (Golden Key Motel).

3) After being frustrated for hours, I finally discovered 2 islands that show promise.
a) Island in Portugal is directly EAST of Golden Key Motel. Exactly the same Latitude of +39.9
or +40 Latitude. The problem is that this island doesn't satisfy the assumption that both burial sites
gave their own directions.

4) There's another much closer island to the U.S. And its coordinates are +32.36 N -64.7671 W. These are the coordinates of the LF Wade International Airport at 3 Cahow Way on Bermuda Island.
My curiosity with Bermuda is that both sites, each with 4 bodies, each with indications of possible directions to the SK's home, business, or killing site, might be pointing to Bermuda in some fashion.

I can't figure out yet how to draw a line 125 degrees ESE from Gilgo Beach to see if it crosses Bermuda yet, but I'm studying, and I'll let you know.

Waiver: I don't think that Bermuda is the key (yet). I'm just gathering information.
Thanks!

 

[margarita25]

I was a little nervous suggesting what I still believe about LISK leaving clues to direction of his business, home, or killing site.
Then last night, the FBI Profiler from Florida commented on the AC4 & suggested their faces being pointed East might suggest "the direction to his home".

This is what I've believed, but I've only been involved with this for about a week.

I was mistaken however; I told Rachel & Josh that I disagreed with the Florida SK. He said the killer is a Mission Killer because of his "cravings from his foot fetish". The problem with that assessment (all due respect to him) is that ALL SK's CRAVE to kill. Mission Killers kill for a specific purpose, such as to do God's work by ridding the world of "depraved prostitutes" (definition by SK's...not my def'n of prostitutes).
Therefore, I think the FBI profiler is very possibly correct. This might be a Mission Killer, but they're the same one. See below some items not mentioned that I discovered.

1) When I checked the longitudinal & latitudinal coordinates of the GB4 site & the drainage ditch behind the Golden Key Motel in (8030 Black Horse Pike; Pleasantville, NJ) just outside of Atlantic City, I was startled to find that these 2 locations have almost the exact Latitude! Only the longitudes are N and S of each other.

2) Since GB4 were north of AC4 killings, and using my theory of the numbers (both 4 victims, btw) of 500 divided by 4 which = 125 (125 degrees ESE), I began to look across the Atlantic to find islands that either suggest connections with these coordinates or an INTERSECTION OF 125 Degrees ESE & STRAIGHT EAST FROM AC4 Site (Golden Key Motel).

3) After being frustrated for hours, I finally discovered 2 islands that show promise.
a) Island in Portugal is directly EAST of Golden Key Motel. Exactly the same Latitude of +39.9
or +40 Latitude. The problem is that this island doesn't satisfy the assumption that both burial sites
gave their own directions.

4) There's another much closer island to the U.S. And its coordinates are +32.36 N -64.7671 W. These are the coordinates of the LF Wade International Airport at 3 Cahow Way on Bermuda Island.
My curiosity with Bermuda is that both sites, each with 4 bodies, each with indications of possible directions to the SK's home, business, or killing site, might be pointing to Bermuda in some fashion.

I can't figure out yet how to draw a line 125 degrees ESE from Gilgo Beach to see if it crosses Bermuda yet, but I'm studying, and I'll let you know.

Waiver: I don't think that Bermuda is the key (yet). I'm just gathering information.
Thanks!

Hi docrocker,

This post might also be useful in geographic profiling thread, if you haven't posted this there, would like to take a look at it, tia.

Link: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?321840-Geographic-Profiling

 

[FindHG]

I was a little nervous suggesting what I still believe about LISK leaving clues to direction of his business, home, or killing site.
Then last night, the FBI Profiler from Florida commented on the AC4 & suggested their faces being pointed East might suggest "the direction to his home".

This is what I've believed, but I've only been involved with this for about a week.

I was mistaken however; I told Rachel & Josh that I disagreed with the Florida SK. He said the killer is a Mission Killer because of his "cravings from his foot fetish". The problem with that assessment (all due respect to him) is that ALL SK's CRAVE to kill. Mission Killers kill for a specific purpose, such as to do God's work by ridding the world of "depraved prostitutes" (definition by SK's...not my def'n of prostitutes).
Therefore, I think the FBI profiler is very possibly correct. This might be a Mission Killer, but they're the same one. See below some items not mentioned that I discovered.

1) When I checked the longitudinal & latitudinal coordinates of the GB4 site & the drainage ditch behind the Golden Key Motel in (8030 Black Horse Pike; Pleasantville, NJ) just outside of Atlantic City, I was startled to find that these 2 locations have almost the exact Latitude! Only the longitudes are N and S of each other.

2) Since GB4 were north of AC4 killings, and using my theory of the numbers (both 4 victims, btw) of 500 divided by 4 which = 125 (125 degrees ESE), I began to look across the Atlantic to find islands that either suggest connections with these coordinates or an INTERSECTION OF 125 Degrees ESE & STRAIGHT EAST FROM AC4 Site (Golden Key Motel).

3) After being frustrated for hours, I finally discovered 2 islands that show promise.
a) Island in Portugal is directly EAST of Golden Key Motel. Exactly the same Latitude of +39.9
or +40 Latitude. The problem is that this island doesn't satisfy the assumption that both burial sites
gave their own directions.

4) There's another much closer island to the U.S. And its coordinates are +32.36 N -64.7671 W. These are the coordinates of the LF Wade International Airport at 3 Cahow Way on Bermuda Island.
My curiosity with Bermuda is that both sites, each with 4 bodies, each with indications of possible directions to the SK's home, business, or killing site, might be pointing to Bermuda in some fashion.

I can't figure out yet how to draw a line 125 degrees ESE from Gilgo Beach to see if it crosses Bermuda yet, but I'm studying, and I'll let you know.

Waiver: I don't think that Bermuda is the key (yet). I'm just gathering information.
Thanks!

Bingo, magz, the view, where was he looking at this very specific layout! Great thinking, seems so plausible. Could his mission be territory, for where he spreads his brand of fear, in part?

 

[Ladylawyerbrittany]

New to the case..but I've read through this entire thread in effort to catch up.

Can someone point me to where the theory that the POI has RA? I see it mentioned here in passing but is it laid out in detail anywhere?

 

[FindHG]

:welcome6: Thank you for joining. I'm not familiar enough with the case to answer you question, apologies for that. Others may choose to answer who know, hopefully. I hope you keep participating.

New to the case..but I've read through this entire thread in effort to catch up.

Can someone point me to where the theory that the POI has RA? I see it mentioned here in passing but is it laid out in detail anywhere?

 

[FindHG]

Scale map, geo-imprinted by Seaslug44 12/14/11 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...s-***-NO-DISCUSSION-***&p=7437807#post7437807

and more images available on the thread

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...s-***-NO-DISCUSSION-***&p=7436899#post7436899

 

[FaviousM]

New to the case..but I've read through this entire thread in effort to catch up.

Can someone point me to where the theory that the POI has RA? I see it mentioned here in passing but is it laid out in detail anywhere?

Hard to keep up with all the acronyms on here... What's an RA?

 

[observation]

Hard to keep up with all the acronyms on here... What's an RA?

While I can't answer for the poster- I believe they may have been referring to rheumatoid arthritis. I have never seen that mentioned in anything I have read but I'm newer to this particular case.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Warriortime]

When the news first mentioned the burlap sacks back then. The first thing that came to mind was field day. I remember when I was young and in elementary school we had field day at the end of year and use to have sack races with burlap sacks. A lot of schools have plenty of them in the gym storage closets. That's one of the reasons I wondered if he worked in the school system. That and the dates of the gb4 were all summer months with the fourth one being Amber Lynn Costello on Sept 2. That date is very close to the start of most school years in NYS. School usually starts about a week or less after that in NYS. I know some people already thought about the whole school thing because of the dates. I'm just wondering if anyone else has thought about someone having easy access to burlap sacks through a school job. I went to school on Long Island and I know my elementary school kept a lot of those burlap sacks in the gym closet for field day.

 

[Salsa]

He is different than other serial killers who are of average looks and money. This one is well educated, smarter than others which is why there are very few leads, a surgeon, etc. He know the NY area, school, residence, and may either live there or lives elsewhere now and travels there private plane or other means. He is a womanizer who has two sides. He is extremely charming and nice. The one side is womanizer, loves women. The other, no one would believe, is a monster. He may be known to visit prostitutes. He uses prostitutes in two ways, sex and they live and other times they are not so lucky. His number may show up on bad date lists or bad reviews from Craigslist and Back pages. These are warnings of a bad dates for some and harassment for others in different states. He travels to many different areas when off work and may very well kill in many different areas. He may own a private pilot's license. If he was married, he is now divorced and single.

 

[twocuriouscats]

I was a little nervous suggesting what I still believe about LISK leaving clues to direction of his business, home, or killing site.
Then last night, the FBI Profiler from Florida commented on the AC4 & suggested their faces being pointed East might suggest "the direction to his home".

This is what I've believed, but I've only been involved with this for about a week.

I was mistaken however; I told Rachel & Josh that I disagreed with the Florida SK. He said the killer is a Mission Killer because of his "cravings from his foot fetish". The problem with that assessment (all due respect to him) is that ALL SK's CRAVE to kill. Mission Killers kill for a specific purpose, such as to do God's work by ridding the world of "depraved prostitutes" (definition by SK's...not my def'n of prostitutes).
Therefore, I think the FBI profiler is very possibly correct. This might be a Mission Killer, but they're the same one. See below some items not mentioned that I discovered.

1) When I checked the longitudinal & latitudinal coordinates of the GB4 site & the drainage ditch behind the Golden Key Motel in (8030 Black Horse Pike; Pleasantville, NJ) just outside of Atlantic City, I was startled to find that these 2 locations have almost the exact Latitude! Only the longitudes are N and S of each other.

2) Since GB4 were north of AC4 killings, and using my theory of the numbers (both 4 victims, btw) of 500 divided by 4 which = 125 (125 degrees ESE), I began to look across the Atlantic to find islands that either suggest connections with these coordinates or an INTERSECTION OF 125 Degrees ESE & STRAIGHT EAST FROM AC4 Site (Golden Key Motel).

3) After being frustrated for hours, I finally discovered 2 islands that show promise.
a) Island in Portugal is directly EAST of Golden Key Motel. Exactly the same Latitude of +39.9
or +40 Latitude. The problem is that this island doesn't satisfy the assumption that both burial sites
gave their own directions
4) There's another much closer island to the U.S. And its coordinates are +32.36 N -64.7671 W. These are the coordinates of the LF Wade International Airport at 3 Cahow Way on Bermuda Island.
My curiosity with Bermuda is that both sites, each with 4 bodies, each with indications of possible directions to the SK's home, business, or killing site, might be pointing to Bermuda in some fashio

I can't figure out yet how to draw a line 125 degrees ESE from Gilgo Beach to see if it crosses Bermuda yet, but I'm studying, and I'll let you know.

Waiver: I don't think that Bermuda is the key (yet). I'm just gathering information.
Thanks!

Thank you for investigating the GPS coordinates! Really happy you are here working with us.

 

[twocuriouscats]

Hard to keep up with all the acronyms on here... What's an RA?

Welcome! I'm not sure what that poster was referring too - but I have been explaining (in parenthesis) when I use an abbreviation to help you guys; ex: If I say IIRC, I will add (If I recall correctly) to my post. Hopefully other old-timers will do the same until we can put together a sticky for you all. I plan on doing it, but so busy this week...glad you asked!

 

[MrsWard84]

My theory is the LIsk is dead. He hasn't done any killing in a very long time. Why isn't anyone talking about this?

I'm very new to the case and this site but have been reading through past comments and threads to try and gain as much information as I can. Could it be that if LISK seems to be a well-educated man with money to travel he could simply have found new grounds to 'hunt' and 'dump the bodies'? Given the times between the GB4 victims disappearing and their bodies being discovered, could other cases in other areas simply not have been linked yet? Would LISK suddenly stop killing or would he find a new ground to get rid of victims given the placement of the bodies shown on the google map in regard to the trench lines - one body in each 'strip' of land? Sorry if this seems like a silly comment, I'm new to the case and trying to go through all information that has been posted.

 

[ps149]

Amazing how confirmation bias works, eh? That is, people require patterns to fit their particular theories. In this case, the media created that pattern, with help from LE, no doubt. In any event, I pointed out the 500M myth back in May.

Attaching SCDA pic again. Exact distances are across the bottom.

Eta ~ here are the exact breakouts, in meters

Distances:

Costello & Barthelemy: 0.16 mi = 257.495 m
Barthelemy & Barnes: 0.05 mi = 80.4672 m
Barnes & Waterman: 0.07 mi = 112.654 m
Waterman & John Doe: 0.28 mi = 450.616 m
John Doe & JT: 0.62 mi = 997.793 m
JT & Jane Doe 6: 1.43 mi = 2301.361 m
Jane Doe 6 & Baby Doe: 0.04 mi = 64.3737 m

The above is why I think LE put out the 500m myth.

How did all of this precise information get lost and why are True Crime shows and reporters still inaccurately telling the public that all four of the GB4 were placed 500 feet apart?

 

[FaviousM]

How did all of this precise information get lost and why are True Crime shows and reporters still inaccurately telling the public that all four of the GB4 were placed 500 feet apart?

BBM

I think for pretty much the reason shadowraiths said, the pattern makes it more likely to be one killer, one killer makes the whole scenario a better story so the media runs with it

 

[mcjimick]

This is slack but I am juggling work and just right now DO NOT HAVE the time to ask whether the following has been considered.... I wanted others to be made aware and
so it can be discarded. If it is any help I am a former policeman in Australia (in my early years after finishing a business degree) left and did psychology and sociology at uni and do not work in that field. I was rumenating on the phone stuff with the GB4 and also been thinking that this guy would surely have been with other women. It would not be unfair to think that he had slept with other workers that were not killed. Starting in June of 2007 under the assumption that the common denominator being burlap among other things, and that this is where his killing began or shifted from another place to begin {and in this instance isolate from the other cases}- it would not be hard to want to consider how the cell phone issue occurred and became a common factor. Reflecting back on the possibility that he slept or associated with other sex workers - I tried to peel back some of the things that would allow this to happen. Being trustful of someone, (and let's assume money was involved - and sex workers are street smart which most of the time they are) comes from a place of trust(forget the desperation that drug abuse brings and consider to what limit do women that ALWAYS take their phones - not do so). This guy may have had several dates with victims and non victims alike. Some men do genuinely just want to chat out of loneliness. If a man can gain the trust of a street smart woman - what would he have to do - who would he have to be so they would let their guard down. Most people expect an immediate noticeable monster and (again not knowing what the police did and didn't investigate in this period regarding the phones and what specifics were indeed noted) many women could have slept or talked with someone who "on the outside" appeared an extremely nice or lonely or sad guy. Because of the stigma of sex workers, the issue is having access to those same sex workers from back at the time and try and detail any anomalies with their clients. And the first place I would be heading would be " did you have any real nice guys you met in that period" - follow the track of this person willing to spend enough time to make these women trust him. Softness, sadness, and even not requesting sex all endear people if it appears genuine on several occasions (if the client is also generous with his money and doesn't make it too much of an issue of it, combined with the abovementioned} there may be ample legitimacy in why these mobiles came into play the way they did. If this is the case, detectives have lost surely a large amount of sex workers that they could have followed up with queries with and are no longer alive. He sounds calculating and mechanical so grooming is not to be discarded and the key is I am sure many women slept with him (or chatted for money) that do not even know he was gauging their suitability. July 2007, July 2009, June 2010, Sept 2010, just mathematically looks wrong. He either left town, was incarcerated, had family commitments or he killed in between and these bodies were not found - it does however, lend itself to a grooming process where I find the shift of the disappearances of the 3rd and 4th girl relatively close to each other and yet the last falls outside of his normal abduction period. Of equal note is that the 3rd and 4th girls disappeared 5 and 3 months before these bodies were found. If this guy is calculating, he either took pleasure in the ritual like a heroin user enjoys the ritual of fixing up before injection, I think he is playing games. I do not necessarily concur that any of the other killings on long island are related to this, but I do believe he has killed and placed bodies in several fashions where he keeps collections. The number four may be coincedental. It may be because the four had something in common or said something different or made him react a different way, and any other bodies that are lying elsewhere as a part of a collection would have particular traits to other victims which puts them aside to another collection. If the girls hadn't been found in Dec 2010, I am sure that more would be there because he would continually be wanting to add to this particular collection. The disconcerting thing is as a collector there may well be several pots of collectables all around the United States. Looking at all Craigslist communications would help with extended insight but not all data is kept for extended periods. There is a link there but as stated - it goes back to the first girl that went missing of the four that were found and it is only speculation that it was his first and as mentioned by a forensic psychologist he would have been learning if it was, and at the point where he was most likely to make a mistake. My greatest concern obviously is it wasn't his first, and as such may have had the art and his technique developed by this point in time. We cannot underestimate the periods of time people will drag things out for the extended enjoyment. If this has been discussed I truly apologise for the laziness.

 

[bessie]

Hard to keep up with all the acronyms on here... What's an RA?

Welcome! I'm not sure what that poster was referring too - but I have been explaining (in parenthesis) when I use an abbreviation to help you guys; ex: If I say IIRC, I will add (If I recall correctly) to my post. Hopefully other old-timers will do the same until we can put together a sticky for you all. I plan on doing it, but so busy this week...glad you asked!

Websleuths Lingo:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=276298

 

[observation]

Any chance we could have a "hub" spot just for general questions and comments? I know we already have so many..just a thought.
My questions-
Will there be another podcast with J&R to discuss this past weekends episodes? Not completely related to LISK but Neal Falls Caught my attention. Yes, he pulled a gun on that poor woman in WV but his approach to her was not familiar to him (her house). Luring them into his car- different method..
Neal Falls comes to mind when I consider Jessica Taylor.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[bessie]

There will be another radio show tomorrow evening. As for a "hub spot", you're correct. We have so many threads already. You just have to seek out the ones that suit your questions.